'Liberal'

[saysmydoctor]

How has being 'liberal' in the US become so pejorative in a lot of ways? Why has the US completely shunned liberalism in all forms, whether it be the extremes or the more moderates forms?

[The Personist]

Because people associate "liberal" with "radical" due to some nice media manipulation. And there are one or two people who pop up who FIT that "liberal = radical" archetype, and they're the ones who get the most attention.

[QuikTrig]

didn't we just elect a liberal president?

[ShShShark]

Wait, are you joking? I'm serious. are you being sarcastic or do you actually truly believe this. and if so, do you possibly live in ANY of the major cities in the US?

[J.C.]

The Republicans did a great job demonizing the term, particularly during the Reagan era. They tied negative connotations to the word( like tax and spend) and pretty much bullied the Democratic party, which was doing nothing except nominating pussy candidates throughout the 70s and 80s. Their inability to combat the things being hurled at them allowed the criticisms to stick. This stuff goes in cycles though. Most of the current younger generation is just as turned off by the word conservative.

[J.C.]

didn't we just elect a liberal president?

You pretty much have to run from the word liberal to get elected President as the country stands right now. The Democrats don't get to embrace the term liberal like the Republicans embrace the word conservative. Not on a national scale at least.

[The Personist]

The Republicans did a great job demonizing the term, particularly during the Reagan era. They tied negative connotations to the word( like tax and spend) and pretty much bullied the Democratic party, which was doing nothing except nominating pussy candidates throughout the 70s and 80s. Their inability to combat the things being hurled at them allowed the criticisms to stick. This stuff goes in cycles though. Most of the current younger generation is just as turned off by the word conservative.

I feel like both parties are already working on new buzz words. Conservative is morphing into "traditional," and "liberal" is "progressive."

Or something like that. They're trying to update their lexicons.

[Adeniz19]

Bill Mahr had a nice little bit about this, this weekend.

[derekmoyer4]

Because people associate "liberal" with "radical" due to some nice media manipulation. And there are one or two people who pop up who FIT that "liberal = radical" archetype, and they're the ones who get the most attention.
you are very right in your assessment. but the political ideology spectrum runs as follows (going left to right):

radical, liberal, moderate, conservative, reactionary

[ShShShark]

The Republicans did a great job demonizing the term, particularly during the Reagan era. They tied negative connotations to the word( like tax and spend) and pretty much bullied the Democratic party, which was doing nothing except nominating pussy candidates throughout the 70s and 80s. Their inability to combat the things being hurled at them allowed the criticisms to stick. This stuff goes in cycles though. Most of the current younger generation is just as turned off by the word conservative.

that works both ways dude. aka 90% of the posts on this site alone that absolutely bash any inkling of conservatisim.

but i absolutely agree with you about our generation. for every 1 conservative i know there are probably about 10 liberals.

[derekmoyer4]

I feel like both parties are already working on new buzz words. Conservative is morphing into "traditional," and "liberal" is "progressive."

Or something like that. They're trying to update their lexicons.
you are so right. they only do this because they can push through their various agendas without the stigma of "liberal" or "conservative"

[The Personist]

you are very right in your assessment. but the political ideology spectrum runs as follows (going left to right):

radical, liberal, moderate, conservative, reactionary

Liberals and conservatives accuse one another of being radical and reactionary, respectively. However, "radical" has far more emotional weight with the populace than "reactionary," which is a shame.

[J.C.]

that works both ways dude. aka 90% of the posts on this site alone that absolutely bash any inkling of conservatisim.

I didn't blame conservatives for what they did to the word liberal. They were effective at what they did. I just explained why things are the way they are currently.

[saysmydoctor]

didn't we just elect a liberal president?
No, we didn't.
Wait, are you joking? I'm serious. are you being sarcastic or do you actually truly believe this. and if so, do you possibly live in ANY of the major cities in the US?
Just because people are liberal doesn't mean that being liberal doesn't have negative connotations. So yes, if by asking my original question, which was why these connotations exist, I was being serious.

