Big Hollywood's Top Ten Most Overrated Directors

[Thomas Balkcom]

can't wait to hear some of you all's thoughts on this: http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2010/01/17/top-10-most-overrated-directors-of-all-time/


1. Alfred Hitchcock
2. Martin Scorsese
3. Woody Allen
4. Quentin Tarantino
5. David Lynch
6. Mike Nichols
7. Darren Aronofsky
8. David Lean
9. Michael Mann
10. Ridley Scott

[Thomas Balkcom]

hahaha @ this (in the explanation for Hitchcock):

He never made a great film.

[WakingTheMisery]

Mostly hipster film makers. I like Scorsese and Hitchcock though.

[kwsqd]

This guy went to Harvard Law? Are you kidding me? hahahaha

[IAmNietzche]

Totally agree with every single one but not in that order.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Totally agree with every single one but not in that order.

I agree with them all but number one and two, both have a few overrated films but neither are even close to overrated directors in my opinion.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Lol at article..

though, not a Woody Allen fan.

[IAmNietzche]

1. David Lean
2. Alfred Hitchcock
3. Woody Allen
4. David Aronofsky
5. Martin Scorcese
6. Quentin Tarantino
7. Ridley Scott
8. Michael Mann
9. Mike Nichols
10. David Lynch

Though I'd probably put four other guys on there ahead of Scott - Lynch.

[Thomas Balkcom]

1. David Lean
2. Alfred Hitchcock
3. Woody Allen
4. David Aronofsky
5. Martin Scorcese
6. Quentin Tarantino
7. Ridley Scott
8. Michael Mann
9. Mike Nichols
10. David Lynch

Though I'd probably put four other guys on there ahead of Scott - Lynch.

for the sake of discussion, which four?

[IAmNietzche]

for the sake of discussion, which four?
Gus Van Sant
Clint Eastwood
Tim Burton
Orson Welles

But that's off the top of my head.

I'm inclined to agree that Hitch never made a "great" film. He was a brilliant technical director (see: Welles) but when you put him up against Ozu, Bergman or Bresson, there is a clear gap in narrative, theme and construction. Hitch made fun and engaging films but people still rank him up there with the best directors of all time.

[kwsqd]

Rear Window makes one reach for the fast-forward button.
LOL, what an idiot.

His justifications for disliking these directors are pathetic.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Gus Van Sant
Clint Eastwood
Tim Burton
Orson Welles

interested in your reasoning for Welles? Not that I disagree (I've seen maybe three of his films?), but would enjoy hearing why you think that he is overrated.

[kwsqd]

Looking back on his past articles, this guy might be the worst fucking critic I've ever read.

[Thomas Balkcom]

with the following in mind:

Directors get too much credit when a movie goes right, and too little blame when a movie goes wrong. There are certain directors, however, who get credit even when movies go wrong.

I actually agree with those that he chooses, but when it comes to his explanation of why Hitchcock is overrated I lose him.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Looking back on his past articles, this guy might be the worst fucking critic I've ever read.

anything particular article that made you feel this way?

[IAmNietzche]

interested in your reasoning for Welles? Not that I disagree (I've seen maybe three of his films?), but would enjoy hearing why you think that he is overrated.
My major reasoning for Welles is that he is the director most often called the greatest of all time and I feel like people say it because he directed what is the closest to a consensus best film of all time. Welles was an absolute genius when it came to crafting shots, scenes etc. but, in my opinion, it never fully transferred over to the screen. He directed two great films (Kane and Touch of Evil) and then a few very good films (Ambersons and Chimes). I even believe he had more to do with the direction of The Third Man than Reed did. I just can't get behind him as top 5, nevermind the best ever. I always thought Welles would have made a better cinematographer than director.

However, if we're talking about the most important directors of all time, Welles takes it in a landslide.

[Macbeth.]

hahahah.

[Thomas Balkcom]

My major reasoning for Welles is that he is the director most often called the greatest of all time and I feel like people say it because he directed what is the closest to a consensus best film of all time. Welles was an absolute genius when it came to crafting shots, scenes etc. but, in my opinion, it never fully transferred over to the screen. He directed two great films (Kane and Touch of Evil) and then a few very good films (Ambersons and Chimes). I even believe he had more to do with the direction of The Third Man than Reed did. I just can't get behind him as top 5, nevermind the best ever. I always thought Welles would have made a better cinematographer than director.

However, if we're talking about the most important directors of all time, Welles takes it in a landslide.

this is a really, really interesting point. Thanks for answering.

[TJ Wells]

That is the most retarded list I've ever read in my entire life. I can agree with 7, 9 and 10; other than that, this is like a list of my favorite directors.

[TJ Wells]

Tim Burton, Ridley Scott, Clint Eastwood, Brian DePalma, Wes Anderson would all make my list.

[Thomas Balkcom]

That is the most retarded list I've ever read in my entire life. I can agree with 7, 9 and 10; other than that, this is like a list of my favorite directors.

