The Starting Line Vs. Spitalfield

[xapplexpiex]

I know this site respects both of these bands, so I decided to give them a chance. I'm really liking Remember Right Now, but I don't really like some of The Starting Line's lyrics...at all. That's my initial opinion since I haven't listened to both bands enough. But I enjoy discovering new bands, so ya gotta love ap.net. My vote is going to Spitalfield as of right now.

[TSLROCKS]

TSL. Never listened to Spitalfield

[I am Mick]

Starting Line hands down

[MattRM]

It's really tough for me to turn down Spitalfield, but I'd probably have to say TSL, too.

[saysmydoctor]

The Starting Line is one of the most boring bands on Earth, so Spitalfield.

/minority

[ThisIsNotDan]

The Starting Line, easily, although I love "I Loved The Way She Said LA" more than any TSL song I think

[seraph1214]

Both bands are amazing, but TSL is one of my all time faves.

[sodamnclever]

Tough poll, went for TSL.

[sinkinginthesea]

The Starting Line. This shouldn't even be an argument.

[eman83]

TSL rocks

[mattplayscheap]

well we all know that the only reason TSL is being picked over Spitalfield is because TSL had a lot more success especially slight mainstream success. Honestly, when have you seen Spitalfield on mtv or fuse other than those late night 3am shows or on that Victory Records tv show (which even then they werent on that) ...the only real time was probably on the show were you had to vote on which videos the keep or lose.... but TSL was frequently on tv... I did pick Spitalfield because they mean more to me! Mark Rose is one of the most amazing people ive ever met!

[Momo32T]

Both were very influential to me in high school. But there is just something about Say It Like You Mean It that just gives me such nostalgic joy. Spitalfield has some great songs, but I feel that The Starting Line has had more complete albums overall.

[anthonydarko]

I had to go with Spitalfield, I have more memories attached to them versus TSL.

[Lirr168]

Spitalfield is good, but they sound kinda generic to me. TSL hooked me in from the first time I heard them.

[kazuma_ootaro28]

Are you kidding me? Spitalfield!

[TakeLotsWithAlcohol]

Stop Doing Bad Things>TSL's discography.

[MattRM]

well we all know that the only reason TSL is being picked over Spitalfield is because TSL had a lot more success especially slight mainstream success. Honestly, when have you seen Spitalfield on mtv or fuse other than those late night 3am shows or on that Victory Records tv show (which even then they werent on that) ...the only real time was probably on the show were you had to vote on which videos the keep or lose.... but TSL was frequently on tv... I did pick Spitalfield because they mean more to me! Mark Rose is one of the most amazing people ive ever met!
Uhh, no. I'm pretty sure no one is picking TSL just because they were on MTV a few times.

[Theseventhson]

Spitalfield, I never could get into TSL.

[friskycurtain]

TSL. Never heard of Spitalfield

[introduction]

i can't see spitalfield winning this.

[mattplayscheap]

Uhh, no. I'm pretty sure no one is picking TSL just because they were on MTV a few times.
yes ok but look at what i said.....
what i meant was that over all TSL is a much more of a well known band.
i was only adding that they also have a little more over Spitalfield because they were exposed to a little more success.

Think about it this way... take two venues and have TSL play at one and Spitalfield play at the other... then count the amount of people at each concert. I am just saying that TSL would have more people and possibly might even sell out that show.... Remember this is coming from a person who picked Spitalfield!

[benn10]

well we all know that the only reason TSL is being picked over Spitalfield is because TSL had a lot more success especially slight mainstream success. Honestly, when have you seen Spitalfield on mtv or fuse other than those late night 3am shows or on that Victory Records tv show (which even then they werent on that) ...the only real time was probably on the show were you had to vote on which videos the keep or lose.... but TSL was frequently on tv... I did pick Spitalfield because they mean more to me! Mark Rose is one of the most amazing people ive ever met!


No, I think it's because more people genuinely like The Starting Line better than Spitalfield.

[SophGod]

i've only heard about 3 songs by each so i can't exactly say. but from what i've heard, i prefer TSL, that said i need to get into both of them a lot more.

[Mibabalou]

tsl

[MattRM]

TSL. Never heard of Spitalfield
Stop posting immediately and listen to Remember Right Now plz.

[kearn1tm]

I like The Starting Line. That Directions album is a really polished and enjoyable (to me, anyway) Pop Rock album. It's nice when I want something catchy and easy to digest.