[ShShShark]

you are very right in your assessment. but the political ideology spectrum runs as follows (going left to right):

radical, liberal, moderate, conservative, reactionary

i am blown away that anyone can possibly think this after the progress that liberals have made in the last few months alone. and i would say that the vast majority of americans are extremely happy with that progress.

also, people consider liberal to mean democrat and conservative to be republican. radical is the extreme of both of those sides.

Edit: I would also say that the majority of americans are stoked about the things to come.

[derekmoyer4]

Liberals and conservatives accuse one another of being radical and reactionary, respectively. However, "radical" has far more emotional weight with the populace than "reactionary," which is a shame.
yes it does. and that is because people know what radical means and not reactionary (when not used in political terms). and it really is a shame.

[derekmoyer4]

i am blown away that anyone can possibly think this after the progress that liberals have made in the last few months alone. and i would say that the vast majority of americans are extremely happy with that progress.

also, people consider liberal to mean democrat and conservative to be republican. radical is the extreme of both of those sides.

Edit: I would also say that the majority of americans are stoked about the things to come.
technically speaking. radicals are different than liberals. and it is actually incorrect to say anyone of the far right is radical. the correct term, as defined, is reactionary. and these are facts.

[ShShShark]

no you're right. that wasn't necessarily what i was trying to get at, but you are right.

[QuikTrig]

You pretty much have to run from the word liberal to get elected President as the country stands right now. The Democrats don't get to embrace the term liberal like the Republicans embrace the word conservative. Not on a national scale at least.

i could agree with that to an extent. things are changing fast though.

i just though the original post was a little too exaggerated.

[derekmoyer4]

i am blown away that anyone can possibly think this after the progress that liberals have made in the last few months alone. and i would say that the vast majority of americans are extremely happy with that progress.

also, people consider liberal to mean democrat and conservative to be republican. radical is the extreme of both of those sides.

Edit: I would also say that the majority of americans are stoked about the things to come.
i think you are right in this assessment.

[saysmydoctor]

I think the original post is spot on. :shrug:

[The Personist]

But he's right. I've seen so many ridiculous political ads using "liberal" as a slanderous, scandalous, or vilifying term, whereas "conservative" doesn't have that kind of negative clout.

EDIT: He being Sean.

[derekmoyer4]

But he's right. I've seen so many ridiculous political ads using "liberal" as a slanderous, scandalous, or vilifying term, whereas "conservative" doesn't have that kind of negative clout.

EDIT: He being Sean.
that is all too true. and it is sad.

[saysmydoctor]

Obama was called a socialist, a liberal on the campaign true (aside from the fact that those aren't good things to describe him as). They were used because they had negative connotations to them.

In Europe, being a liberal is not construed as bad. People embrace their being a liberal.

[ShShShark]

But he's right. I've seen so many ridiculous political ads using "liberal" as a slanderous, scandalous, or vilifying term, whereas "conservative" doesn't have that kind of negative clout.

EDIT: He being Sean.

Yeah if you watch either Fox news or listen to hannity's radio station........that's probably about it....

[The Personist]

Obama was called a socialist, a liberal on the campaign true (aside from the fact that those aren't good things to describe him as). They were used because they had negative connotations to them.

In Europe, being a liberal is not construed as bad. People embrace their being a liberal.

It has dramatically different connotations, connotations which, I think, are more true to the actual definition.

[saysmydoctor]

Yeah if you watch either Fox news or listen to hannity's radio station........that's probably about it....
Or any of the Republicans on the Hill.

[batmannj]

I don't think the US has shunned liberalism at all. I guess it is just where you are coming from.

[saysmydoctor]

People construing Obama as a liberal need to stop. He isn't. He is a centrist.

[The Personist]

Yeah if you watch either Fox news or listen to hannity's radio station........that's probably about it....

Not true. The word "liberal" has negative connotations more universally than that. Like I said, I've seen plenty of ads on channels that aren't that conservative at all that use liberal as a dirty word. The problem is what someone earlier said: that the Republicans in the 80's shit all over it and the Democrats had nothing to respond with.

[derekmoyer4]

Obama was called a socialist, a liberal on the campaign true (aside from the fact that those aren't good things to describe him as). They were used because they had negative connotations to them.

