Religious Door To Door People

[SanePsychotic]

Has anyone had people come to your door and try to talk to you about some religion?

Today two guys came to my house and talked to me about the book of Mormon. I didn't want to be rude, so I just listened to them talk for about five minutes. And now they want to get me a free Book of Mormon. It was interesting, to say the least.

[ted is lying]

Sometime last year a bunch of bald black guys with gems on there forehead tried to convert me to some cult. I pretty sure it was a cult cause it was called the cult of the gem.

[SanePsychotic]

Seriously?

[Hamlet]

Seriously?

I wouldn't be surprised.

But yes, we've had a few Mormon couples knock on our door over the years. If you're not interested, best way to deal with them is to say "Sorry, not interested" and then close the door. If you start a conversation they can become more insistent, since they're already established rapport with you.

[Manicapathy]

Has anyone had people come to your door and try to talk to you about some religion?

Today two guys came to my house and talked to me about the book of Mormon. I didn't want to be rude, so I just listened to them talk for about five minutes. And now they want to get me a free Book of Mormon. It was interesting, to say the least.
The exact reason I keep a clean charles manson t-shirt next to my door. Quick change, open the door, and laugh at the reactions.

[SanePsychotic]

I wouldn't be surprised.

But yes, we've had a few Mormon couples knock on our door over the years. If you're not interested, best way to deal with them is to say "Sorry, not interested" and then close the door. If you start a conversation they can become more insistent, since they're already established rapport with you.

Yeah, I know but I hate being rude. So I guess if they come back (which I hope they won't and don't think they will) I'll just be like "Sorry, bye" or something. But I thought the whole thing was kind of amusing.

The exact reason I keep a clean charles manson t-shirt next to my door. Quick change, open the door, and laugh at the reactions.

Ha ha, nice. I was wearing my psych ward shirt, but I don't think they noticed.

[TotalCollapse]

Those people are so annoying. I pretend that I'm not home.

[kdefrisc]

Also, if you tell them you're Jewish they will leave you alone.

My grandpa was Irish Catholic and he used to love to invite the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses in and argue with them about why they should be Catholic until they would leave lol

[golferpunk1]

Has anyone had people come to your door and try to talk to you about some religion?

Today two guys came to my house and talked to me about the book of Mormon. I didn't want to be rude, so I just listened to them talk for about five minutes. And now they want to get me a free Book of Mormon. It was interesting, to say the least.

I can tell you as a member of the LDS church and a former missionary who did exactly this that it is appreciated that you're not rude. All they wanted to do was share something that is important to them with you. If you're not interested then great.

I wouldn't be surprised.

But yes, we've had a few Mormon couples knock on our door over the years. If you're not interested, best way to deal with them is to say "Sorry, not interested" and then close the door. If you start a conversation they can become more insistent, since they're already established rapport with you.

The exact reason I keep a clean charles manson t-shirt next to my door. Quick change, open the door, and laugh at the reactions.

The fact that you would rather associate yourself with charles manson than any sort of religion is a little ridiculous.

Those people are so annoying. I pretend that I'm not home.

What is the state of the world when a mere knock at the door to have a conversation is deemed as "annoying." They aren't asking anything from you other than a few minutes to talk. You'd be surprised what you can learn if you stop and actually talk with people face to face.

[thebestkylever]

i was one of these dudes for halloween last year. great last second costume.

[BrennanHickson]

Whenever Jehovah's Witnesses knock, we just ask if they want to talk about it over a few drinks and they leave.

[AlkalineAshes]

The fact that you would rather associate yourself with charles manson than any sort of religion is a little ridiculous.
[/quote]

ehh, helter-skelter sounds about as plausible as mormon or jevhova witnesses beliefs, and he killed much less than some religous fanatics would like to do so ya, both are pretty much crazy..

[Dymytry Vance]

I'm atheist. I believe that this religion shit is shit. I cannot make myself believe in an afterlife that involves you not living your first life to the fullest, nor do I believe in half the shit any religion says. So now you know my standpoint on it.


Last year one of these really rude, passive-aggressive Scientologists (CULT) was trying to give me a free "Holy Book" (sci-fi novel written by a psychopath and was taken way too seriously by druggies) called Dianetics. I laughed and told him that if we're alien spirits that have been deposited in a volcano by some alien with fighter planes and is named Lord Xenu then I hasve Prince William and Garry Glitter having anal in my living room while wearing nazi perophenilia or some shit like that. They were persistent so I followed one of the really annoying ones door to door and as they were talking I yelled, "Nothing Happens When you Die..." or, "Don't Let Them In, They Will Steal Your Food And Throw Anthrax At You." They started threatening to sue me for harrassment, so I screamed "I need an adult" and ran like Hell. I think they left after that.

[Dymytry Vance]

I can tell you as a member of the LDS church and a former missionary who did exactly this that it is appreciated that you're not rude. All they wanted to do was share something that is important to them with you. If you're not interested then great.





The fact that you would rather associate yourself with charles manson than any sort of religion is a little ridiculous.



What is the state of the world when a mere knock at the door to have a conversation is deemed as "annoying." They aren't asking anything from you other than a few minutes to talk. You'd be surprised what you can learn if you stop and actually talk with people face to face.
If I was honestly looking to find a religion that suited me, I don't think I'm going to call the leaders of a bunch of different religions to send missionaries to stand at my door and converse with me about some guy who read the Bible out of some hat, or some guy who believes that we all must sacrifice ourselves to relive oast experiences through the eyes of another's soul (yes, there is a religion for that.) What I would do however, is search around for religions that fit me. I would visit churches and make a decision based on what suits me best. However, if I am not doing any of these things, I am most likely fine with where I stand now. Where I live there are a bunch of people who find it necessary to let us know every Sunday that God is watching. Each week we tell them that we're not interested. It's a sneaky form of harrassment, and therefore it's ridiculous and ludicrous to not understand why people are annoyed by such methods of spreading the word of their religion. You want to advertise, put it on a billboard, a website, promote yourself. I'd much rather sit here and look at an ad for the Mormon religion then have you interrupt my life spreading the same message.

[Dymytry Vance]

Sometime last year a bunch of bald black guys with gems on there forehead tried to convert me to some cult. I pretty sure it was a cult cause it was called the cult of the gem.
That happened to me last month. It was just my friend and I so we let them in for a couple of lulz. The most ridiculous cult ever. They believe that God manifested himself inside all gems because he felt that the world was becoming sinful and he was afraid to watch. So one night he cried and burst into a billion fucking pieces and now to show our appreciation for him we buy gems subconsciously to show our faith that one day he will return and guide us.... Did I mention that he sneaks around at night when we sleep to make sure our brain's artificial hardware (the stuff that keeps us buying these gems) runs properly. This must have been a ploy to stimulate the economy, but honesltyy, I'm afraid to buy a gem now in fear that this God is real.

[DRUMMERGIRL121]

I've had Mormons try to preach to me. I've also been stopped in the street by Seventh Day Adventists. I just tell them I'm not interested.
No big deal.

[golferpunk1]

If I was honestly looking to find a religion that suited me, I don't think I'm going to call the leaders of a bunch of different religions to send missionaries to stand at my door and converse with me about some guy who read the Bible out of some hat, or some guy who believes that we all must sacrifice ourselves to relive oast experiences through the eyes of another's soul (yes, there is a religion for that.) What I would do however, is search around for religions that fit me. I would visit churches and make a decision based on what suits me best. However, if I am not doing any of these things, I am most likely fine with where I stand now. Where I live there are a bunch of people who find it necessary to let us know every Sunday that God is watching. Each week we tell them that we're not interested. It's a sneaky form of harrassment, and therefore it's ridiculous and ludicrous to not understand why people are annoyed by such methods of spreading the word of their religion. You want to advertise, put it on a billboard, a website, promote yourself. I'd much rather sit here and look at an ad for the Mormon religion then have you interrupt my life spreading the same message.

Since when is knocking on the door and trying to have a conversation "a sneaky form of harassment?" I understand that its the world that we live in where people would much rather get their human interaction through internet activity but a face to face encounter is much more productive regardless if you agree or not. It is obvious from your response that you have absolutely no understanding of the religions you are bashing and a lot could be gained if you actually talked to someone about it and found out what exactly the reasons they have for knocking on your door. You seem like smart person, especially for only being 15, but it's not cool to bash other people's beliefs. No one is asking you to agree but at least respect other people. I also completely understand that some "religious" people can be very condescending and judgmental but all ya can do is be the bigger person. Personally, I like to understand where people are coming from so I can respect them for what they are doing.

[_Sumeet_]

"Are you selling religion? Sorry, I bought some Islam yesterday."

[queenofcrouton]

Some people came to my door a few weeks ago and I simply told them I don't believe in god. They persisted. I opted not to be more abrasive and told them I wasn't interested.

[oh_heykate.]

So glad I don't get these people at my door, I'd blow my top. Let me find that crap by myself, don't bring it to my welcome mat. That's how it should be.

[ted is lying]

That happened to me last month. It was just my friend and I so we let them in for a couple of lulz. The most ridiculous cult ever. They believe that God manifested himself inside all gems because he felt that the world was becoming sinful and he was afraid to watch. So one night he cried and burst into a billion fucking pieces and now to show our appreciation for him we buy gems subconsciously to show our faith that one day he will return and guide us.... Did I mention that he sneaks around at night when we sleep to make sure our brain's artificial hardware (the stuff that keeps us buying these gems) runs properly. This must have been a ploy to stimulate the economy, but honesltyy, I'm afraid to buy a gem now in fear that this God is real.
They left this part out.

[phil19]

around where i live we used to get these lil old ladies come round preaching to us. i just pretended i wasnt home

[bostonryan]

I can't stand religious people so I tend to yell at them and tell them to get the fuck off my property. If it isn't mail, UPS, or an invited guest they need to stay the fuck away from my door

[bostonryan]

So glad I don't get these people at my door, I'd blow my top. Let me find that crap by myself, don't bring it to my welcome mat. That's how it should be.


Haha I am living in Port Huron at the moment and we get these annoying religious fools. You're lucky you don't get them. I can't stand Witnesses or Mormons

[shimmyshakes]

Yeah, we get Jehovah Witnesses occasionally. We just don't open the door.