Therefor, them. They're both pretty trite powerpop though. It's not really "apples and oranges," but "golden delicious or Fuji."

[briewer]

Spitalfield, because they were the first band I saw live.

Oh, and because TSL sucks.

[briewer]

Stop posting immediately and listen to Remember Right Now plz.
Word. RRN is wonderful.

[TheHays]

TSL. Never listened to Spitalfield

How is this even possible?!?!

[MKEcasey]

I went with TSL, but the decision wasn't easy. There are easily some Spitalfield songs that I feel blow TSL out of the water. But in terms of entire albums, I was into more TSL ones start to finish.

[Smeee]

Never listened to Spitalfield to be honest. And I love TSL.

[muttley]

Love 'em both, but I'm gonna' have to give it to The Starting Line. I gotten into everything they've released. I can't really say the same for Spitalfield.

[Smotown]

Tough choice... But, Spitalfield will take this for me. I could listen to every single Spitalfield album/ep start to finish.. where as there are a few TSL songs I'd like to skip over. Plus, I just have more history with Spitalfield.

[theguy77]

i still never got the TSL hype, and spitalfield were interesting when i was 14 but overall they were just another band among bands. im completely impartial to this poll.

[kearn1tm]

i still never got the TSL hype, and spitalfield were interesting when i was 14 but overall they were just another band among bands. im completely impartial to this poll.

I never understand why people use the phrase "I never got why [artist] are popular." Anyone who says this - look at the context. Ryan, they're part of a scene that was quite trendy for a period of time, recipients of a massive amount of buzz and they play easily-processed pop rock. How do you not understand why they're particularly popular? That's not a commentary on their quality, but the elements of their sound/scene that are marketable.

[theguy77]

I never understand why people use the phrase "I never got why [artist] are popular." Anyone who says this - look at the context. Ryan, they're part of a scene that was quite trendy for a period of time, recipients of a massive amount of buzz and they play easily-processed pop rock. How do you not understand why they're particularly popular? That's not a commentary on their quality, but the elements of their sound/scene that are marketable.

i know, but they came at a time when a revisioned version of pop-punk was gathering a following. you had a different version with more brooding emotions and a vague sense of tongue-in-cheek wit in the lyrics, and more variety in the dynamic and energy of the music (specifically in the verses) given the influence of post-hardcore. the starting line were not one of those bands and yet, they're mentioned in the same breath. thats what i dont tend to understand.

[kearn1tm]

i know, but they came at a time when a revisioned version of pop-punk was gathering a following. you had a different version with more brooding emotions and a vague sense of tongue-in-cheek wit in the lyrics, and more variety in the dynamic and energy of the music (specifically in the verses) given the influence of post-hardcore. the starting line were not one of those bands and yet, they're mentioned in the same breath. thats what i dont tend to understand.

Uh, they were hot around that '04-'06 ish time, right? Cartel, Paramore, Fall Out Boy, Mayday Parade, All Time Low, the Early November, they're all pretty similar pop rock that received varying levels of popularity. "Revisioned version of Pop Punk?"

How does All Time Low resemble anything Post-Hardcore influenced? Where is this "vague sense of tongue-in-cheek wit" in Cartel's tracks that didn't exist before 2005? C'mon.

[theguy77]

Uh, they were hot around that '04-'06 ish time, right? Cartel, Paramore, Fall Out Boy, Mayday Parade, All Time Low, the Early November, they're all pretty similar pop rock. "Revisioned version of Pop Punk?"

this style of pop-punk that you're talking about became prevalent closer to '06, '07 (with fall out boy leading the way in 2005.) the album that most people credit TSL for (Say It Like You Mean It) came out in '02, alongside bands like the early november, thursday, brand new (as they were evolving into the deja sound), northstar, and the early november. i guess you could mention hidden in plain view and rufio as well, and *cough* senses fail but they fucking suck. thats the scene of music that was getting love around this site at that time ('02-'04) so its kind of surprising that TSL, a band that was more in line with the new found glory and/or relient k sound that got started in '99 and '00, received as much of that new wave of pop-punk hype considering they brought nothing new to the table.

the kind of music im talking about, was incorrectly defined as "emo", pretty much the so-called "third wave" of the term's bastardization. the starting line was not the kind of band that would be called "emo", at least not as the kids at my high school defined it at the time. they were strictly "pop-punk" while the other bands i'd mentioned were part of that other trend.