7 would be my #1.

[kwsqd]

anything particular article that made you feel this way?
http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/01/06/can-movies-lose-wars/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/02/22/meryl-streep/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/05/15/what-happens-next-on-lost/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/03/29/rap-is-crap/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/03/16/partisan-hacks-using-comedy-as-a-shield/#more-81186

http://www.creators.com/conservative/ben-shapiro.html

Just from browsing over stuff quickly.

[TJ Wells]

7 would be my #1.
I agree that he's overrated, but I think at only four films in, you can't really include him on a list like this. I also think with The Wrestler, he puts himself in the position to go on a path that could prove him to be incredibly more versatile and talented than I originally thought.

[Thomas Balkcom]

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/01/06/can-movies-lose-wars/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/02/22/meryl-streep/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/05/15/what-happens-next-on-lost/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/03/29/rap-is-crap/

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/03/16/partisan-hacks-using-comedy-as-a-shield/#more-81186

http://www.creators.com/conservative/ben-shapiro.html

Just from browsing over stuff quickly.

haha, I read over that LOST one, he is terrible.

[IAmNietzche]

I'm very surprised you guys can get behind Hitchcock and Lean especially.

[WakingTheMisery]

Yeah, a lack of Burton confuses me.

[TJ Wells]

I'm very surprised you guys can get behind Hitchcock and Lean especially.
As overrated or underrated?

[Thomas Balkcom]

I agree that he's overrated, but I think at only four films in, you can't really include him on a list like this. I also think with The Wrestler, he puts himself in the position to go on a path that could prove him to be incredibly more versatile and talented than I originally thought.

interesting.

[kwsqd]

haha, I read over that LOST one, he is terrible.


all of them are tremendously stupid in their own, special way.

[IAmNietzche]

Also, a director can be one of your favorites and still be overrated.

[Thomas Balkcom]

I'm very surprised you guys can get behind Hitchcock and Lean especially.

before I clicked on the article, Lean was the first name that came to mind. Whenever I have read articles on overrated directors or watched one of his films in classes the professor always made it a point to state how overrated he is.

[IAmNietzche]

As overrated or underrated?
Can't believe you would even ask if Hitchcock is underrated. People rank him up there with Kurosawa, Bresson, Bergman etc. Do you think he belongs there?

[TJ Wells]

Can't believe you would even ask if Hitchcock is underrated. People rank him up there with Kurosawa, Bresson, Bergman etc. Do you think he belongs there?
No, but I really don't know how anyone (even someone who includes Hitchcock on their list of favorite directors) can think he's overrated. I just don't see it. Then again, that Marnie/Torn Curtain/Topaz run could certainly make a case for it...

[IAmNietzche]

No, I just haven't read through every post on here and am not sure where the discussion started.
I posted my reordered version of his list and then posted four people I would add to it.

[TJ Wells]

I don't know; it's just, when someone says my two favorite directors are the 3rd and 4th most overrated directors ever, it rubs me the wrong way a little bit.

[MyNameIsRoss]

big Lol at the rap article.

[IAmNietzche]

I don't know; it's just, when someone says my two favorite directors are the 3rd and 4th most overrated directors ever, it rubs me the wrong way a little bit.
I love Tarantino, but he is definitely overrated.

As for Allen, don't like him so I probably shouldn't comment.

[MyNameIsRoss]

don't see how Scorsese is overrated.

[a speedo model]

I agree with 2,3, 7, 9

Some of these I'm not too familiar with their work to comfortably approve of and others I agree are overrated to any extent, but no where near deserving of being on the list.
Tim Burton, Ridley Scott, Clint Eastwood, Brian DePalma, Wes Anderson would all make my list.
I agree with all of these. Tim Burton being my #1.

[kwsqd]

don't see how Scorsese is overrated.
He's not.

[IAmNietzche]

don't see how Scorsesse is overrated.
Because Goodfellas, The Departed and Raging Bull are all overrated films.

[IAmNietzche]

The list was obviously meant to spur discussion. If he wanted to make a list where you'd look at it and go "yeah, I guess" he would've added guys like De Palma, Spielberg and Lucas.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Because Goodfellas, The Departed and Raging Bull are all overrated films.

love all three of those movies.

[IAmNietzche]

love all three of those movies.
Probably because they are very good films (The Departed is pretty good). I like them too. But they are overrated.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Probably because they are all very good films. I like them too. But they are overrated.

good films are often praised. doesn't mean they're necessarily overrated. word gets thrown around a lot.

[Thomas Balkcom]

The list was obviously meant to spur discussion. If he wanted to make a list where you'd look at it and go "yeah, I guess" he would've added guys like De Palma, Spielberg and Lucas.

this. This is the first list of any sort I have posted in weeks and the only reason I did was because I hoped it would bring about some decent discussion.

love all three of those movies.

as do I.