[TeamAllison]

Also, if you tell them you're Jewish they will leave you alone.

My grandpa was Irish Catholic and he used to love to invite the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses in and argue with them about why they should be Catholic until they would leave lol

My grandpa would get the opposite effect of that. He was retired and like most old people, fucking loved the company. He would let them in once a week and they would just have hour long conversations about their respective religions, it was cool.

[kdefrisc]

My grandpa would get the opposite effect of that. He was retired and like most old people, fucking loved the company. He would let them in once a week and they would just have hour long conversations about their respective religions, it was cool.

Aww. Thats really cool and also a little sad. Sounds like he was lonely

[cuzimlefthanded]

What is the state of the world when a mere knock at the door to have a conversation is deemed as "annoying." They aren't asking anything from you other than a few minutes to talk. You'd be surprised what you can learn if you stop and actually talk with people face to face.

It's not a conversation-it's an imposition. Conversations are two sided. The door-to-door religious people that I have encountered aren't there to discuss or consider my convictions-they're there to tell me how to live and believe. It's the whole notion of someone imposing their beliefs that's annoying.

[cuzimlefthanded]

My grandpa would get the opposite effect of that. He was retired and like most old people, fucking loved the company. He would let them in once a week and they would just have hour long conversations about their respective religions, it was cool.

Haha that's awsome.


And is the person in your avatar Andrew McMahon?

[Hannah_]

Since when is knocking on the door and trying to have a conversation "a sneaky form of harassment?".

But like going door to door trying to convince people and force some bullshit religeon down their throats is intruding, In my opinion.

When I was in newyork city earlier on this year, these people were handing out these flyers about some free show. Turned out it was a show about scientology. It's all about money, the more members of these ridic cults.

I personally hate religeon, I respect though that it brings a lot of people peace, especially old people here in Ireland.
The church in Ireland was so fucked up years ago.
The church pretty much ran the country. Had institues for boys who were slightly missed behaved and going there only got themselves raped and abused by priests. Which was all turned a blind eye only till recently when the dirty fuckers got called out. There was also institues run by nuns where girls got sent if they fell pregent while not being married.

[Reaver]

Jehovas Witnesses are pretty common over here, everyone hates them, they still come. unfortunately, my mom used to let them in and talk to them for an hour every sunday. another reason, why i don't like my mom.

and a few months ago, 2 nice old ladies knocked at my door and wanted to talk about god. they really mastered asking annoying questions, even when i already said no 5 times.

[Jaimehere]

i fucking hate it when this happens, they even preach their said religions in Public Transportation, annoys the fuck outta me >.<

[brokenwings]

i'm kinda hoping jehovah's witnesses or mormons will visit me one day, so i can argue with them until they run away crying

[wuduprod]

just tell them that you believe that god is chillin' up in the clouds with bigfoot and the keebler elves. just kidding.
not really.

[-whisp-]

I remember two guys coming to my door and doing the same. I told them I was a christian-protestant but they didn't believe me. They asked for my name and where my church was .. one of them was taking down all the details. I was so uncomfortable and I was having a bad day too. When they left I realized I was shivering.. I told my housemates that if they ever came back to tell them to fuck off because I don't have the heart to do that to people.

[timb89]

Also, if you tell them you're Jewish they will leave you alone.

My grandpa was Irish Catholic and he used to love to invite the Mormons and Jehovah's witnesses in and argue with them about why they should be Catholic until they would leave lol

ah the ol' reverse conversion.

[Hannah_]

i'm kinda hoping jehovah's witnesses or mormons will visit me one day, so i can argue with them until they run away crying
Dying to do that.

[SanePsychotic]

I can tell you as a member of the LDS church and a former missionary who did exactly this that it is appreciated that you're not rude. All they wanted to do was share something that is important to them with you. If you're not interested then great.

Yeah, I figured if I just listened to them for five minutes they'd leave after awhile. It's not like they can stand on my porch forever. And it's not like I have any religious beliefs, so I don't really have anything to be offended by.

[rollerman4221]

I see a bunch of JHo's riding around Tally all the time. I actually knew a few kids in Orlando that's parents were JHo's. I really felt bad for them they always had to lie about going out or what they were doing and all that stuff.

[SanePsychotic]

I'm surprised at how hostile some of you guys are towards these people. Sure, you may not believe in their religion, but it will not kill you to talk to them for a minute or two. You may even get something out of it that affirms your faith in whatever you believe in. It's these negative additudes towards others' religions that can start wars. If it bothers you just say, "Thanks, but no thanks." No need to be rude.

[isntnikione]

I remember two guys coming to my door and doing the same. I told them I was a christian-protestant but they didn't believe me. They asked for my name and where my church was .. one of them was taking down all the details. I was so uncomfortable and I was having a bad day too. When they left I realized I was shivering.. I told my housemates that if they ever came back to tell them to fuck off because I don't have the heart to do that to people.

That's so horrible and ridiculous. They shouldn't be going around intimidating people like that! This happened to a girl I go to uni with, they showed up at her house at 9AM on a saturday and then told her she couldn't possibly be Christian because she answered the door in her pjs which included shorts...

I'm Christian too, but questioning someone's beliefs because they're wearings shorts around in their OWN HOUSE... oh goodness.

[BrennanHickson]

Last year one of these really rude, passive-aggressive Scientologists (CULT) was trying to give me a free "Holy Book" (sci-fi novel written by a psychopath and was taken way too seriously by druggies) called Dianetics.
I would have gladly accepted a free copy. Not because I want to convert, but because I find religion to be interesting. You don't have to be as close-minded as you seem.

[SanePsychotic]

I would have gladly accepted a free copy. Not because I want to convert, but because I find religion to be interesting. You don't have to be as close-minded as you seem.

I like you. :wave:

[-whisp-]

I'm surprised at how hostile some of you guys are towards these people. Sure, you may not believe in their religion, but it will not kill you to talk to them for a minute or two. You may even get something out of it that affirms your faith in whatever you believe in. It's these negative additudes towards others' religions that can start wars. If it bothers you just say, "Thanks, but no thanks." No need to be rude.

I did tell them no thanks several times but they just kept on talking. They shouldn't push people into listening to what they have to say. I would respect them more if they said 'okay thanks anyway, have a good day'.

[-whisp-]

That's so horrible and ridiculous. They shouldn't be going around intimidating people like that! This happened to a girl I go to uni with, they showed up at her house at 9AM on a saturday and then told her she couldn't possibly be Christian because she answered the door in her pjs which included shorts...

I'm Christian too, but questioning someone's beliefs because they're wearings shorts around in their OWN HOUSE... oh goodness.

Yeah that's over the top. I was out with my sister one day on the tube (in London) and a lady just started talking to my sister about God just because she/we didn't look properly dressed to her eyes, she probably thought we were some gothic kids even though we look the opposite.

[SanePsychotic]

I did tell them no thanks several times but they just kept on talking. They shouldn't push people into listening to what they have to say. I would respect them more if they said 'okay thanks anyway, have a good day'.

Yes, I understand what you mean. My comment was directed more at those who were extremely rude about the whole situation, like the Charles Manson T-shirt guy or the one who said that they wished jehovah''s witnesses or mormons would come and visit him so he can make them runaway crying.

[-whisp-]

Yes, I understand what you mean. My comment was directed more at those who were extremely rude about the whole situation, like the Charles Manson T-shirt guy or the one who said that they wished jehovah''s witnesses or mormons would come and visit him so he can make them runaway crying.

ah right :) sorry.

[SanePsychotic]

ah right :) sorry.

Oh, no problem. The way I see it, as long as you're not too rude to them then you're good. It's the people who enjoy being mean to them that really annoy me.

[abbysmith]

They come to my house all the time. We can see our front door from our kitchen window, so usually when someone rings the door bell we check who it is first. If it is someone trying to convert us, we just pretend we aren't home.

[isntnikione]

Yeah that's over the top. I was out with my sister one day on the tube (in London) and a lady just started talking to my sister about God just because she/we didn't look properly dressed to her eyes, she probably thought we were some gothic kids even though we look the opposite.

Yeah, I mean I understand that these people are so proactive because they honestly believe they're saving lives by doing this, and I can respect that although I sometimes disagree with methods used. But it's a completely different thing to pick at someone's "flaws" (in their eyes at least) and tell them how to live their life. It upsets me because it isolates people and then they generalize and think all Christians are like that or something, but that is DEFINITELY not what Christianity and more importantly what God is about at all.


On the other hand, I have a problem with people who openly disrespect these evangelists. If you understood their beliefs, you'd understand why they feel the need to be there and do that. Ok, you don't believe in the same things, that's fine, but if you want others to respect your views, respect theirs. And even if they're pushy, if you think you're so much more enlightened than them, then be the bigger person and just chill and be nice.

[SincerelyMe]

The only people that should come to my door and try to sell me something are girl scouts. Two of these religious people came to my door and walked inside as soon as I opened it. I couldn't get them to leave for a good 20 minutes.

[RiCCioLi]

usually these two old ladies come around praising jesus a few times a year. Im the only one home usually and they come at like 11am and always wake me up. last time i opened the door in just my boxer briefs, told them i worship satan, slammed the door in their face. went back to sleep. i told my mom a few days later and she was cracking up.

[reesa]

they scare me and i pretend i'm not home when they do knock (:

[mick2late]

Makes me happy that we have a gate.

[maxvsmaradona]

That happened to me last month. It was just my friend and I so we let them in for a couple of lulz. The most ridiculous cult ever. They believe that God manifested himself inside all gems because he felt that the world was becoming sinful and he was afraid to watch. So one night he cried and burst into a billion fucking pieces and now to show our appreciation for him we buy gems subconsciously to show our faith that one day he will return and guide us.... Did I mention that he sneaks around at night when we sleep to make sure our brain's artificial hardware (the stuff that keeps us buying these gems) runs properly. This must have been a ploy to stimulate the economy, but honesltyy, I'm afraid to buy a gem now in fear that this God is real.

ahaha, that's crazy. If some people think that isn't a cult, then I don't know what is.