[oddwithoutend]

Pop punk fight!

[kearn1tm]

this style of pop-punk that you're talking about became prevalent closer to '06, '07 (with fall out boy leading the way in 2005.) the album that most people credit TSL for (Say It Like You Mean It) came out in '02, alongside bands like the early november, thursday, brand new (as they were evolving into the deja sound), northstar, and the early november. i guess you could mention hidden in plain view and rufio as well, and *cough* senses fail but they fucking suck. thats the scene of music that was getting love around this site at that time ('02-'04) so its kind of surprising that TSL, a band that was more in line with the new found glory and/or relient k sound that got started in '99 and '00, received as much of that new wave of pop-punk hype considering they brought nothing new to the table.

Sure, okay, but then you have the fact that they're a super catchy band with all the histrionics of the bands you just mentioned, but even more accessible to mainstream crowds. How is that not a formula for buzz/popularity?

the kind of music im talking about, was incorrectly defined as "emo", pretty much the so-called "third wave" of the term's bastardization.
Are you really preaching this junk to me? Really?

the starting line was not the kind of band that would be called "emo", at least not as the kids at my high school defined it at the time. they were strictly "pop-punk" while the other bands i'd mentioned were part of that other trend.
That's funny, 'cause as someone who was actually 15-17 when the bands you were mentioning above were getting big and being a flaming scene kid, all my friends were calling this band Emo. I have an issue of Alt Press talking about them from, what, '04 calling them "the new face of Emo." Yeah, I think they were as lumped in to that scene as anyone else.

[theguy77]

Sure, okay, but then you have the fact that they're a super catchy band with all the histrionics of the bands you just mentioned, but even more accessible to mainstream crowds. How is that not a formula for buzz/popularity?

i dont at all think they had the same histrionics or music influences as those bands. outside of the fact that they had youthful voices and had fast power chords played in their choruses, the two groups of bands wrote their music and lyrics entirely differently. while i'd consider the early november and thursday pop-punk bands, i see little overlap between albums like War All The Time or The Room's Too Cold when we're comparing them to... well, anything TSL released. funny enough though, kenny vasoli is featured on one of The Room's Too Cold''s more upbeat songs.

Are you really preaching this junk to me? Really?

That's funny, 'cause as someone who was actually 15-17 when the bands you were mentioning above were getting big and being a flaming scene kid, all my friends were calling this band Emo. I have an issue of Alt Press talking about them from, what, '04 calling them "the new face of Emo." Yeah, I think they were as lumped in to that scene as anyone else.
ahh, well i guess my friends and your friends had different definitions. i'd personally attributed "emo" to the more brooding emotions, greater variety in dynamic and energy in the verses and bridges, and the fact that they at least attempted to be clever with their lyrics at the time. any band that was simply catchy and youthful without those traits was merely "pop-punk".

[more heart]

Is there a third choice because this is way too hard for me.

[x togepi x]

dude. when whatever the fuck the starting line's first big single hit MTV was, everyone was calling them emo.

and what the fuck? thursday's a pop punk band?

I'm totally going to start making up things. slayer is dream pop. fall out boy is death metal. devo was grunge. queen is grindcore.

[introduction]

Stop posting immediately and listen to Remember Right Now plz.

i was referring to the popularity tsl have on this website compared to spitalfield.

[MattRM]

i was referring to the popularity tsl have on this website compared to spitalfield.
Ha, quoted the wrong post, meant to quote the one above yours. Sorry!

[theguy77]

dude. when whatever the fuck the starting line's first big single hit MTV was, everyone was calling them emo.

and what the fuck? thursday's a pop punk band?

I'm totally going to start making up things. slayer is dream pop. fall out boy is death metal. devo was grunge. queen is grindcore.

what do you consider thursday? do you think they pay enough tribute to their screamo and post-hardcore influences to be called post-hardcore themselves?

[x togepi x]

what do you consider thursday? do you think they pay enough tribute to their screamo and post-hardcore influences to be called post-hardcore themselves?

well considering they sound nothing like the ramones or the descendents, they're not a pop punk band.

[theguy77]

well considering they sound nothing like the ramones or the descendents, they're not a pop punk band.

haha, well neither are any of the bands we're talking about. we're speaking in context of misuse of the genre names.