Probably because they are very good films (The Departed is pretty good). I like them too. But they are overrated.

definitely agree on The Departed, enjoy it quite a bit but it is grossly overrated.

[IAmNietzche]

Godard would make my list but he's overrated by a completely different film community than Hitch and Scorcese are overrated.

[IAmNietzche]

Raging Bull gets called a "great film". It's a great performance. Not a great film.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Godard would make my list but he's overrated by a completely different film community than Hitch and Scorcese are overrated.

I would be interested in people's answers in that film community, I'm sure Godard would lead most people's lists.

[IAmNietzche]

I would be interested in people's answers in that film community, I'm sure Godard would lead most people's lists.
You'd see the Godard/Bergman dichotomy kick into full gear. Those two would head the lists.

[Thomas Balkcom]

You'd see the Godard/Bergman dichotomy kick into full gear. Those two would head the lists.

agreed. I feel like there would be much more interesting answers in that film community.

[williek311]

Gotta agree with David Lynch.

[IAmNietzche]

Gotta agree with David Lynch.
Definitely.

Mulholland Drive
Inland Empire
Blue Velvet

All overrated.

[Cameronisonfire]

Notice the lack of Michael Bay.
Greatest. Director. Ever.
Explosions! Hott chicks! Oil drillers on astroids! Explosions!

[bard]

Notice the lack of Michael Bay.
Greatest. Director. Ever.
Explosions! Hott chicks! Oil drillers on astroids! Explosions!
he's not overrated because nobody rates him highly...

great post

tim burton would be my number one. wes anderson would somewhere in the top ten, as well as tarantino, but i don't too much about film....

[Justin_stacy]

I don't have alot of reference to the older stuff, but Gus Van Sant and Stone are deserving additions to that list.

[IAmNietzche]

I'd like to see who people think is underrated.

[Justin_stacy]

I never really thought about it before. Its much more common to see those getting undeserving praise (the apatows, abrams etc.), as opposed to those not getting what they deserve.

[Ravenna]

how this list passes by both Wes Anderson and Christopher Nolan as overrated is beyond me.

[Thomas Balkcom]

how this list passes by both Wes Anderson and Christopher Nolan as overrated is beyond me.

surprised this is the first mention and I won't lie, I hadn't thought of Nolan until I read this.

[ActorInThisPlay]

how this list passes by both Wes Anderson and Christopher Nolan as overrated is beyond me.
cause Christopher Nolan is the man

[abandonship]

not a bad list actually (except for #3)

[Ravenna]

I'd like to see who people think is underrated.
off the top of my head, Carol Reed for sure.

[a speedo model]

Nolan's only made one film that may have received a bit more praise then it deserved. All his other work has never received too much attention, I don't think. Nothing worthy of overrated.

[Ravenna]

Nolan's only made one film that may have received a bit more praise then it deserved. All his other work has never received too much attention, I don't think. Nothing worthy of overrated.
If you are referring to TDK, that might be the understatement of the fucking century.

[a speedo model]

Jacques Aurdiard is severely underrated, in my opinion. The Beat My Heart Skipped is stunning.

[a speedo model]

If you are referring to TDK, that might be the understatement of the fucking century.
I was treading lightly. But yes, haha.

[IAmNietzche]

off the top of my head, Carol Reed for sure.
Even if he didn't direct The Third Man?

[a speedo model]

IAmNietzche, have you bought the film set in your avatar? I was so tempted to buy it off amazon.

[IAmNietzche]

IAmNietzche, have you seen the film in your avatar? I was so tempted to buy it off amazon.
My avatar is a collection of Melies' films. It is probably the best DVD I own.

http://www.amazon.com/Georges-Melies-Wizard-Cinema-1896-1913/dp/B0013K8J90/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1264022464&sr=8-1

[a speedo model]

My avatar is a collection of Melies' films. It is probably the best DVD I own.
Yeah, right after I posted I realized I worded that wrong. It's next on my list to buy.

[Ravenna]

Even if he didn't direct The Third Man?
I think so, yes.

I would also say Powell and Pressburger are pretty underrated. Same with De Sica. De Sica has created two of the greatest films of all time, in my opinion, yet I rarely see his name mentioned alongside the other greats.

[Ari Christos]

I don't know much about film, but this thread is a very interesting read. With what little knowledge I do have, however, I agree with David Lynch and have never really enjoyed his films yet alone considered them great.

[abandonship]

umberto d. > bicycle thieves

[IAmNietzche]

I think so, yes.

I would also say Powell and Pressburger are pretty underrated. Same with De Sica. De Sica has created two of the greatest films of all time, in my opinion, yet I rarely see his name mentioned alongside the other greats.
In my opinion there is a drop-off after Bicycle and Umberto. I'd agree that he is slightly underrated though.

[stayillogical]

Raging Bull gets called a "great film". It's a great performance. Not a great film.

I agree. I think Taxi Driver is Scorsese's best, although Goodfellas is my personal favorite.