[billyboatkid]

Just say sorry I'm Catholic. That's what I say at least haha

[Dymytry Vance]

Since when is knocking on the door and trying to have a conversation "a sneaky form of harassment?" I understand that its the world that we live in where people would much rather get their human interaction through internet activity but a face to face encounter is much more productive regardless if you agree or not. It is obvious from your response that you have absolutely no understanding of the religions you are bashing and a lot could be gained if you actually talked to someone about it and found out what exactly the reasons they have for knocking on your door. You seem like smart person, especially for only being 15, but it's not cool to bash other people's beliefs. No one is asking you to agree but at least respect other people. I also completely understand that some "religious" people can be very condescending and judgmental but all ya can do is be the bigger person. Personally, I like to understand where people are coming from so I can respect them for what they are doing.
Then you should understand and respect my post before you go bashing my beliefs.???
They left this part out.
It's fucking ridiculous. They gave me a Holy book which is basically a guide to gems but with a message about how God manifested himself within these gems.
I would have gladly accepted a free copy. Not because I want to convert, but because I find religion to be interesting. You don't have to be as close-minded as you seem.
I find religion fascinating as well. However I don't find closeminded people imposing their beliefs on me over and over again fascinating. I do my reading on religion, and while it is fascinating, it's nothing I plan to follow.
ahaha, that's crazy. If some people think that isn't a cult, then I don't know what is.
It's fucking ridiculous. I thought Scientology was bad.

[maxvsmaradona]

It's fucking ridiculous. I thought Scientology was bad.

Scientology is bad, as well.

[Neo Cassady]

Start @ 5:45

KL6EnvM2GyQ

[MyNameIsRoss]

We just get Jehovah's Witnesses around here.

[Dymytry Vance]

Scientology is bad, as well.
Compared to this.... everything is good.

[ted is lying]

Im going to start a cult. We believe that Jesus lives in all lamps and every time you turn a lamp or light off part of Jesus so in order to save Jesus we need to just leave the light and every other electrical device on. Anyone want to join?

[Neo Cassady]

The only people that should come to my door and try to sell me something are girl scouts. Two of these religious people came to my door and walked inside as soon as I opened it. I couldn't get them to leave for a good 20 minutes.

Did you threaten to call the cops on them for trespassing? And then tell them that if God was really the higher authority they wouldn't be getting arrested?



As you can tell, I don't tolerate people forcing views on me. Express your views, talk about your cause, sure...but don't badger people who don't agree, especially with things where differences in most intelligent people won't hurt anyone.

[ted is lying]

Did you threaten to call the cops on them for trespassing? And then tell them that if God was really the higher authority they wouldn't be getting arrested?



As you can tell, I don't tolerate people forcing views on me. Express your views, talk about your cause, sure...but don't badger people who don't agree, especially with things where differences in most intelligent people won't hurt anyone.
join my electric cult?

[golferpunk1]

I'm surprised at how hostile some of you guys are towards these people. Sure, you may not believe in their religion, but it will not kill you to talk to them for a minute or two. You may even get something out of it that affirms your faith in whatever you believe in. It's these negative additudes towards others' religions that can start wars. If it bothers you just say, "Thanks, but no thanks." No need to be rude.

I agree. Very well said.

[golferpunk1]

Then you should understand and respect my post before you go bashing my beliefs.???

Not once did I "bash" you for being atheist. I just don't agree with hating on religions especially when you have no understanding of them.

[GeeBee]

Not once did I "bash" you for being atheist. I just don't agree with hating on religions especially when you have no understanding of them.
I'll bet ten bucks you fit into that same category. Mormonism has the most whitewashed and sanitized version of its own history. I'm willing to bet you don't know a thing about the Kinderhook Plates, Fanny Alger, Helen Mar Kimball, the Danites, Joseph Smith's money-digging, Kirtland Banking Society, View of the Hebrews, etc. etc., ad nauseum.

Do some reading friend. JS was a con-man, a pedophile, and a liar.

[golferpunk1]

I'll bet ten bucks you fit into that same category. Mormonism has the most whitewashed and sanitized version of its own history. I'm willing to bet you don't know a thing about the Kinderhook Plates, Fanny Alger, Helen Mar Kimball, the Danites, Joseph Smith's money-digging, Kirtland Banking Society, View of the Hebrews, etc. etc., ad nauseum.

Do some reading friend. JS was a con-man, a pedophile, and a liar.

You seem to be very well read in the Anti-mormon literature. Now, if you read a little of the real beliefs and history of the church we would be able to have an intelligent conversation.

[oh...rly]

Do some reading friend. JS was a con-man, a pedophile, and a liar.

Those are all the qualities you need to be an effective religious leader.

[GeeBee]

You seem to be very well read in the Anti-mormon literature. Now, if you read a little of the real beliefs and history of the church we would be able to have an intelligent conversation.

Funny how anything that isn't "faith promoting", but still true historically, automatically becomes "anti", huh?

Also, I'm pretty sure we can have an intelligent conversation. I served a mission and have read more Nibley and Talmage than I assume you have. Cut the crap.

[GeeBee]

You seem to be very well read in the Anti-mormon literature. Now, if you read a little of the real beliefs and history of the church we would be able to have an intelligent conversation.
It's precisely the well-documented and well-researched history of the church that drives people out of the church in droves. Welcome to the internet age. The brethren at North Temple could control the message for a long time by marginalizing scholars who researched mormonism's claims. But with the advent of the internet, that information is but a click away, and baptismal and retention rates are plummeting, and the rate of people leaving the church climbs every year.

[GeeBee]

Those are all the qualities you need to be an effective religious leader.
That and a few dozen desperate fanatics.

[t_ashley]

I try to be pretty open about listening to others beliefs.
Growing up, i lived with my grandmother for the most part, so mainly i was raised up with a jewish ideology about religion.
When i was about 12, i had to leave and go move in with my mom (who is mormon). Moving religions, sucks. especially when you switch to something, that in essence, is the opposite of what you know (which sort of leaves me in the middle, where i try not to dabble with it too much..)
I dont completely believe in mormonism, but religiously, that is where my household is, i still tend to stick with what i grew up with as a child, but sometimes, not being sure, helps because it motivates you to explore your religion.


As for people going door to door: They've buildt there testimony and are sure, just think of it as them wanting to share the testimony they have to help you create your own.

[Charles777]

They ususally only leave papers in our mailbox. Must be because we live in a somewhat bad neighborhood.

[Machu505]

If this ever happens I will defenestrate manners and just tell them to leave.

[zion the lion]

I'm kind of in awe at the lack of respect and manners from you guys. I've never been rude to the people who come to my door. I dont get as many anymore because I live in a bad neighborhood, but when I was younger and living in my old apartment, they used to come all the time. Last year, I some Jehova's Witnesses came to my door and I honestly invited them in, gave them some coffee and talked too them honestly about their religion and everything, then when they realized they had to go, they asked me if they could come over again and I told them they could come by anytime and we could talk some more about God and everything. Sadly, I've gotten sick and I'm rarely home now so I always miss them when they come by. But I wish I could catch them.

By the way, you should always keep an open mind, because I was a satanist when two people came by representing Baha'i to invite me and "my son" to a special class for children. They were amazingly nice people, it was easy to talk to them, and they good energy basically flowing out of their ears, and I listened to them with an open mind...3 years later, and I'm really interested in checking them out and stopping by their church and talking to them.

[awakeohsleeper]

Yeah that's over the top. I was out with my sister one day on the tube (in London) and a lady just started talking to my sister about God just because she/we didn't look properly dressed to her eyes, she probably thought we were some gothic kids even though we look the opposite.

That's ridiculous. Have these people read the Bible?

And hooray for Falmouth. I've been there. In fact, I think I only bothered to reply due to that small piece of information. I live in Sheffield.

[ted is lying]

Lol. That is pretty ridonkulous
No my new cult is. We are the cult of the bulb. We believe that Jesus is actually electricity, so we keep all the lights and everything that uses his might power on all the time. Help us use the power of jesus. Join today

[Dymytry Vance]

What is the name of this cult?
The cult of the gem.
I'm kind of in awe at the lack of respect and manners from you guys. I've never been rude to the people who come to my door. I dont get as many anymore because I live in a bad neighborhood, but when I was younger and living in my old apartment, they used to come all the time. Last year, I some Jehova's Witnesses came to my door and I honestly invited them in, gave them some coffee and talked too them honestly about their religion and everything, then when they realized they had to go, they asked me if they could come over again and I told them they could come by anytime and we could talk some more about God and everything. Sadly, I've gotten sick and I'm rarely home now so I always miss them when they come by. But I wish I could catch them.

By the way, you should always keep an open mind, because I was a satanist when two people came by representing Baha'i to invite me and "my son" to a special class for children. They were amazingly nice people, it was easy to talk to them, and they good energy basically flowing out of their ears, and I listened to them with an open mind...3 years later, and I'm really interested in checking them out and stopping by their church and talking to them.
Wait, you have "A son" and do you have a FAKE stroy for everything?
It's precisely the well-documented and well-researched history of the church that drives people out of the church in droves. Welcome to the internet age. The brethren at North Temple could control the message for a long time by marginalizing scholars who researched mormonism's claims. But with the advent of the internet, that information is but a click away, and baptismal and retention rates are plummeting, and the rate of people leaving the church climbs every year.
this
Funny how anything that isn't "faith promoting", but still true historically, automatically becomes "anti", huh?

Also, I'm pretty sure we can have an intelligent conversation. I served a mission and have read more Nibley and Talmage than I assume you have. Cut the crap.
this
You seem to be very well read in the Anti-mormon literature. Now, if you read a little of the real beliefs and history of the church we would be able to have an intelligent conversation.
Just because some guy who had a distorted sense of values and a knack for convincing f\people that false was true wrote down a bunch of crap and called it the Bible doesn't mean it's true.
I'll bet ten bucks you fit into that same category. Mormonism has the most whitewashed and sanitized version of its own history. I'm willing to bet you don't know a thing about the Kinderhook Plates, Fanny Alger, Helen Mar Kimball, the Danites, Joseph Smith's money-digging, Kirtland Banking Society, View of the Hebrews, etc. etc., ad nauseum.

Do some reading friend. JS was a con-man, a pedophile, and a liar.
this
Not once did I "bash" you for being atheist. I just don't agree with hating on religions especially when you have no understanding of them.
I have much more of an understanding of them then you tihink. I never said you bashed me, I said you weren't understanding and respecting what I was saying. My great-aunt is extremely Catholic and even she bitches about the people coming to her door.