[x togepi x]

haha, well neither are any of the bands we're talking about. we're speaking in context of misuse of the genre names.

why would we want to purposely mislabel something?

[theguy77]

why would we want to purposely mislabel something?

well i wouldnt if i was discussing this with you because i know its something you feel is important. but todd and i dont really see the need to go out of our way to make meticulous distinctions (you saw how he reacted to the fact that i was explaining the fact that "emo" is misused"), especially since we can both assume that we're speaking in terms of the common misconceptions, so theres no lapse of communication. i guess we could be saying pop-rock, but for the purposes of this discussion, scene music needs to be separated somehow. maybe calling it pop-punk isnt the correct way to do it, but it is the easiest considering thats a popular misconception.

[x togepi x]

well i wouldnt if i was discussing this with you because i know its something you feel is important. but todd and i dont really see the need to go out of our way to make meticulous distinctions (you saw how he reacted to the fact that i was explaining the fact that "emo" is misused"), especially since we can both assume that we're speaking in terms of the common misconceptions, so theres no lapse of communication. i guess we could be saying pop-rock, but for the purposes of this discussion, scene music needs to be separated somehow. maybe calling it pop-punk isnt the correct way to do it, but it is the easiest considering thats a popular misconception.

but the point here is, if you want to talk within the context of misuses, a context has to exist. I don't think anyone besides you refers to thursday as a pop punk band. I've never heard of it. i can see why they'd be called emo or screamo or hardcore or whatever but pop punk?

[theguy77]

but the point here is, if you want to talk within the context of misuses, a context has to exist. I don't think anyone besides you refers to thursday as a pop punk band. I've never heard of it. i can see why they'd be called emo or screamo or hardcore or whatever but pop punk?

haha come to think of it i guess i dont have much of a reason other than my own past misconceptions. i called them emo along with a lot of bands i listened to, until i joined this site and learned the hard way what emo really is. i then found that it was more kosher to call most of the bands i listened to pop-punk even though it went against a distinction i had made before. then later i learned that the word "pop-punk" was wrong too, which is when i went through that phase of calling it "fake pop-punk" before i just kind of decided i didnt care anymore haha, so thats where it kind of stayed.

so i guess i mostly label thursday that way because i associate them with a lot of the other bands i listened to ages 14-17. problem is, a lot of those bands are commonly mislabeled as pop-punk, while as you said thursday never is.

[x togepi x]

haha come to think of it i guess i dont have much of a reason other than my own past misconceptions. i called them emo along with a lot of bands i listened to, until i joined this site and learned the hard way what emo really is. i then found that it was more kosher to call most of the bands i listened to pop-punk even though it went against a distinction i had made before. then later i learned that the word "pop-punk" was wrong too, which is when i went through that phase of calling it "fake pop-punk" before i just kind of decided i didnt care anymore haha, so thats where it kind of stayed.

so i guess i mostly label thursday that way because i associate them with a lot of the other bands i listened to ages 14-17. problem is, a lot of those bands are commonly mislabeled as pop-punk, while as you said thursday never is.

You know you can call bands emo without them being emo if you just throw the word mall in front of it. it makes you look smart and people know what you're talking about.

[theguy77]

You know you can call bands emo without them being emo if you just throw the word mall in front of it. it makes you look smart and people know what you're talking about.

haha, true that. maybe i'll start doing it.

[x togepi x]

it's what all the kool kids do.

[FBTMOPenguins]

TSL. Never listened to Spitalfield

Korn because Jonathan Davis succumbed to aids today.

[HometownHero]

well we all know that the only reason TSL is being picked over Spitalfield is because TSL had a lot more success especially slight mainstream success. Honestly, when have you seen Spitalfield on mtv or fuse other than those late night 3am shows or on that Victory Records tv show (which even then they werent on that) ...the only real time was probably on the show were you had to vote on which videos the keep or lose.... but TSL was frequently on tv... I did pick Spitalfield because they mean more to me! Mark Rose is one of the most amazing people ive ever met!
Nope. They are being picked cause they are better

[tonighttonight0]

Its Spitalfield for me right now

[kearn1tm]

i dont at all think they had the same histrionics

I think you're completely wrong.

or music influences as those bands. outside of the fact that they had youthful voices and had fast power chords played in their choruses, the two groups of bands wrote their music and lyrics entirely differently.