[irthesteve]

such a terrible list

[bard]

As far as underrated, I don't know, but I really enjoy David Fincher and Charlie Kaufman, even though Charlie Kaufman has only directed one film, he is obviously talented.

[IAmNietzche]

Kenji Mizoguchi and Yasujiro Ozu are definitely underrated but I think that's more of a cultural thing than anything else. Robert Bresson is pretty underrated as well.

I have to go with Sidney Lumet though, intensely underrated.

[IAmNietzche]

umberto d. > bicycle thieves
Agreed.

[jwicklun]

agree with Ridley Scott, Michael Mann, and Woodey Allen, but other than that, the other directors deserve their acclaim.

[Thomas Balkcom]

love the answer of Lumet.

[abandonship]

what films of lumet are good? I really liked network but dog day afternoon and 12 angry men I didn't.

[jwicklun]

can't wait to hear some of you all's thoughts on this: http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2010/01/17/top-10-most-overrated-directors-of-all-time/
Reading this list is like reading Armond White review a movie.

[IAmNietzche]

what films of lumet are good? I really liked network but dog day afternoon and 12 angry men I didn't.
You didn't like 12 Angry Men? Is that possible?

Outside of those three.

Fail Safe is fantastic.
The Verdict is very good and I personally really like Long Day's Journey Into Night.

Also, Serpico suffers from the same thing that Raging Bull benefits from.

De Niro's performance makes people overrate how good Scorcese's direction was in Raging Bull.

Pacino's performance makes people underrate how good Lumet's direction was in Serpico. Not sure why.

[Thomas Balkcom]

You didn't like 12 Angry Men? Is that possible?


hahaha

[Wake Up]

what films of lumet are good? I really liked network but dog day afternoon and 12 angry men I didn't.

His latest film, Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, is fantastic.

By the way, I didn't like 12 Angry Men that much either, I prefer the remake.

[IAmNietzche]

His latest film, Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, is fantastic.

By the way, I didn't like 12 angry men that much either, I prefer the remake.
Friedkin's version? With Tony Danza?

[AMackChuck]

I agree with most of the list, especially Quentin Tarantino. I just don't see what's so special about them. Am I the only one shocked that Brad Pitt gets praise for his acting in Inglorious Basterds?

[Wake Up]

Friedkin's version? With Tony Danza?

Mikhalkov's version.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0488478/

[Ravenna]

any remake with Tony Danza is clearly the superior version.

[+xLeSabrex+]

Steven Spielberg and Mel Gibson and Wes Craven!!!
I've constantly tried to sit through one of Wes's movies and they just don't do anything for me!!!

[dungeonwitch]

I agree with most of the list, especially Quentin Tarantino. I just don't see what's so special about them. Am I the only one shocked that Brad Pitt gets praise for his acting in Inglorious Basterds?
No, he didnt have very much dialog in that movie, did he?. I've seen it once but i dont think he really did much except make silly faces and speak in an aweful accent.

But i believe Aronofsky is very, very overrated. He appealed to just a select audience for his entire career up until The Wrestler came around. Now all of a sudden everyone loves him.

[Thomas Balkcom]

No, he didnt have very much dialog in that movie, did he?. I've seen it once but i dont think he really did much except make silly faces and speak in an aweful accent.

But i believe Aronofsky is very, very overrated. He appealed to just a select audience for his entire career up until The Wrestler came around. Now all of a sudden everyone loves him.

a lot of people loved him before The Wrestler.

[dungeonwitch]

Steven Spielberg and Mel Gibson and Wes Craven!!!
I've constantly tried to sit through one of Wes's movies and they just don't do anything for me!!!

Because you must not enjoy horror movies! how could you not like Scream?

I'll give you Gibson, though. But i loved Braveheart, everything else was too religious or trying too hard to be shockingly violent.

[dungeonwitch]

a lot of people loved him before The Wrestler.
But his movies didnt get the recognition they do now BEFORE The Wrestler came out.

My overall point is that if a mediocre director comes out with maybe one or two great films, all of a sudden their entire body of work is praised. That makes someone overrated IMO.

[Thomas Balkcom]

But his movies didnt get the recognition they do now BEFORE The Wrestler came out.

My overall point is that if a mediocre director comes out with maybe one or two great films, all of a sudden their entire body of work is praised. That makes someone overrated IMO.

unfortunately, this is not true. Aronofsky received praise years before The Wrestler.

[surfwaxsideshow]

Mostly hipster film makers. I like Scorsese and Hitchcock though.

Hipster filmmakers? Seriously?

[dungeonwitch]

unfortunately, this is not true. Aronofsky received praise years before The Wrestler.
To critics, right? Because Pi, the shit that was called Requiem for a Dream, and The Fountain, were all very strange movies in comparison to The Wrestler.

[And Hours Pass]

Gus Van Sant
Clint Eastwood
Tim Burton
Orson Welles

I don't have alot of reference to the older stuff, but Gus Van Sant and Stone are deserving additions to that list.