[Dymytry Vance]

No my new cult is. We are the cult of the bulb. We believe that Jesus is actually electricity, so we keep all the lights and everything that uses his might power on all the time. Help us use the power of jesus. Join today
I am part of the cult of the liquid. We believe that God drunk some magic piss and it made him into liquid, so now he is all liquids. When rivers move he is happy,. and when ponds and such are stagnant he is pissed. We can only drink water for it is pure and by doing duch we manifest his soul in our bodies. But because you folow the gem-satan's symbol-we will start a cult war with you.

[ted is lying]

I am part of the cult of the liquid. We believe that God drunk some magic piss and it made him into liquid, so now he is all liquids. When rivers move he is happy,. and when ponds and such are stagnant he is pissed. We can only drink water for it is pure and by doing duch we manifest his soul in our bodies. But because you folow the gem-satan's symbol-we will start a cult war with you.
Cult War! Prepare for us to run up a really high electric bill and you will be forced to pay!

[Dymytry Vance]

Cult War! Prepare for us to run up a really high electric bill and you will be forced to pay!
We will damage your electric devices with water.....

[zion the lion]

The cult of the gem.

Wait, you have "A son" and do you have a FAKE stroy for everything?

this

this

Just because some guy who had a distorted sense of values and a knack for convincing f\people that false was true wrote down a bunch of crap and called it the Bible doesn't mean it's true.

this

I have much more of an understanding of them then you tihink. I never said you bashed me, I said you weren't understanding and respecting what I was saying. My great-aunt is extremely Catholic and even she bitches about the people coming to her door.

Please (and I'm asking this seriously) tell me which of my "stories" are fake, be specific, because I cant think of one thing I've said seriously about myself that was made up.

And no, if you noticed, I put it in quotation marks (but since you dont know what those are, they look like this "") the reason for that was because he wasnt my son, he was my neighbor's son, and since he's black and native, they assumed he was mine, and I never got the chance to correct them.

[ted is lying]

Please (and I'm asking this seriously) tell me which of my "stories" are fake, be specific, because I cant think of one thing I've said seriously about myself that was made up.

And no, if you noticed, I put it in quotation marks (but since you dont know what those are, they look like this "") the reason for that was because he wasnt my son, he was my neighbor's son, and since he's black and native, they assumed he was mine, and I never got the chance to correct them.
Cult of the gem is real
Cult of the bulb is fake
cult of liquid is fake

[Dymytry Vance]

Please (and I'm asking this seriously) tell me which of my "stories" are fake, be specific, because I cant think of one thing I've said seriously about myself that was made up.

And no, if you noticed, I put it in quotation marks (but since you dont know what those are, they look like this "") the reason for that was because he wasnt my son, he was my neighbor's son, and since he's black and native, they assumed he was mine, and I never got the chance to correct them.
It seems like you just make up a story for everything.
And I put "a son" in quotes too,so....

[ted is lying]

We will damage your electric devices with water.....
Then you shall be shocked by our jesus and sent to place without electricity.

[Dymytry Vance]

Then you shall be shocked by our jesus and sent to place without electricity.
Haha you believe in a false god.

[ted is lying]

Haha you believe in a false god.
The only false god is every other religion, cult, company, and Captain Planet.

edit:
We also believe in Steve Jobs.

[Dymytry Vance]

The only false god is every other religion, cult, company, and Captain Planet.

edit:
We also believe in Steve Jobs.
Great now you've pissed off the cult of the apple.

[-whisp-]

That's ridiculous. Have these people read the Bible?

And hooray for Falmouth. I've been there. In fact, I think I only bothered to reply due to that small piece of information. I live in Sheffield.

Ah nice, that's quite up north! I just moved to Falmouth this week, I love it.

[zion the lion]

It seems like you just make up a story for everything.
And I put "a son" in quotes too,so....

Yeah, it's called life experience. So the fact that I have a story for this, makes it fake? Unlike your stories of harrassment in this thread? I get that you think it's your perrogative to decide exactly which of my stories are real and fake because clearly you're my guardian angel and you've been one step behind me every moment of my life, but that really isnt the case. The fact that I have a "story for everything" really comes down to the fact that I just happen to have an eccentric "family" and because I'm at the wrong place at the wrong time.

I'm still waiting for a few specific examples of my fake stories, I'm pretty curious to see how much of my life is on the fiction shelf in your mind.

[SanePsychotic]

The only false god is every other religion, cult, company, and Captain Planet.

edit:
We also believe in Steve Jobs.

:-d Nice.

[BrennanHickson]

I like you. :wave:
I don't know you, but I will assume that I like you too... unless you give me reason to believe otherwise.

I'm Brennan, by the way. :wave:

[mattmatumbo]

Since when is knocking on the door and trying to have a conversation "a sneaky form of harassment?" I understand that its the world that we live in where people would much rather get their human interaction through internet activity but a face to face encounter is much more productive regardless if you agree or not. It is obvious from your response that you have absolutely no understanding of the religions you are bashing and a lot could be gained if you actually talked to someone about it and found out what exactly the reasons they have for knocking on your door. You seem like smart person, especially for only being 15, but it's not cool to bash other people's beliefs. No one is asking you to agree but at least respect other people. I also completely understand that some "religious" people can be very condescending and judgmental but all ya can do is be the bigger person. Personally, I like to understand where people are coming from so I can respect them for what they are doing.

I feel that it's not cool for random people to come to my property and knock on my door to tell me my beliefs are wrong. I tell them i'm not interested, but if they persist i will tell them to get the fuck off my property. Sure they have the right to freedom of speech, but i think that i have the right to privacy as well.

[brokenwings]

I'm surprised at how hostile some of you guys are towards these people. Sure, you may not believe in their religion, but it will not kill you to talk to them for a minute or two. You may even get something out of it that affirms your faith in whatever you believe in. It's these negative additudes towards others' religions that can start wars. If it bothers you just say, "Thanks, but no thanks." No need to be rude.
pushing your belief, religion or opinion on someone else is what causes wars

[mattmatumbo]

pushing your belief, religion or opinion on someone else is what causes wars

Very good point.

[mattmatumbo]

Funny how anything that isn't "faith promoting", but still true historically, automatically becomes "anti", huh?

Also, I'm pretty sure we can have an intelligent conversation. I served a mission and have read more Nibley and Talmage than I assume you have. Cut the crap.


BOOM!

What is your take on Marc Hoffman?

[ted is lying]

Great now you've pissed off the cult of the apple.
those guys are just cheating off our electric and what not, fuck them. Get a computer with windows.

[golferpunk1]

Funny how anything that isn't "faith promoting", but still true historically, automatically becomes "anti", huh?

Also, I'm pretty sure we can have an intelligent conversation. I served a mission and have read more Nibley and Talmage than I assume you have. Cut the crap.

I'm curious to know what your definition of "true historically" is? If you have any sort of understanding of history itself you know that it is all subjective. When I say something is anti I mean it is written by someone who has taken the standpoint of opposition towards the church. There are no historians that can fully escape their own point of view. That is true of both church historians that I would quote and "anti" historians that I assume you would quote. I don't understand why you're so hostile toward me? I never meant to attack your beliefs but I guess I did assume that you hadn't read any of the church's doctrine so I'm sorry for that. So what made you go from being a missionary to being opposed to the church? Sorry if that's too personal, I'm just interested for the sake of discussion.

[Reaver]

I can't believe some guys here actually defend those people. I dunno where you come from, but the place I come from allows people to believe whatever they want. but that also means, that i can chose to believe that there is no god. and if those door-knocking people come to my home and try to convince me that their belief is the one and only belief, I'm rightfully pissed off by that.

[GeeBee]

BOOM!

What is your take on Marc Hoffman?
Smart forger. Dumb "prophets". End of story.
I'm curious to know what your definition of "true historically" is? If you have any sort of understanding of history itself you know that it is all subjective. When I say something is anti I mean it is written by someone who has taken the standpoint of opposition towards the church. There are no historians that can fully escape their own point of view. That is true of both church historians that I would quote and "anti" historians that I assume you would quote. I don't understand why you're so hostile toward me? I never meant to attack your beliefs but I guess I did assume that you hadn't read any of the church's doctrine so I'm sorry for that. So what made you go from being a missionary to being opposed to the church? Sorry if that's too personal, I'm just interested for the sake of discussion.
"Historically true" means well-documented. Historians may have bias, but documents and journal entries don't lie. You've simply only been provided with the "faith promoting" ones.
Sometimes the truth is "in opposition" to the church. Like the Book of Abraham, the testimony of the witnesses, etc. etc. Boyd Packer said "sometimes what is TRUE is not very USEFUL". If that's not code for "pious lie", I don't know what is.
Also, I'm not hostile toward you. I'm hostile toward the attitude that anyone who criticizes the church is automatically labeled "anti" or "doesn't know what they're talking about". The track record for official CHURCH historians who can maintain their testimonies is not very stellar. Look up Leonard Arrington or B.H. Roberts. One was called as church historian, the other was an apostle.

I went from a missionary to an apostate by investigating the church like an investigator. It was initially an effort to strengthen my testimony. Since you spent two years asking people to investigate the church thusly, I'd suggest you do the same. The church, Christianity, and the very idea of god himself...all frauds.

[Dymytry Vance]

those guys are just cheating off our electric and what not, fuck them. Get a computer with windows.
windows 7 cult is proud.
Yeah, it's called life experience. So the fact that I have a story for this, makes it fake? Unlike your stories of harrassment in this thread? I get that you think it's your perrogative to decide exactly which of my stories are real and fake because clearly you're my guardian angel and you've been one step behind me every moment of my life, but that really isnt the case. The fact that I have a "story for everything" really comes down to the fact that I just happen to have an eccentric "family" and because I'm at the wrong place at the wrong time.

I'm still waiting for a few specific examples of my fake stories, I'm pretty curious to see how much of my life is on the fiction shelf in your mind.
Just saying that you have a lot of life experience then. Or maybe it's just me because I live in the smalles town ever....
I looked it up on Wikipedia and Google and found nothing. Actually the only result was this thread
there's most likely a reason for that. I udnerstand we are a heartbroken, intellectually diluted generation but we're not that dumb.