No shit? Tell Kenny I said "dude, you're rad."

while i'd consider the early november and thursday pop-punk bands,

You'd be wrong.

i see little overlap between albums like War All The Time or The Room's Too Cold when we're comparing them to... well, anything TSL released. funny enough though, kenny vasoli is featured on one of The Room's Too Cold''s more upbeat songs.

I suppose it's more...pop-ish, but how can you listen to Based on a True Story and not accept it came at a time (2005) when Fall Out Boy was breaking through, when the Academy Is...was getting signed, years after the Ataris got huge, after (wait for it) Spitalfield's Remember Right Now (2003) came out and got buzz all over Alt Press and AP.net. This sound was very much ingrained in the scene.


ahh, well i guess my friends and your friends had different definitions. i'd personally attributed "emo" to the more brooding emotions, greater variety in dynamic and energy in the verses and bridges

What is "dynamic and energy?" Is that one of your made-up things, Ryan? I mean, where's the gauge for "energy" in music. Have you measured this energy, Ryan?

and the fact that they at least attempted to be clever with their lyrics at the time.

This makes absolutely no sense...at all. Sorry dude. You're inferring things that, well, are subjective and not really there. TBS and MIDTOWN WERE MORE CLEVER THAN TEH STARTING CARTEL BOY!

[kearn1tm]

dude. when whatever the fuck the starting line's first big single hit MTV was, everyone was calling them emo.

and what the fuck? thursday's a pop punk band?

I'm totally going to start making up things. slayer is dream pop. fall out boy is death metal. devo was grunge. queen is grindcore.

See Ryan. This. Stop being wrong about everything ever, guy.

What it comes down to is this - it's not odd at all that a band like TSL were big and garnered such a strong response from scene fans of the time. They sounded like many of the powerpop bands of the time, and were precursors to many other scene bands that got big later, as well as having that emotional-angst that everyone loved. They were often lumped in with that faux-emo scene stuff early from the decade, signed to a scene label and covered by scene press.

This shouldn't be surprising to anyone.

[IntoTheSun]

:lurking:

[ThePartialGlow]

I prefer Midtown and early TBS to either of these bands.

[Illadelphia]

The Starting Line just by a little, it depends really...

[theguy77]

I suppose it's more...pop-ish, but how can you listen to Based on a True Story and not accept it came at a time (2005) when Fall Out Boy was breaking through, when the Academy Is...was getting signed, years after the Ataris got huge, after (wait for it) Spitalfield's Remember Right Now (2003) came out and got buzz all over Alt Press and AP.net. This sound was very much ingrained in the scene.

sigh. whatever dude. im not even talking about that album because the one that got them hype on THIS site was released in '02, and i just feel that it didnt have the same appeal as other albums released around that time. but thats subjective in the first place, which is why i came in saying, "i dont understand the hype", instead of dismissing or attacking the hype because its obviously there for a reason.

What is "dynamic and energy?" Is that one of your made-up things, Ryan? I mean, where's the gauge for "energy" in music. Have you measured this energy, Ryan?
technically energy is song speed relative to the tempo, and can definitely be measured by how regular and frequent the strumming is (16th notes generally constitute a song i'd call energetic, and if there's no guitar strumming it can go hand in hand with a constant snare drum at every other eighth note) and dynamic refers to volume (in a classical sense, piano vs. forte and things such as crescendos, diminuendos, and sforzandos), so that can be measured by comparing the decibel levels (although since music has so much compression in the modern age, the disparity in the decibel levels is much smaller, even though it can still be perceived by the ear). theres no subjective presumption in affirming that most of the early november's songs had a perfectly clear variance in dynamic and tempo while the starting line, not nearly as much.

This makes absolutely no sense...at all. Sorry dude. You're inferring things that, well, are subjective and not really there. TBS and MIDTOWN WERE MORE CLEVER THAN TEH STARTING CARTEL BOY!
i mean, if you're not gonna take my argument seriously because you disagree with it, then its best if we just stop now. im not saying they were more clever, but that they had the affectation of "cleverness" and artistry that was absent in TSL's lyrics, thus contributing to a different aesthetic which merely appealed to me more when i was younger. (and anyway where did midtown come from?) but i mean theres an obvious difference between the writing styles and aesthetic in this:


Falling from the top floor your lungs
fill like parachutes
windows go rushing by.
People inside,
dressed for the funeral in black and white.
These ties strangle our necks, hanging in the closet,
trapped in the cubicle;
without a name, just numbers, on the resume stored in the mainframe, marked for delete.
and this:

Turn our music down
And we whisper
"Say what you're thinking right now"

Tell me what you thought about when you were gone
And so alone
The worst is over
You can have the best of me
We got older
But we're still young
We never grew out of this feeling that we wont give up

[theguy77]

both music forms do sound juvenile and amateur, yes, and its easy to lump them together because of that. the youthful-sounding vocals also contribute. im not trying to marginalize and say one band is objectively better than another, but im just saying the music had divisively different characteristics. i dont know how you can think these two bands were writing with the same focus in mind, and had the same exact aesthetic.

mqmuzuh8zgo

cvYVmxHzQmw&feature=related

[Chromefox]

Whelp, if each of these videos is indeed an accurate summary of either band's sound, then I'm inclined to say that TSL is really uninteresting. I mean, obviously they're both pop punk bands, but I think it's a reasonable claim to say "They're two different pop punk bands". I mean, a Clydesdale and an Appaloosa are still both horses, but they're not the same breed.

[kearn1tm]

both music forms do sound juvenile and amateur, yes, and its easy to lump them together because of that. the youthful-sounding vocals also contribute. im not trying to marginalize and say one band is objectively better than another, but im just saying the music had divisively different characteristics. i dont know how you can think these two bands were writing with the same focus in mind, and had the same exact aesthetic.


I hear pop rock with more screaming and a fetish for Lifetime. That's the only difference. However, here's a bunch of bands making similar music in the "scene" at the same time.

bTqCuCTpQPE&feature=PlayList&p=A6B3C6A80C9AAC2E&index=5

o2ZRc3RPyHI&feature=PlayList&p=815C120554DA10BE&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=17

lHHOBTKnlzg

tVP0b8qvZg8

G0T-gxtVUzM

Fv7dwFDE2qU

[kearn1tm]

sigh. whatever dude.

BUUUUURN! I'm toast over here.

im not even talking about that album because the one that got them hype on THIS site was released in '02
, and i just feel that it didnt have the same appeal as other albums released around that time.
You don't feel it had the same appeal as Yellowcard, the Ataris, Fall Out Boy, or Spitalfield?

but thats subjective in the first place, which is why i came in saying, "i dont understand the hype", instead of dismissing or attacking the hype because its obviously there for a reason.
Right, and hey, that's cool. What I don't understand is:

1.) They were/are/have always been covered in the same scene press (see: an article from, what '03-'04 calling them "the new face of Emo" in Alt Press, the massive coverage in Absolute Punk, etc.
2.) They were on Drive-Thru
3.) Catchy pop rock with some of the same influences as scene darlings TBS and the like.


technically energy is song speed relative to the tempo, and can definitely be measured by how regular and frequent the strumming is (16th notes generally constitute a song i'd call energetic, and if there's no guitar strumming it can go hand in hand with a constant snare drum at every other eighth note)
Is this true? I mean, is it actually labeled energy, or are you ascribing a word with a concise meaning to a formalist notion of a part of crafting music that changes the meaning of the word to fit your needs. I know that's rather confrontational, but "energy" is actually "how regular and frequent the strumming is," that's interesting. If it's not, you've misused the word to accentuate a perceived difference in music.

theres no subjective presumption in affirming that most of the early november's songs had a perfectly clear variance in dynamic and tempo while the starting line, not nearly as much.
Right, but I certainly think claiming "[x band] is more energetic" is, unless it actually is a measurement of music.


i mean, if you're not gonna take my argument seriously because you disagree with it, then its best if we just stop now

How am I not taking you seriously? Is it because I vehemently disagree? Is it because we're not gladhanding each other? Ryan, calm down. I think you're inaccurate. You think I am too. We've done this dance before. It's okay. I respect your stance, I merely disagree with it and I'm telling you why. Clearly, I respect your opinions, which is why I'm not reducing this to name-calling (which would be retarded, given the subject-matter we're debating about).

im not saying they were more clever, but that they had the affectation of "cleverness" and artistry that was absent in TSL's lyrics
The Starting Line
So it's safe to say that we've been here before;
Heart torn out, down for the count and still come back for more.
This lesson is learned too well.
Though, only unlearned by the time your wounds have healed.
Have you had enough?
I guess not because your lips are stuck to his.
It's Time to say enough is enough, you would be so better off.
You love him but tough because it's not coming back from him.
You can't win.
Stop expecting change, he's just a lost cause that you're waiting on.
Take a look around, you could have anyone.
So leave undeserving him.
It only hurts at first.
Taking Back Sunday