This really surprised me. What about him do you think makes him overrated? I don't think he makes most people's lists of the best directors, and I think that Milk and Good Will Hunting were two of the best films to come out in the past 15 years.

I love Tarantino, but he is definitely overrated.

As for Allen, don't like him so I probably shouldn't comment.

Feel free to comment on Allen. I don't like him and think he's overrated. There, I just commented for both of us.

Notice the lack of Michael Bay.
Greatest. Director. Ever.
Explosions! Hott chicks! Oil drillers on astroids! Explosions!

Seriously! How did Michael Bay not make it on this list? How do people still go to him to direct movies? It's baffling.

I agree. I think Taxi Driver is Scorsese's best, although Goodfellas is my personal favorite.

I actually think Taxi Driver is superbly overrated. I'd choose several Scorcese films (including but not limited to Raging Bull, Goodfellas, Casino, Gangs of New York, The Departed, The Aviator) over that.

His latest film, Before the Devil Knows You're Dead, is fantastic.

By the way, I didn't like 12 Angry Men that much either, I prefer the remake.

Absolutely brilliant. Loved it.

Steven Spielberg and Mel Gibson and Wes Craven!!!
I've constantly tried to sit through one of Wes's movies and they just don't do anything for me!!!

Agreed with all 3.

[honkyg88]

http://bighollywood.breitbart.com/bshapiro/2009/03/29/rap-is-crap/
This article made me laugh actually about how ignorant he really is.

[Thomas Balkcom]

To critics, right? Because Pi, the shit that was called Requiem for a Dream, and The Fountain, were all very strange movies in comparison to The Wrestler.

I'd say to everyone. His name was more or less a household name (in the sense that people who know directors knew who he was prior The Wrestler and prior to The Fountain for that matter).

[Thomas Balkcom]

I actually think Taxi Driver is superbly overrated. I'd choose several Scorcese films (including but not limited to Raging Bull, Goodfellas, Casino, Gangs of New York, The Departed, The Aviator) over that.


Taxi Driver may or may not be overrated (I certainly don't think that is) but it is, in my opinion, Scorsese's best and definitely better than those that you listed.

[yellowhouse]

This is a terrible list. Scorcese? Tarantino? Hitchcock? Lynch? Arronofsky? Overrated? Are you fucking kidding me?

[Thomas Balkcom]

unless those that you listed are films that are more overrated than Taxi Driver? I don't think you are but maybe I misunderstood.

[IAmNietzche]

Taxi Driver may or may not be overrated (I certainly don't think that is) but it is, in my opinion, Scorsese's best and definitely better than those that you listed.
Agreed.

[dungeonwitch]

I'd say to everyone. His name was more or less a household name (in the sense that people who know directors knew who he was prior The Wrestler and prior to The Fountain for that matter).
Maybe my mind is clouded since i didnt like any of his films.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Maybe my mind is clouded since i didnt like any of his films.

haha, that is certainly possible. Not a single one? I am not the biggest Aronofsky fan but I like each of films in some respect.

[dungeonwitch]

haha, that is certainly possible. Not a single one? I am not the biggest Aronofsky fan but I like each of films in some respect.
I thought Requiem was just too out there, over stylized film about heroin and pill dependency.

I dont like Hugh Jackman very much.

The Wrestler was decent, actually i havent seen Pi, shit i forgot about that.

[abandonship]

Pi might be my favorite of his

[Car Crash Dream]

Gus Van Sant
Clint Eastwood
Tim Burton
Orson Welles

But that's off the top of my head.

I'm inclined to agree that Hitch never made a "great" film. He was a brilliant technical director (see: Welles) but when you put him up against Ozu, Bergman or Bresson, there is a clear gap in narrative, theme and construction. Hitch made fun and engaging films but people still rank him up there with the best directors of all time.
Yes. Clint Eastwood. I love him as an actor, but I couldn't stand Flags Of Our Fathers or Letters From Iwo Jima. I just couldn't follow it well, but the Cinematography was definitely good.

[KatastrophiE]

dont agree with list at all, douche bag blogger is a douche bag blogger

[poppa Q]

I think Julian Schnabel could be thrown into the "underrated" argument.

[achassi]

Taxi Driver may or may not be overrated (I certainly don't think that is) but it is, in my opinion, Scorsese's best and definitely better than those that you listed.

Mean Streets is my personal favorite. Probably his best too. The raw aprroach and grittiness and Harvey Keitel's hair is enough to love it. I agree with the list but I still think that all these overrated actors have made amazing films and if anyone really deserves the overrated moniker it should be Burton

[stayillogical]

My immediate reaction to the list was also the exclusion of Burton. Alice in Wonderland looks awful.

[ActorInThisPlay]

what about David Fincher? I think he is pretty underrated.