[argg_xo]

these guys helped paint a barn for my friend's uncle last year, then he said he wasn't interested in their religion.

[Kassie09]

Jehovas whitnesses used to live down the road and one tried to give me a bible one day and my mom freaked. lol

[ohheroine]

It's not a conversation-it's an imposition. Conversations are two sided. The door-to-door religious people that I have encountered aren't there to discuss or consider my convictions-they're there to tell me how to live and believe. It's the whole notion of someone imposing their beliefs that's annoying.


wish i could "like" ap posts.

[ReignofFiction]

They haven't come here in a long time...I think last time I kinda freaked them out.

[writeacliche]

No but when I was walking to Subway next door to my work a few shady lookin' fellas tried to sell me gold....

Hm.

[GeeBee]

It's not a conversation-it's an imposition. Conversations are two sided. The door-to-door religious people that I have encountered aren't there to discuss or consider my convictions-they're there to tell me how to live and believe. It's the whole notion of someone imposing their beliefs that's annoying.
So much this.

[ted is lying]

Join the cult of the bulb. We have free cookies on Tuesdays.

[Lunar]

I got into a big argument with two old ladies about religion and the idealisms the Catholic and Christian church envoke on us peons.

I told them i'd be back in a second and came back with my shirt off and some baby oil, i invited them in.

I haven't had any Doorknockers in months.

[mmmmmpoetry]

They tried talking to me and I told them a Mormon raped my mother and had me.

[cuzimlefthanded]

wish i could "like" ap posts.

Hahaha. thanks.

[cuzimlefthanded]

They tried talking to me and I told them a Mormon raped my mother and had me.

HAHAHA

[cuzimlefthanded]

It sucks that when I tell these door-to-door people that I'm Buddhist, they immediately tell me one/all of the following

1. "You're going to hell"
2. "You need to be saved"
3. "You've been following the wrong teachings all your life.

[SanePsychotic]

I don't know you, but I will assume that I like you too... unless you give me reason to believe otherwise.

I'm Brennan, by the way. :wave:

I'm Kris. Pleased to meet ya.

pushing your belief, religion or opinion on someone else is what causes wars

This is true, but lack of understanding and the unwillingness to be open minded is also what causes wars.

[GeeBee]

I'm Kris. Pleased to meet ya.



This is true, but lack of understanding and the unwillingness to be open minded is also what causes wars.
There's a difference between being open minded and outright gullible. You'd have to be the latter to buy into three words that any JW, Mormon, or any other door-to-door religion salesmen have to say.

Also...are you seriously suggesting that slamming the door on Mormon missionaries may be the catalyst that starts a war? You're an idiot.

[Dymytry Vance]

Join the cult of the bulb. We have free cookies on Tuesdays.Oh yeah? We have free ice cream on Wednesdays. We discovered peoples' moods are the worst on Wednesday and decided to up the positivity via ice cream and a game of "What's under your robe?"

[ted is lying]

Oh yeah? We have free ice cream on Wednesdays. We discovered peoples' moods are the worst on Wednesday and decided to up the positivity via ice cream and a game of "What's under your robe?"
Wednesday is punch jason statham in face. Take that all of your action movies.

[ted is lying]

he caught me, Wednesday is mass suicide day.

[Dymytry Vance]

he caught me, Wednesday is mass suicide day.
Here's our calendar:
Sunday, drink 140 gallons of water day.
Monday, Worship
Tuesday, Matricide day (our god preaches that to us.)
Wednesday, ioce cream day
Thursday, premarital sex day.
Friday, Castration Day/Mass Suicide Day
Saturday, Bulimia Activism Day

[ted is lying]

Here's our calendar:
Sunday, drink 140 gallons of water day.
Monday, Worship
Tuesday, Matricide day (our god preaches that to us.)
Wednesday, ioce cream day
Thursday, premarital sex day.
Friday, Castration Day/Mass Suicide Day
Saturday, Bulimia Activism Day

Saturday we are going to buy some light bulbs and lamps and plug them all in.

[Dymytry Vance]

Saturday we are going to buy some light bulbs and lamps and plug them all in.
Screw you, we help people with problems, and you create problems by fucking with the economy. Steve Jobs is mad.

[ted is lying]

Screw you, we help people with problems, and you create problems by fucking with the economy. Steve Jobs is mad.
Steve Jobs created the ipod, which uses more electric then every house hold in east coast. I need some power strips, any chance you guys have 537 of them? Ill pay you with a half full waterbottle. We see things as half full not half empty like your guys.

[Dymytry Vance]

Steve Jobs created the ipod, which uses more electric then every house hold in east coast. I need some power strips, any chance you guys have 537 of them? Ill pay you with a half full waterbottle. We see things as half full not half empty like your guys. You're dumb enough to buty spring water with ice in it. PM me if you need to know why that is dumb.

[ted is lying]

You're dumb enough to buty spring water with ice in it. PM me if you need to know why that is dumb.
cuz you get less water?

[Dymytry Vance]

cuz you get less water?
No, because ice cubes are made with tap water in most restaurants. That defeats the purpose of spring water...
You need to shock your brain or something, at least we use our god to his fullest potential.

[ted is lying]

No, because ice cubes are made with tap water in most restaurants. That defeats the purpose of spring water...
You need to shock your brain or something, at least we use our god to his fullest potential.
Tap water is the same as bottled water.

[Dymytry Vance]

Tap water is the same as bottled water.
No it's not and neither is spring water. We used to study water when we began practicing our "faith"

[SLOWPOKE LOPEZ]

i was raised as a jehovahs witness, and though i dont currently associate myself with them, its still pretty laughable to see the misconceptions and total banality of some of your views towards them.
though i don't agree with some of their beliefs/practices, i'll still defend them as some of the best people alive. so to those that wanted to 'argue with a JW till he runs away crying', here's your chance. this may be the closest thing to a JW you ever find, so make me cry.
edit: im leaving for work, make me cry later.

[GeeBee]

i was raised as a jehovahs witness, and though i dont currently associate myself with them, its still pretty laughable to see the misconceptions and total banality of some of your views towards them.
though i don't agree with some of their beliefs/practices, i'll still defend them as some of the best people alive. so to those that wanted to 'argue with a JW till he runs away crying', here's your chance. this may be the closest thing to a JW you ever find, so make me cry.
edit: im leaving for work, make me cry later.

No one's claiming that they're not good people. No one ever said that. Mormons, JW's, and Scientologists all have vast amounts of good-hearted people who I wish only the best to. But, it's also true (especially in the case of Mormons) that sometimes the most uninformed people about the religion are the adherents themselves. Sometimes the best, most unobstructed view comes from outside, and it's classic cult tactic to simply marginalize detractors as "anti-" or "under Satan's grasp", or some other nonsense. Ad Hominems are a good way to kill the message along with the messenger.

[mattmatumbo]

Smart forger. Dumb "prophets". End of story.

I read about him for my final ap english portfolio my junior year. Blew my fucking mind the shit he did, and the "prophet" as well. But when i inquired to my mormon friends about him, they wouldn't answer because i said he was excommunicated.

[GeeBee]

I read about him for my final ap english portfolio my junior year. Blew my fucking mind the shit he did, and the "prophet" as well. But when i inquired to my mormon friends about him, they wouldn't answer because i said he was excommunicated.

The part that got to me was the fact that the church was only interested in purchasing the documents because they were disparaging to church history and wanted to lock them up. That and the fact that so-called "apostles" pretty much orchestrated a plea-bargain to avoid a trial in which those documents would be made public. Sickening.

Your mormon friends are engaging in classic confirmation bias. An excommunicated member can automatically be written off as lacking any credibility, while their message may be air-tight true. Disappointing.

[Villanova1L]

Haha I am living in Port Huron at the moment and we get these annoying religious fools. You're lucky you don't get them. I can't stand Witnesses or Mormons

WIKED PISSA. FUCK 'EM IF DEY DON'T THINK TAWMMY BRADY IS THE SECOND COMING!

/everyone from boston sucks and talks like Tawmmy on Kissing Suzy Kolber

[mattmatumbo]

The part that got to me was the fact that the church was only interested in purchasing the documents because they were disparaging to church history and wanted to lock them up. That and the fact that so-called "apostles" pretty much orchestrated a plea-bargain to avoid a trial in which those documents would be made public. Sickening.

Your mormon friends are engaging in classic confirmation bias. An excommunicated member can automatically be written off as lacking any credibility, while their message may be air-tight true. Disappointing.

Exactly what blew my mind. No mormon finds this odd though. This was the clear cut evidence that made me say "Well their church is based on nothing."

Yeah, i feel bad now calling all this shit out on them that they had no idea about. I've realized that it's easier to just let them believe what they believe.

[GeeBee]

Exactly what blew my mind. No mormon finds this odd though.

Yeah, i feel bad now calling all this shit out on them that they had no idea about. I've realized that it's easier to just let them believe what they believe.

Oh, I think there are plenty of people for whom the Marc Hoffman thing was either the last straw, or the first crack in the floor.
There are also a good number of people who wanted to hear something reassuring at the general conference following 9/11, only to hear the most substantial issue being the number of earrings a girl should wear. After that, they were so blown away, they left.

Yep. I rarely bring anything up unless asked, or in the case of this thread, defending non-believers or myself from charges of being ill-informed or simply "anti-".

[SLOWPOKE LOPEZ]

No one's claiming that they're not good people. No one ever said that. Mormons, JW's, and Scientologists all have vast amounts of good-hearted people who I wish only the best to. But, it's also true (especially in the case of Mormons) that sometimes the most uninformed people about the religion are the adherents themselves. Sometimes the best, most unobstructed view comes from outside, and it's classic cult tactic to simply marginalize detractors as "anti-" or "under Satan's grasp", or some other nonsense. Ad Hominems are a good way to kill the message along with the messenger.
to be honest, thats part of the reason im not a JW now. though it 100% is not part of the church's teachings, its become common to think that expressing any individuality or questioning of beliefs is wrong. i've found the people that adhere strongest to the percieved set of rules are the ones that can't explain why they believe it, they just do it because 'thats just the way it is'.
but as i said, im leaving for work. i'll talk later tomorrow.