In Europe, being a liberal is not construed as bad. People embrace their being a liberal.
very true. i have a bunch of conservatives where i live. and i had a couple who are so far on the right i think they are lost. but they were trying to make the audacious claim that obama was a socialist. this pissed me off so much i wrote them an eight page paper explaining why they were wrong.

[The Personist]

I am a socialist. Obama is not a socialist.

[WarpSpeedChewy]

People construing Obama as a liberal need to stop. He isn't. He is a centrist.
I just consider him to be left of center. Let time tell wither he's considered liberal in terms of being president.

I'm fine with being Liberal. I don't mind at all that title, but sometimes we are far too consumed with labels. It's not always a fair placement.

[QuikTrig]

Obama was called a socialist, a liberal on the campaign true (aside from the fact that those aren't good things to describe him as). They were used because they had negative connotations to them.

In Europe, being a liberal is not construed as bad. People embrace their being a liberal.

i think we may be biased from our areas. i'm from san francisco, so if anything, conservatism has a really bad connotation.

maybe your area is basically the exact opposite?

either way, i think the term liberal is garnering more respect, especially within this past political cycle. if it were 4 years ago, I'd agree with your original post 100%.

[ShShShark]

Right now the word "conservative" will get you shit on. Not to try to defend them but i really think that this is a completely unfair thread.

[The Personist]

Right now the word "conservative" will get you shit on. Not to try to defend them but i really think that this is a completely unfair thread.

Not really. Conservatives use that term as a rallying cry. Liberals do not use "liberal" as a rallying cry.

[Adeniz19]

DtUAHPYYzeM

[saysmydoctor]

i think we may be biased from our areas. i'm from san francisco, so if anything, conservatism has a really bad connotation.

maybe your area is basically the exact opposite?

either way, i think the term liberal is garnering more respect, especially within this past political cycle. if it were 4 years ago, I'd agree with your original post 100%.
I'm from New York. Even now 'liberal' has negative connotations to it. Sure, we've made step forwards. I still get called unamerican by the punditry (who are the voices of conservatism, like it or not) for more views.
Right now the word "conservative" will get you shit on. Not to try to defend them but i really think that this is a completely unfair thread.
Romney used his being a social conservative to rally his base. McCain embraced conservative values. Palin was a choice specifically used to garner the conservative base.

[saysmydoctor]

DtUAHPYYzeM
Holy shit :lol: @ the beauty pageant joke.

[oncedarkness]

Right now the word "conservative" will get you shit on. Not to try to defend them but i really think that this is a completely unfair thread.
I would agree with this. I think that both "liberal" and "conservative" have negative connotations that are unwarranted because of some radical members in each camp.

[saysmydoctor]

I've never given Bill Maher a view before, but holy shit, he is entertaining and articulate and interesting and 100% correct. I'll be watching him more often.

[ShShShark]

I'm from New York. Even now 'liberal' has negative connotations to it. Sure, we've made step forwards. I still get called unamerican by the punditry (who are the voices of conservatism, like it or not) for more views.

Romney used his being a social conservative to rally his base. McCain embraced conservative values. Palin was a choice specifically used to garner the conservative base.

you wouldn't say that democrats consider themselves liberal? doesn't seem to make much sense. liberal = democrat, conservative = republican.

what is happening now is a complete 180 of what happened in the 80s. i think if you look back on this thread 4 years from now you will have a much much much different opinion.

[saysmydoctor]

No, most democrats are not liberal.

[ShShShark]

No, most democrats are not liberal.

what would you call it then?

[ShShShark]

for the record, I don't see being called Liberal as a bad thing at all. nor do i see being called conservative.

Edit: which is why i'm now wondering why i'm even arguing my point at all

[x togepi x]

I don't think liberal is a bad word nowadays but it has morphed into "conservative-lite" here in the states.

[jwicklun]

I've never given Bill Maher a view before, but holy shit, he is entertaining and articulate and interesting and 100% correct. I'll be watching him more often.
he sounds like an asshole but he's dead on when it comes to these topics. i don't think its bad being liberal, but many of the extreme conservatives try to overexaggerate the term to being a communist, baby-killer, hippy. I mean there are wacked out liberals in this world, but the real connotation is to be progressive, more rennaissance. dunno, generation by generation the term is becoming less of a taboo. Dunno, I blame the 80s of what conservatism has warped us today, looking back at a past that is completely different from the present.