[Justin_stacy]

This really surprised me. What about him do you think makes him overrated? I don't think he makes most people's lists of the best directors, and I think that Milk and Good Will Hunting were two of the best films to come out in the past 15 years.

Good Will Hunting is a fantastic movie (that is cast driven), but that's one film in a career that has had more than its share duds, and yet the man is still praised.

His Psycho remake is one of the worst ever. Elephant and Last Days are basically an hour and half of people 'walking'. Paranoid Park could put an insomniac to sleep.

Him and Apatow are probably two of the biggest examples of overrated directors working today.

[deadkidsean]

what about David Fincher? I think he is pretty underrated.
Overrated? Definitely agree.

[ActorInThisPlay]

Overrated? Definitely agree.
I think Fight Club and Se7en are really great movies. His other ones aren't as good but still pretty decent.

[mht]

Michael Bay? George Lucas? ....come on those guys suck pecker

[IAmNietzche]

You guys are confusing overrated with bad.

[mht]

no no, people on here like Bay and Lucas, I know they do.

[Ravenna]

no no, people on here like Bay and Lucas, I know they do.
Its kind of hard to be considered overrated when you've lost all credibility. All the aforementioned directors on this list have a lot of credibility, and rightly so. Like Dan said, not overrated, just bad.

[narcoleptic953]

List is laughable, but if we're talking about overrated directors, I've only got 3 words....

James. Fucking. Cameron.

[And Hours Pass]

Taxi Driver may or may not be overrated (I certainly don't think that is) but it is, in my opinion, Scorsese's best and definitely better than those that you listed.

unless those that you listed are films that are more overrated than Taxi Driver? I don't think you are but maybe I misunderstood.

I was not saying that. I completely disagree with you, but I guess that's the nature of opinions.

Good Will Hunting is a fantastic movie (that is cast driven), but that's one film in a career that has had more than its share duds, and yet the man is still praised.

His Psycho remake is one of the worst ever. Elephant and Last Days are basically an hour and half of people 'walking'. Paranoid Park could put an insomniac to sleep.

Him and Apatow are probably two of the biggest examples of overrated directors working today.

I can get on board with the Psycho remake being terrible. I enjoyed Elephant and Last Days. I think the bigger point I'm trying to make is that I don't think that GSV is "highly rated," so to call him overrated when he does in fact have two historic movies under his belt is a bit drastic to me.

In response to the Apatow bit - while I think some of the movies he's associated with are grossly overrated, the movies he has actually directed stand up to his reputation (40 year old Virgin, Knocked Up). I would comment on Funny people as well, but I haven't seen it. If we're examining that batch of "comic actors," the award for completely and utterly overrated in every way would go to Will Ferrel.

List is laughable, but if we're talking about overrated directors, I've only got 3 words....

James. Fucking. Cameron.


Glad I wasn't the first to think this.

[narcoleptic953]

I don't think Scorsese overrated at all, though I agree that Raging Bull was more of a great performance than a great film. I'd say Tarantino deserves every bit of praise he gets and that he's never made a film I even think is remotely close to bad.

[yellowhouse]

List is laughable, but if we're talking about overrated directors, I've only got 3 words....

James. Fucking. Cameron.

This times a thousand. James Cameron is a pretentious fuck.

[Prestonxsmith]

surprised this is the first mention and I won't lie, I hadn't thought of Nolan until I read this.

This guy is very irrelevant, even if the list does have any bit of truth to it. Here is a quote from the article in regards to The Graduate: All future directors take note: having your main characters staring blankly into nothingness is not an ending. It is a cop out.
Does the guy not know how to fucking analyze a movie? How can you just sit there and think "This guy didn't straight up tell me what the fuck just happened. I, as a member of the audience, deserve to know what is going on"? Did he even consider to think about it? Also, this guy is just a bureaucrat. He has no experience in film, and he slammed The Dark Knight for being anti-Bush. How do you even get that out of a movie, but can't understand the ending to The Graduate?

[WarpSpeedChewy]

I highly disagree with Hitchcock, Scorsese, Tarantino, Aronofsky and Nichols being on there.

[fake empire]

I think Fight Club and Se7en are really great movies. His other ones aren't as good but still pretty decent.
I don't think Fight Club is his best

[poppa Q]

This guy is very irrelevant, even if the list does have any bit of truth to it. Here is a quote from the article in regards to The Graduate:
Does the guy not know how to fucking analyze a movie? How can you just sit there and think "This guy didn't straight up tell me what the fuck just happened. I, as a member of the audience, deserve to know what is going on"? Did he even consider to think about it? Also, this guy is just a bureaucrat. He has no experience in film, and he slammed The Dark Knight for being anti-Bush. How do you even get that out of a movie, but can't understand the ending to The Graduate?

/rant, lol

[Prestonxsmith]

/rant, lol

Pretty much haha.

[bard]

I don't think Fight Club is his best
agreed. zodiac is my favorite of his. and i think it's his best. agreed?