[GeeBee]

to be honest, thats part of the reason im not a JW now. though it 100% is not part of the church's teachings, its become common to think that expressing any individuality or questioning of beliefs is wrong. i've found the people that adhere strongest to the percieved set of rules are the ones that can't explain why they believe it, they just do it because 'thats just the way it is'.
but as i said, im leaving for work. i'll talk later tomorrow.

You gotta make life work for ya'. I'll never try to talk anyone out of their beliefs. In my opinion, people should spend their lives doing that for themselves.

Good luck at work.

[cuzimlefthanded]

i was raised as a jehovahs witness, and though i dont currently associate myself with them, its still pretty laughable to see the misconceptions and total banality of some of your views towards them.
though i don't agree with some of their beliefs/practices, i'll still defend them as some of the best people alive. so to those that wanted to 'argue with a JW till he runs away crying', here's your chance. this may be the closest thing to a JW you ever find, so make me cry.
edit: im leaving for work, make me cry later.

There's nothing to defend against. No one here is saying that those people are bad.

[mattmatumbo]

Oh, I think there are plenty of people for whom the Marc Hoffman thing was either the last straw, or the first crack in the floor.
There are also a good number of people who wanted to hear something reassuring at the general conference following 9/11, only to hear the most substantial issue being the number of earrings a girl should wear. After that, they were so blown away, they left.

Yep. I rarely bring anything up unless asked, or in the case of this thread, defending non-believers or myself from charges of being ill-informed or simply "anti-".

Oh i didn't know about this, i guess since it happened before my time it's hard for me to know. I'm glad that his actions haven't been utterly forgotten, i feel rather stupid though because i mainly try to faults in other people's beliefs but rarely my own.

Yeah i went to a few church a few times with my ex who was mormon, one of my ex's friends got up and said that she had heard about hoffman and all the other shit but still believed in the church. Jaw dropping moment.

[GeeBee]

Oh i didn't know about this, i guess since it happened before my time it's hard for me to know. I'm glad that his actions haven't been utterly forgotten, i feel rather stupid though because i mainly try to faults in other people's beliefs but rarely my own.

Yeah i went to a few church a few times with my ex who was mormon, one of my ex's friends got up and said that she had heard about hoffman and all the other shit but still believed in the church. Jaw dropping moment.

Oh, I guarantee that if tomorrow, Joseph Smith's journals were unearthed in which he admitted to being a fraud, a good many members would refuse to buy it and pretend it didn't exist. That's what's so dangerous about such pervasive movements.

[bostonryan]

WIKED PISSA. FUCK 'EM IF DEY DON'T THINK TAWMMY BRADY IS THE SECOND COMING!

/everyone from boston sucks and talks like Tawmmy on Kissing Suzy Kolber


I despise Tom Brady and would not be sad if he was sidelined for yet another season. Boston is still the best city there is though

[GeeBee]

I despise Tom Brady and would not be sad if he was sidelined for yet another season. Boston is still the best city there is though

Ftw.

[ted is lying]

No it's not and neither is spring water. We used to study water when we began practicing our "faith"
I watch'd the ugly truth and they said it was the same so ha! Electric ftw.

[SanePsychotic]

There's a difference between being open minded and outright gullible. You'd have to be the latter to buy into three words that any JW, Mormon, or any other door-to-door religion salesmen have to say.

Also...are you seriously suggesting that slamming the door on Mormon missionaries may be the catalyst that starts a war? You're an idiot.

I'm not saying you have to buy into what they say, or even that you necessarily have to listen to what they say, but there's no reason to be rude to them. That's what I'm saying. And no, I'm not suggesting that slamming the door on any missionaries are catalysts for war. Clearly you don't understand what I was trying to say. I mean that lack of understanding is what can lead to wars. Understand?

[Remote]

I'm atheist. I believe that this religion shit is shit. I cannot make myself believe in an afterlife that involves you not living your first life to the fullest, nor do I believe in half the shit any religion says. So now you know my standpoint on it.


Last year one of these really rude, passive-aggressive Scientologists (CULT) was trying to give me a free "Holy Book" (sci-fi novel written by a psychopath and was taken way too seriously by druggies) called Dianetics. I laughed and told him that if we're alien spirits that have been deposited in a volcano by some alien with fighter planes and is named Lord Xenu then I hasve Prince William and Garry Glitter having anal in my living room while wearing nazi perophenilia or some shit like that. They were persistent so I followed one of the really annoying ones door to door and as they were talking I yelled, "Nothing Happens When you Die..." or, "Don't Let Them In, They Will Steal Your Food And Throw Anthrax At You." They started threatening to sue me for harrassment, so I screamed "I need an adult" and ran like Hell. I think they left after that.
I really believe you!!!

[GeeBee]

I'm not saying you have to buy into what they say, or even that you necessarily have to listen to what they say, but there's no reason to be rude to them. That's what I'm saying. And no, I'm not suggesting that slamming the door on any missionaries are catalysts for war. Clearly you don't understand what I was trying to say. I mean that lack of understanding is what can lead to wars. Understand?

There is reason to be rude to them. They're encroaching on my property and insinuating that I'm essentially "not doing it right" in regards to how I live my life. That's pretty much the rudest thing I can think of.

[Dymytry Vance]

I watch'd the ugly truth and they said it was the same so ha! Electric ftw.
It's a fucking movie...
What the fuck does ftw mean?

[Dymytry Vance]

I really believe you!!!
I care???

[ted is lying]

It's a fucking movie...
What the fuck does ftw mean?
for the win.

[anthonydarko]

I often just blare Slayer and Behemoth at full blast when they come to the door.

[GeeBee]

So what made you go from being a missionary to being opposed to the church? Sorry if that's too personal, I'm just interested for the sake of discussion.

Also, i want to make a clarification here:

I'm not "opposed" to the church. I'm opposed to a lack of critical thinking, logic, and rationale.

What makes you go from being a missionary asking people to re-evaluate their beliefs to a person who's completely unwilling to do the same?

[GeeBee]

I often just blare Slayer and Behemoth at full blast when they come to the door.

Christian bands?

/sarcasm.

[SanePsychotic]

There is reason to be rude to them. They're encroaching on my property and insinuating that I'm essentially "not doing it right" in regards to how I live my life. That's pretty much the rudest thing I can think of.

That may be the case with the missionaries that you've dealt with, but the missionaries I've dealt with just wanted to tell me about something that was important to them. I personally have no problem with listening to them for a few minutes, but I completely understand if you do have an issue with it. All I'm saying is that people shouldn't completely write off all missionaries and disrespect them. But surely we can agree to disagree.

[GeeBee]

That may be the case with the missionaries that you've dealt with, but the missionaries I've dealt with just wanted to tell me about something that was important to them. I personally have no problem with listening to them for a few minutes, but I completely understand if you do have an issue with it. All I'm saying is that people shouldn't completely write off all missionaries and disrespect them. But surely we can agree to disagree.

Sure, I'm all for being civil. But their very arrival presupposes on their part that they believe their product to be superior to the very product I am in possession of. I mean, really, have you ever met a vacuum salesman who goes door to door who admits that the vacuum you've got is better than the one he's peddling? Not bloody likely.

[SanePsychotic]

Sure, I'm all for being civil. But their very arrival presupposes on their part that they believe their product to be superior to the very product I am in possession of. I mean, really, have you ever met a vacuum salesman who goes door to door who admits that the vacuum you've got is better than the one he's peddling? Not bloody likely.

I see what you're saying. I guess the reason why I'm willing to listen to them is that I don't have any religious beliefs, so I don't really feel offended by them telling me that their way of life is better or that I'm going to hell. I just find them interesting.

[GeeBee]

I see what you're saying. I guess the reason why I'm willing to listen to them is that I don't have any religious beliefs, so I don't really feel offended by them telling me that their way of life is better or that I'm going to hell. I just find them interesting.

Yeah, i can see that. You're pretty much guaranteed an interesting convo if you let them in.

[golferpunk1]

Also, i want to make a clarification here:

I'm not "opposed" to the church. I'm opposed to a lack of critical thinking, logic, and rationale.

What makes you go from being a missionary asking people to re-evaluate their beliefs to a person who's completely unwilling to do the same?

I reevaluate my beliefs everyday, I just don't rely on other people's opinions to determine them.

[Dymytry Vance]

for the win.
thnx
Yeah, i can see that. You're pretty much guaranteed an interesting convo if you let them in.
this. :party: congrats on 4k.

[GeeBee]

I reevaluate my beliefs everyday, I just don't rely on other people's opinions to determine them.
No you don't. If you did, you'd know about the blatant problems facing the origins of the church, the historicity of the Bible, and even the notion that deity exists.

Is that how you deal with the cognitive dissonance? You just chalk up well-documented fact to "opinions"?

I'd be happy to discuss the LDS faith with you, but as long as the end result MUST be "the church is true" for you, you'll never be able to objectively analyze information and make an informed decision.

Ask yourself...if you were some Joe Schmoe on the street, and the missionaries gave YOU the first discussion...would YOU buy it? REALLY? My whole journey out started by trying to see if I would convert if I was an investigator...I ended up an atheist. So am I just crazy? Explain it to me.

But don't insult my intelligence by claiming I'm just going by the whims of "opinion". Pull your head out of the sand and do some actual research. Most of the most damning information isn't in so-called "anti-" material. It's right there in journals and discourses.
thnx

this. :party: congrats on 4k.
WOOT WOOT! Thanks man!

[Dymytry Vance]

WOOT WOOT! Thanks man!
You're welcome Kramer.

[ted is lying]

thnx

it is what i do

[Dymytry Vance]

it is what i do
You know what I do I use purple size 3 font underlined bolded and itlaicized to assist in the way my message is portrayed because god forbid somebody on the internet doesn't immediately read my message and think I'm the sex because I say the sex and use no punctuation because I am so scene and scene kids don't follow any rules except for following all scene kids rules which involve complete conformity

[ted is lying]

You know what I do I use purple size 3 font underlined bolded and itlaicized to assist in the way my message is portrayed because god forbid somebody on the internet doesn't immediately read my message and think I'm the sex because I say the sex and use no punctuation because I am so scene and scene kids don't follow any rules except for following all scene kids rules which involve complete conformity


Yup.