[Takk...Ros]

I don't think liberal is a bad word nowadays but it has morphed into "conservative-lite" here in the states.
Yeah, that's essentially what the democrats have become.
And what exactly does reactionary mean? I've never heard that term before.

[Praetor]

Re: Obama

I would consider him right of the world's center but center-left on the American spectrum.

[Praetor]

I wish I got HBO so I could watch Maher regularly. Just watched the video...had some great points about the bullshit about the liberal party being too liberal.

[saysmydoctor]

what would you call it then?
Centrists.

[Praetor]

Or any of the Republicans on the Hill.
Or even Democrats. In this country, "conservative" is a selling point and "liberal" is a slanderous scare tactic.

[ArmedROBery]

I never really understood this either. Thanks for somewhat clearing it up.

The worst is when you watch a semi-political youtube video and look at the comments. Over 90% are just fucking imbeciles shouting "you filthy liberals! you're in bed with that socialist Obama! blah blah blah". It's so depressing that it's used as an insult and not a descriptor anymore.

[x togepi x]

Yeah, that's essentially what the democrats have become.
And what exactly does reactionary mean? I've never heard that term before.

it kind of means "opposed to change". as in, say there's a political change, a reactionary would be pushing politics in reaction to said change to make a society back the way it used to be.

[Takk...Ros]

it kind of means "opposed to change". as in, say there's a political change, a reactionary would be pushing politics in reaction to said change to make a society back the way it used to be.
Okay, thank you!

[Mercy Medical]

Bill Mahr had a nice little bit about this, this weekend.
I love that man.

[jwicklun]

the problem is that the term "socialist" is used as a scare tactic of equalling "communist." And by using those terms they can warp the term liberal, as being some part of being a sociopath as well as a nazi.

[Machu505]

His name was Ronald Reagan.

[GuitarR0cker1]

The Democrats haven't been led by liberals since the 80's. Clinton is a great example of how the Democrats are not liberal in any way and probably will never be unless some miracle happens during the next 4 years.

[whataclush]

those fawkin librals are takeing ovar our CunT tree Murka!!!!!

[GeeBee]

he sounds like an asshole but he's dead on when it comes to these topics. i don't think its bad being liberal, but many of the extreme conservatives try to overexaggerate the term to being a communist, baby-killer, hippy. I mean there are wacked out liberals in this world, but the real connotation is to be progressive, more rennaissance. dunno, generation by generation the term is becoming less of a taboo. Dunno, I blame the 80s of what conservatism has warped us today, looking back at a past that is completely different from the present.

Sometimes you have to be an asshole to get your point across. And his points are mostly spot on.

[RyanBass80]

Because the Left took over liberalism. Read the history of the left: Mao, Lenin, Stalin, Marx. Those ideologies took over Liberalism. Liberalism looked a lot different 50 years ago than it does today. Most of you won't want to dig up the past though

[Mercy Medical]

The Democrats haven't been led by liberals since the 80's. Clinton is a great example of how the Democrats are not liberal in any way and probably will never be unless some miracle happens during the next 4 years.
Well, the funny thing is neither of the parties exemplify their original ideas anymore. It's honestly a bit of a joke to call either of them conservatives or liberals anymore.

[deanster321]

Obama would barely register as left-of-centre here. It amazed me during the election how many people seemed to think he was a really ardent liberal/leftist, and therefore a commie/pinko/whatever.

[CrisAgri]

I think the terms are pretty relative, to be honest. People use blanket statements like "conservative" and "liberal" to demonize their opponents and create an "us vs. them" mentality.

[CrisAgri]

Obama would barely register as left-of-centre here. It amazed me during the election how many people seemed to think he was a really ardent liberal/leftist, and therefore a commie/pinko/whatever.

You're right. He isn't particularly progressive at all. The fact that he continues to uphold "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" should say enough.