[ActorInThisPlay]

I don't think Fight Club is his best
well it is one of my favorite movies and I think its his best. Se7en is a close 2nd...haven't seen Zodiac yet though.

[Prestonxsmith]

agreed. zodiac is my favorite of his. and i think it's his best. agreed?

Not to burst your bubble, but for me, Zodiac dragged out for sooooo long. It just went back and forth and back and forth of him trying to find evidence.

[IAmNietzche]

Fincher's best film is The Game. Case closed.

[Justin_stacy]

I can get on board with the Psycho remake being terrible. I enjoyed Elephant and Last Days. I think the bigger point I'm trying to make is that I don't think that GSV is "highly rated," so to call him overrated when he does in fact have two historic movies under his belt is a bit drastic to me.
.

i've always viewed him as one of the darlings of hollywood's not-so indie movie scene. all to often i see his films getting critical praise, and then I rent them and at best they're just so/so....which leaves the impression that its his name alone, and not the product, that's fueling the praise. that for me is what defends the 'over-hype' label. now if you don't think he's that 'hyped' to begin with, I could see where you might disagree with me.

2 films (of which I agree with only one), don't compensate for a hand full of other subpar releases. Hitchcock has at least two films that deserve the 'great' tag, and he headlined the list.

[dissident]

what an edgy and perfect list for a conversation starter. fucking rubbish.

[IAmNietzche]

what an edgy and perfect list for a conversation starter. fucking rubbish.
It helps that most of it is true.

[xjulianx89]

Strongly disagree with 1, 2, 5 and 8.

Really bad list.

[liveloud4life]

How full of yourself do you have to be to assert your opinion as fact that many times?

[bard]

Not to burst your bubble, but for me, Zodiac dragged out for sooooo long. It just went back and forth and back and forth of him trying to find evidence.
the best part of the movie to me is that is what happened in real life, and that is what's crazy. the fact that the brightest minds of the time just couldn't figure it out. call it morbid fascination, but it's my favorite of his and one of my all time favorites ever really.
Fincher's best film is The Game. Case closed.
i need to revisit that. i saw it forever ago, but i was quite the young lad.

[jwelborn]

Reading through these 5 pages of posts have been very interesting. Allen and Scorsese are two of my favorite film makers, but I can see where someone could easily consider them overrated.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Reading through these 5 pages of posts have been very interesting. Allen and Scorsese are two of my favorite film makers, but I can see where someone could easily consider them overrated.

this is probably the most logical reaction I have read thus far.

[narcoleptic953]

I'd like to see what kind of movies this guy thinks are good...

[jwelborn]

Also David Lynch, would probably be #1 on my list. Just never been a fan of any of his films, especially Blue Velvet.

[Thomas Balkcom]

How full of yourself do you have to be to assert your opinion as fact that many times?

for the sake of discussion/argument I would replace "full" with "sure" in this sentence. I, for one, am guilty of stating "in my opinion" too often. Putting aside if he's right or wrong, people seem to throw opinions out quicker when they are stated in somewhat of a forceful manner. If any of that makes sense.

[IAmNietzche]

Also David Lynch, would probably be #1 on my list. Just never been a fan of any of his films, especially Blue Velvet.
You don't think he's a good director or you simply don't like his films?

[jwelborn]

You don't think he's a good director or you simply don't like his films?

I just don't like his films. I'm definitely not saying he's a bad director I appreciate his style and what he's stuck to over these 30 years, it's just not for me sir.

[Justin_stacy]

Fincher's best film is The Game. Case closed.

i've always thought the story or concept behind The Game was better than the final product.

[SlappedActor]

I just don't like his films. I'm definitely not saying he's a bad director I appreciate his style and what he's stuck to over these 30 years, it's just not for me sir.

I feel the same way, I just never enjoyed Lynch the same way other people do.

[dissident]

It helps that most of it is true.

1. Alfred Hitchcock - not true
2. Martin Scorsese - not true
3. Woody Allen
4. Quentin Tarantino - not true
5. David Lynch - not true
6. Mike Nichols
7. Darren Aronofsky - not true
8. David Lean
9. Michael Mann
10. Ridley Scott - not true

that's certainly not "most". hell i could even play bal with aronofsky and lynch, but there are picks on here (hitchcock, scorsese, tarantino) that are obviously on here just to be "edgy". it's like they took an average "best director" list and changed the title to "overrated"

[IAmNietzche]

1. Alfred Hitchcock - not true
2. Martin Scorsese - not true
3. Woody Allen
4. Quentin Tarantino - not true
5. David Lynch - not true
6. Mike Nichols
7. Darren Aronofsky - not true
8. David Lean
9. Michael Mann
10. Ridley Scott - not true

that's certainly not "most". hell i could even play bal with aronofsky and lynch, but there are picks on here (hitchcock, scorsese, tarantino) that are obviously on here just to be "edgy". it's like they took an average "best director" list and changed the title to "overrated"
Read through the thread. You'll see my argument for all of them being overrated. People seem to be getting most hung up on Hitch and Scorcese. They are in fact, overrated directors.