[GeeBee]

You know what I do I use purple size 3 font underlined bolded and itlaicized to assist in the way my message is portrayed because god forbid somebody on the internet doesn't immediately read my message and think I'm the sex because I say the sex and use no punctuation because I am so scene and scene kids don't follow any rules except for following all scene kids rules which involve complete conformity

YEAH! FUCK CONVENTION! NON-CONFORMITY FOR THE WIN!!!

[Dymytry Vance]

YEAH! FUCK CONVENTION! NON-CONFORMITY FOR THE WIN!!!
Screw you now scene is all about aquamarine size 3 tahoma bolded italicized underlined font and crabxcore and axdxdxixnxgx x in between randoxm words and adding core to random words to create different genres of music we will eventually take over the world in neon and girl pants and odd haircuts and weakness and bad musicx and xs and os because we used to enjoy atreyu but now listen to the devil wears prada and pther genericxcore and of course we still buttfuck each other because we are so scene and a scene crew has to buttfuck at vfw shows with other buttfucking "bisexual" scene kids we are a disgrace to all people struggling with their sexuality and I leave you with an x and an awesome scene lyric GIRL YOU MAKE MY PEE PEE HARD x

[ted is lying]

Screw you now scene is all about aquamarine size 3 tahoma bolded italicized underlined font and crabxcore and axdxdxixnxgx x in between randoxm words and adding core to random words to create different genres of music we will eventually take over the world in neon and girl pants and odd haircuts and weakness and bad musicx and xs and os because we used to enjoy atreyu but now listen to the devil wears prada and pther genericxcore and of course we still buttfuck each other because we are so scene and a scene crew has to buttfuck at vfw shows with other buttfucking "bisexual" scene kids we are a disgrace to all people struggling with their sexuality and I leave you with an x and an awesome scene lyric GIRL YOU MAKE MY PEE PEE HARD x
I couldnt of said that better myself.

[staticandclarity]

No you don't. If you did, you'd know about the blatant problems facing the origins of the church, the historicity of the Bible, and even the notion that deity exists.

Is that how you deal with the cognitive dissonance? You just chalk up well-documented fact to "opinions"?

I'd be happy to discuss the LDS faith with you, but as long as the end result MUST be "the church is true" for you, you'll never be able to objectively analyze information and make an informed decision.

Ask yourself...if you were some Joe Schmoe on the street, and the missionaries gave YOU the first discussion...would YOU buy it? REALLY? My whole journey out started by trying to see if I would convert if I was an investigator...I ended up an atheist. So am I just crazy? Explain it to me.

But don't insult my intelligence by claiming I'm just going by the whims of "opinion". Pull your head out of the sand and do some actual research. Most of the most damning information isn't in so-called "anti-" material. It's right there in journals and discourses.

WOOT WOOT! Thanks man!
there is always going to be an arguement for everything. and just because something is published or claimed to be genuine doesnt mean it to be true. the keystone to any religion is "FAITH"

anybody can sit here and go on and on and write books about how many holes there are in "____" religion. im pretty sure the idea of something being published whether its documents, journals etc. can be looked as genuine. thats what the entire marc hofman thing was basically a metaphor in my opinion. thats the difference between someone that can look upon all things and still attest to it being real or not. its called FAITH not stupidity. when a missionary being threatened with a loaded gun to denounce god and the entire gospel otherwise he gets a bullet in the head, sits there and still doesnt deny it, doesnt make him stupid, ill-informed, or just plain blind. it makes him a man of faith and following it.

[ted is lying]

there is always going to be an arguement for everything. and just because something is published or claimed to be genuine doesnt mean it to be true. the keystone to any religion is "FAITH"

anybody can sit here and go on and on and write books about how many holes there are in "____" religion. im pretty sure the idea of something being published whether its documents, journals etc. can be looked as genuine. thats what the entire marc hofman thing was basically a metaphor in my opinion. thats the difference between someone that can look upon all things and still attest to it being real or not. its called FAITH not stupidity. when a missionary being threatened with a loaded gun announcing to him to denounce god and the entire gospel otherwise he gets a bullet in the head, sits there and still doesnt deny it, doesnt make him stupid, ill-informed, or just plain blind. it makes him a man of faith and blindly following it.
There are no flaws in the cult of the bulb.

[staticandclarity]

There are no flaws in the cult of the bulb.
haha well you guys have everything i've been looking for

[ted is lying]

haha well you guys have everything i've been looking for
Go around and turn on everything electrical that you possibly can, so jesus can be all around us and give us nice things.

[GeeBee]

there is always going to be an arguement for everything. and just because something is published or claimed to be genuine doesnt mean it to be true. the keystone to any religion is "FAITH"

anybody can sit here and go on and on and write books about how many holes there are in "____" religion. im pretty sure the idea of something being published whether its documents, journals etc. can be looked as genuine. thats what the entire marc hofman thing was basically a metaphor in my opinion. thats the difference between someone that can look upon all things and still attest to it being real or not. its called FAITH not stupidity. when a missionary being threatened with a loaded gun to denounce god and the entire gospel otherwise he gets a bullet in the head, sits there and still doesnt deny it, doesnt make him stupid, ill-informed, or just plain blind. it makes him a man of faith and following it.

Please differentiate between "faith" and "delusion" for me. Faith is not a virtue in and of itself.

It's one thing to have faith where there is no evidence. It's quite another to have faith where the evidence is copious, but against you.

The Mark Hoffman affair was anything but a metaphor. It was a perfect demonstration of how a relatively young church was so frightened of its sordid past that it did whatever it could to suppress damning evidence.

I suppose if unsubstantiated claims are worth dying over...have at it.

[staticandclarity]

Please differentiate between "faith" and "delusion" for me. Faith is not a virtue in and of itself.

It's one thing to have faith where there is no evidence. It's quite another to have faith where the evidence is copious, but against you.

The Mark Hoffman affair was anything but a metaphor. It was a perfect demonstration of how a relatively young church was so frightened of its sordid past that it did whatever it could to suppress damning evidence.

I suppose if unsubstantiated claims are worth dying over...have at it.
using a word like delusion next to the word faith is entirely poor choice. people die over what they believe in everyday. it would be silly to point the finger at them and call them delusional for doing so.

and of course it can be looked at as a metaphor. some guy using his knowledge about the church just to, in his own words, "Reshape" the history. It was looked to him as just a game. and a way to make money.

[GeeBee]

using a word like delusion next to the word faith is entirely poor choice. people die over what they believe in everyday. it would be silly to the point the finger at them and call them delusional for doing so.

and of course it can be looked at as a metaphor. some guy using his knowledge about the church just to, in his own words, "Reshape" the history. It was looked to him as just a game. and a way to make money.

I asked you do tell me, in your view, the difference between the two. Please do so. How is one to know the difference between faith and delusion? Would me having faith in fairies and dragons be any less valid than faith in the Book of Mormon? There's equal empirical evidence for both of them being literally true...zero.

I think it's rather silly to die over a belief that you can't substantiate. Also, these people are dying over beliefs that largely contradict each other...they can't ALL be right...so at least a few hapless bastards have died for no good reason other than their stubborn clinging to "beliefs" that they had no good reason to believe in.

Also, I don't think you know what a metaphor is.

[staticandclarity]

I asked you do tell me, in your view, the difference between the two. Please do so. How is one to know the difference between faith and delusion? Would me having faith in fairies and dragons be any less valid than faith in the Book of Mormon? There's equal empirical evidence for both of them being literally true...zero.

I think it's rather silly to die over a belief that you can't substantiate. Also, these people are dying over beliefs that largely contradict each other...they can't ALL be right...so at least a few hapless bastards have died for no good reason other than their stubborn clinging to "beliefs" that they had no good reason to believe in.

Also, I don't think you know what a metaphor is.
really? so going ahead and insulting me then? that was quick.

I am not saying that every person believing in a religion is faithful. or has true faith in it. a lot of people do follow blindly and dont make a decision for themselves. and feel pressure by society within. or missionaries that go due to that pressure and not out of just wanting to go.

i do know the difference between metaphor and something being symbolic. so i will change my statement to it was more symbolic the whole marc hofman story.

anybody can look at religion and say historically, it doesnt match up. my point originally that there is an argument for everything. maybe some people chose to apostate because they were making decisions in their life that werent matching up to what they were brought up in. and it was just easier believing that when you die nothing happens. there are no consequences for your actions.

so seemingly life got easier and didnt have the burden to carry.
IMO. most people that became apostate based on the entire marc hofman issue is dumbfounding. those to me are more sheep like people than people that go to church every sunday because they believe something.

[GeeBee]

really? so going ahead and insulting me then? that was quick.

I am not saying that every person believing in a religion is faithful. or has true faith in it. a lot of people do follow blindly and dont make a decision for themselves. and feel pressure by society within. or missionaries that go due to that pressure and not out of just wanting to go.

i do know the difference between metaphor and something being symbolic. so i will change my statement to it was more symbolic the whole marc hofman story.

anybody can look at religion and say historically, it doesnt match up. my point originally that there is an argument for everything. maybe some people chose to apostate because they were making decisions in their life that werent matching up to what they were brought up in. and it was just easier believing that when you die nothing happens. there are no consequences for your actions.

so seemingly life got easier and didnt have the burden to carry.
IMO. most people that became apostate based on the entire marc hofman issue is dumbfounding. those to me are more sheep like people that people that go to church every sunday because they believe something.

There may be an argument for everything. But not necessarily a good one. Again, back to fairies...there's no good argument for believing in fairies. Sorry.

For all you know, when you die, nothing happens. Fear is the shittiest and most juvenile motivator for any action. If the only reason you're a good person on earth is because you're scared about what may happen after you die (even though there's ZERO evidence of an afterlife), you need therapy.

People apostatized as a result of the crippling fear the church leadership showed at anything that may disparage "official" church history. It had more to do with their actions than those of Hoffman.

[GeeBee]

really?
Still waiting on you to explain the difference between faith and delusion to me.

[staticandclarity]

There may be an argument for everything. But not necessarily a good one. Again, back to fairies...there's no good argument for believing in fairies. Sorry.

For all you know, when you die, nothing happens. Fear is the shittiest and most juvenile motivator for any action. If the only reason you're a good person on earth is because you're scared about what may happen after you die (even though there's ZERO evidence of an afterlife), you need therapy.