September never stays this cold
where I come from
And you know
I’m not one for complaining,
But I love the way you’d roll
excuses off the tip of your tongue
as I slowly fall apart (slowly, quietly, slowly)
fall apart

This won’t mean a thing come tomorrow
and that’s exactly how I’ll make it seem
Cause I'm still not sleeping,
thinking I’ve crawled home from worse than this
I don't see the failed attempts at cleverness.

Also, how isn't there appeal to the angsty teen demo that loves scene music with TSL lyrics like the following?

thus contributing to a different aesthetic which merely appealed to me more when i was younger. (and anyway where did midtown come from?) but i mean theres an obvious difference between the writing styles and aesthetic in this:


and this:
I don't see much of a difference. TSL is a little more earnest and more concise with their bullshit I suppose, so yeah, there's a bit of that feigned poetic sensibility, but really:

The Rock
I got the talk when I was younger
And understood as I recall,
they hadn't mentioned this at all.
My heart was racing like a sprinter
That tripped and fell
In love with a girl just for tonight and that's all

I've got big, big plans
And they've got to mean something more
than just once
But I just don't know what I want

I'm gonna tear your ass up like we just got married
And you're all mine now
Tonight is the night we've been waiting for all our lives
Or maybe for just tonight
Radiohead
Keep the noise low.
She doesn't wanna blow it.
Shaking head to toe
while your left hand does "the show me around."
Quickens your heartbeat.
It beats me straight into the ground.

You don't recover from a night like this.
A victim, still lying in bed, completely motionless.
A hand moves in the dark to a zipper.
Hear a boy bracing tight against sheets
barely whisper, "This is so messed up."
Songs released around the same time about the ensuing angst of loosing virginity? It's like, these artists are similar/pander to similar audiences!!!

[Viva Sonata]

Spitalfield.

[Pat k]

Tough one, Spitalfield.

[KevinForReal]

Fuck, I'm getting too old for this site. I was 17 when TSL released SILYMI. I have a way different perspective than most of you. It's hard to believe that I would have the same type of love for TSL as somebody who is 17 now.

Anyways, I don't think TSL is as 'generic' as you people are saying. I have gotten into all of those bands that came out around that time, and I have all their catalogues -- TBS, FOB, TSL, Yellowcard, Midtown, TEN, etc. etc... I'll still think that there is something that sets TSL above most of these bands. I always though that Spitalfield was more like FOB, with faster verses. TSL's sound has changed a lot, and no 2 albums sound alike.. W/ TSL, you could hear a song and KNOW which album it's on.

That's neither here nor there.

TSL rocks, and lyrically, BOATS has their best shit. How could one not like Making Love to the Camera?

[speakhandsforme]

It's close. But The Starting Line takes it.

[phil19]

spitalfield all the way. they are so underrated imo

[GuitarR0cker1]

Honestly, looking back on both bands now that I don't like pop punk much, I'd say that Spitalfield is the better band even though I used to like TSL so much more.

[KevinForReal]

Spitalfield sucks donkey Ds.

Can you tools stop saying they are better than TSL?

It is what I expect however, half you idiots on this website love shithole bands. But to say TSL isn't as good as Shitalfield? That's embarassing for you.

Long story short, spitalcrap is a lame shit band, and TSL rocks. period.

[ThisIsNotDan]

"hey lets see how many clever ways to incorporate an insult into Spitalfields name. that should be fun"

[brix99]

TSL hands down.

[Theseventhson]

Spitalfield sucks donkey Ds.

Can you tools stop saying they are better than TSL?

It is what I expect however, half you idiots on this website love shithole bands. But to say TSL isn't as good as Shitalfield? That's embarassing for you.

Long story short, spitalcrap is a lame shit band, and TSL rocks. period.

http://images.starcraftmazter.net/4chan/for_forums/cool_story_bro.jpg

[fightinirish217]

TSL, never listened to Spitalfield

[Lirr168]

is that an alternate cover of Say it like you mean it?

Yeah. I don't actually own it. The pic is from an ebay auction I lost, lol.