People apostatized as a result of the crippling fear the church leadership showed at anything that may disparage "official" church history. It had more to do with their actions than those of Hoffman.
im not sure why fairies is continually being brought up except for the reason of comparing the idea of god to a mythological creature. and i know your replying statement would be "god is a mythological creature" so its pointless.

i think there are a lot of amazing people that have good hearts and do good things and have strong morals based solely on how they were raised but just what they believe in. not out of fear.

when people seek out to tear down what someone believes in out of spite, jealousy, and pure desire for money, its hard to even comprehend what they say to have any sort of validation just because they say so. i dont believe in listening to the news because its a pointless cycle. its all filtered anyway.

[staticandclarity]

Still waiting on you to explain the difference between faith and delusion to me.
it would be pointless because your idea on faith is that it is delusion. thats the impression i got. its pointless. so me explaining it would just be pointless

[GeeBee]

im not sure why fairies is continually being brought up except for the reason of comparing the idea of god to a mythological creature. and i know your replying statement would be "god is a mythological creature" so its pointless.

i think a lot there are a lot of amazing people that have good hearts and do good things and have strong morals based solely on how they were raised but just what they believe in. not out of fear.

when people seek out to tear down what someone believes in out of spite, jealousy, and pure desire for money, its hard to even comprehend what they say to have any sort of validation just because they say so. i dont believe in listening to the news because its a pointless cycle. its all filtered anyway.

Yeah, I don't know what the fuck the news has to do with anything. I think we're done here.

[GeeBee]

it would be pointless because your idea on faith is that it is delusion. thats the impression i got. its pointless. so me explaining it would just be pointless

Yeah, just admit you can't and move on.

[staticandclarity]

Yeah, I don't know what the fuck the news has to do with anything. I think we're done here.
because the news is based on opinions. just like your "facts" that comprimise your opinions. thank you for deciding when a conversation is over.

[staticandclarity]

Yeah, just admit you can't and move on.
and i can. just because i choose not to doesnt mean im surrendering. or "you got me". it just is pointless. im not trying to sit here and tell you what you believe is wrong. because i could just say your idea of Atheism is dumbfounding and delusional. but im not. thats not at all the point i've been trying to make.

[GeeBee]

because the news is based on opinions. just like your "facts" that comprimise your opinions. thank you for deciding when a conversation is over.

It is over. You're obviously not educated enough to carry on any sort of discourse with. Read the above again and ask yourself why anyone would want to talk with you after reading it. And then don't bother replying, because I'm putting you on my ignore list. Then go take a philosophy class.

[GeeBee]

and i can. just because i choose not to doesnt mean im surrendering. or "you got me". it just is pointless. im not trying to sit here and tell you what you believe is wrong.

"I can...I just choose not to"
:rolleyes:

[staticandclarity]

"I can...I just choose not to"
:rolleyes:
its funny because instead of just having a conversation or even debate, you are just ignoring and quickly ending it. very mature.

[golferpunk1]

No you don't. If you did, you'd know about the blatant problems facing the origins of the church, the historicity of the Bible, and even the notion that deity exists.

Is that how you deal with the cognitive dissonance? You just chalk up well-documented fact to "opinions"?

I'd be happy to discuss the LDS faith with you, but as long as the end result MUST be "the church is true" for you, you'll never be able to objectively analyze information and make an informed decision.

Ask yourself...if you were some Joe Schmoe on the street, and the missionaries gave YOU the first discussion...would YOU buy it? REALLY? My whole journey out started by trying to see if I would convert if I was an investigator...I ended up an atheist. So am I just crazy? Explain it to me.

But don't insult my intelligence by claiming I'm just going by the whims of "opinion". Pull your head out of the sand and do some actual research. Most of the most damning information isn't in so-called "anti-" material. It's right there in journals and discourses.

WOOT WOOT! Thanks man!

I appreciate your points and to be honest it has sparked my interest in researching more about what you're talking about. The thing is that I'm sure you've heard a million times and probably taught while you were a missionary is that I do what feels right to me. For me it's simple, if presented with a principle or point of doctrine I pray about it and I gain my own affirmation that it is true. I know for someone who is atheist this is kind of a mute point to argue because who exactly do you pray to if there is no god. I could research for the rest of my life and still not find every answer but I can just live by what I feel is right and for now it is the LDS faith and i don't see it changing. I appreciate your points though because they've really got me thinking and I think that's whats good about discussion. You're a good man.

[GeeBee]

I appreciate your points and to be honest it has sparked my interest in researching more about what you're talking about. The thing is that I'm sure you've heard a million times and probably taught while you were a missionary is that I do what feels right to me. For me it's simple, if presented with a principle or point of doctrine I pray about it and I gain my own affirmation that it is true. I know for someone who is atheist this is kind of a mute point to argue because who exactly do you pray to if there is no god. I could research for the rest of my life and still not find every answer but I can just live by what I feel is right and for now it is the LDS faith and i don't see it changing. I appreciate your points though because they've really got me thinking and I think that's whats good about discussion. You're a good man.

To be honest...there's nothing wrong with that. You gotta make life livable, right?

You DO have to sift through alot of nonsense (anti) stuff to find the actual, objective, historically accurate stuff, but it's out there. If you want pointers, you know where to find me. And, I can promise no pressure. I still love the good stuff about the church.

What part of SLC you from?

[Dymytry Vance]

I couldnt of said that better myself.
You all are poseurs.... I spell poseur like that for no reason except is is scene and I enjoy sceneness I would thank you for the compliment but instead I will disreagard it and treat you as an inferior character in this anime flick called life I R SCENE x

[ted is lying]

You all are poseurs.... I spell poseur like that for no reason except is is scene and I enjoy sceneness I would thank you for the compliment but instead I will disreagard it and treat you as an inferior character in this anime flick called life I R SCENE x
why you right(meant to use this right cause your wrong) is twice back to back?

[Dymytry Vance]

why you right(meant to use this right cause your wrong) is twice back to back?
I hope you know I was being sarcastic. However I read that post 5 times and still have no idea what it means. Elucidate?

[ted is lying]

I hope you know I was being sarcastic. However I read that post 5 times and still have no idea what it means. Elucidate?
Like a cow with binoculars, sometimes lesbains have all the fun with matches.

[Inc.onsolable]

I'm atheist. I believe that this religion shit is shit. I cannot make myself believe in an afterlife that involves you not living your first life to the fullest, nor do I believe in half the shit any religion says. So now you know my standpoint on it.


Last year one of these really rude, passive-aggressive Scientologists (CULT) was trying to give me a free "Holy Book" (sci-fi novel written by a psychopath and was taken way too seriously by druggies) called Dianetics. I laughed and told him that if we're alien spirits that have been deposited in a volcano by some alien with fighter planes and is named Lord Xenu then I hasve Prince William and Garry Glitter having anal in my living room while wearing nazi perophenilia or some shit like that. They were persistent so I followed one of the really annoying ones door to door and as they were talking I yelled, "Nothing Happens When you Die..." or, "Don't Let Them In, They Will Steal Your Food And Throw Anthrax At You." They started threatening to sue me for harrassment, so I screamed "I need an adult" and ran like Hell. I think they left after that.

Woah.

And I thought Scientologists were crazy.

But your said reaction has me thinking you need some form of therapy. :)

[Dymytry Vance]

Woah.

And I thought Scientologists were crazy.

But your said reaction has me thinking you need some form of therapy. :)
lol thnx
Like a cow with binoculars, sometimes lesbains have all the fun with matches.
...

[Here It Goes]

So, just out of curiosity, I wonder what people's take is on the Biblical prophecies that have been fulfilled in the past?

[Inc.onsolable]

So, just out of curiosity, I wonder what people's take is on the Biblical prophecies that have been fulfilled in the past?

Gee, there are so many. State one.

[Here It Goes]

Gee, there are so many. State one.

I believe it's the end of Isaiah chapter 44, and the start of chapter 45, that states that Cyrus would be the one appointed by God to overtake the Babylonians. It even said that the two-leaved doors at the gates of Babylon would be left open, and that's exactly what happened over 200 years later.

Then there's the one in Daniel about the ram and the he-goat, one of which represented the nation of Greece. It goes on to describe how the he-goat had one mighty horn which was broken off in battle, and four smaller horns popped up in it's place but none with the power of the original horn (represented by Alexander the Great, and then his 4 inferior successors, Lysimachus, Nicator, Cassander, and Seleceus.)

There's also a pretty accurate timeline propechy of Jesus' birth given, I believe in Daniel chapter 9. If you use the "weeks of years" prophecy given there, and work forward from 455 B.C.E., which I think was when the Jews returned to Jerusalem, it takes you straight to 29 C.E., the year Jesus was anointed as the Messiah.

[GeeBee]

I believe it's the end of Isaiah chapter 44, and the start of chapter 45, that states that Cyrus would be the one appointed by God to overtake the Babylonians. It even said that the two-leaved doors at the gates of Babylon would be left open, and that's exactly what happened over 200 years later.

Then there's the one in Daniel about the ram and the he-goat, one of which represented the nation of Greece. It goes on to describe how the he-goat had one mighty horn which was broken off in battle, and four smaller horns popped up in it's place but none with the power of the original horn (represented by Alexander the Great, and then his 4 inferior successors, Lysimachus, Nicator, Cassander, and Seleceus.)

There's also a pretty accurate timeline propechy of Jesus' birth given, I believe in Daniel chapter 9. If you use the "weeks of years" prophecy given there, and work forward from 455 B.C.E., which I think was when the Jews returned to Jerusalem, it takes you straight to 29 C.E., the year Jesus was anointed as the Messiah.

Again...all of this stuff is explained by a mere CURSORY reading of the historicity of the bible by a halfway decent biblical scholar/historian. I'd start with Herzog or Finkelstein.

[poo-lay]

i just say fuck religion...slam the door...

easy...

[ted is lying]

I need a battery for my fiero.

[AloneInTheDark]

Last time they came to my door (about a week ago), I told them, "hold on, I think my boyfriend might want to hear this, let me go get him", no joke, when I came back up they were gone!

[abusedcat]

Apparently when I was like 8 I slammed the door on a Jehovah's Witnesses face.