[dissident]

they are, in fact, not. both are considered one of - if not the - best for a good reason. it's true.

[IAmNietzche]

they are, in fact, not. both are considered one of - if not the - best for a good reason. it's true.
I hope Scorcese isn't considered one of the best directors, I can name 15 or 20 that should be ahead of him. As for Hitch, some consider him the best, others would put him in the top 5... the problem is he only made one film that can really be considered great.

[Thomas Balkcom]

I hope Scorcese isn't considered one of the best directors, I can name 15 or 20 that should be ahead of him. As for Hitch, some consider him the best, others would put him in the top 5... the problem is he only made one film that can really be considered great.

Vertigo?

[dissident]

I hope Scorcese isn't considered one of the best directors, I can name 15 or 20 that should be ahead of him. As for Hitch, some consider him the best, others would put him in the top 5... the problem is he only made one film that can really be considered great.

if you can name 15 or 20 directors that you think are better than scorsese than your opinion isn't worth humoring. i wouldn't be shocked at all if the majority of them were foreign or people no one's heard of.

[IAmNietzche]

if you can name 15 or 20 directors that you think are better than scorsese than your opinion isn't worth humoring. i wouldn't be shocked at all if the majority of them were foreign or people no one's heard of.
So because they're foreign they aren't as good as Scorcese? Haha, figures.

[Thomas Balkcom]

if you can name 15 or 20 directors that you think are better than scorsese than your opinion isn't worth humoring. i wouldn't be shocked at all if the majority of them were foreign or people no one's heard of.

I'm curious, why does that matter?

[IAmNietzche]

Vertigo?
Yup.

[dissident]

So because they're foreign they aren't as good as Scorcese? Haha, figures.

not at all, it's just a reflection of the type of person you are and your taste. it tells me that you favor "indie" and obscure directors probably just to be different and say you're into shit no one else is. it tells me you're probably an elitist douche.

[dissident]

I'm curious, why does that matter?

see my post.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Dan, you elitist douche!

[IAmNietzche]

Alfred Hitchcock
Akira Kurosawa
Stanley Kubrick
Francois Truffaut
Orson Welles
Billy Wilder
Jean Renoir
Ingmar Bergman
David Lean
Federico Fellini
Yasujiro Ozu
Jean Luc Godard
Kenji Mizoguchi
John Ford

So fourteen I would rate higher.

[abandonship]

top foreign directors > top american directors

[Thomas Balkcom]

top foreign directors > top american directors

oh definitely.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Alfred Hitchcock
Akira Kurosawa
Stanley Kubrick
Francois Truffaut
Orson Welles
Billy Wilder
Jean Renoir
Ingmar Bergman
David Lean
Federico Fellini
Yasujiro Ozu
Jean Luc Godard
Kenji Mizoguchi
John Ford

So fourteen I would rate higher.

and only a couple of these I'd consider "obscure."

[IAmNietzche]

Ah, what the hell I forgot Tarkovsky. I'll throw Coppola ahead of him too.

[dissident]

Alfred Hitchcock
Akira Kurosawa
Stanley Kubrick
Francois Truffaut
Orson Welles
Billy Wilder
Jean Renoir
Ingmar Bergman
David Lean
Federico Fellini
Yasujiro Ozu
Jean Luc Godard
Kenji Mizoguchi
John Ford

So fourteen I would rate higher.

it seems you're list is full of mainly dudes who made movies over 60 years ago. of course they're better, it's easy to look up to people who essentially created what film making is today. out of directors still putting out good work at a consistent rate, i don't think scorsese can be touched.

[dissident]

and only a couple of these I'd consider "obscure."

you fucking kidding? only a couple of those aren't obscure. i've heard of most of them, but they're still not well known.

[abandonship]

lol @ calling those directors obscure

[IAmNietzche]

you fucking kidding? only a couple of those aren't obscure. i've heard of most of them, but they're still not well known.
You are watching a very limited amount/type of films and trying to comment on who is the greatest. It doesn't make any sense. I'm not saying I've seen every film ever made, but at least I've seen films from these directors. You are telling me that Scorcese isn't as good as Welles or Fellini having never seen films by those directors. Now that is elitist.

[dissident]

You are watching a very limited amount/type of films and trying to comment on who is the greatest. It doesn't make any sense. I'm not saying I've seen every film ever made, but at least I've seen films from these directors. You are telling me that Scorcese isn't as good as Welles or Fellini having never seen films by those directors. Now that is elitist.

are you fucking retarded? i said i've heard of them. i know who they are. i'm familiar with them. that doesn't make them well known household names. i'd say at least 10 out of those 14 names would be completely lost on the average person. that is obscure. it doesn't mean they suck or i think they're any better or worse than scorsese. the fact that you don't think the guy who's made Raging Bull, Casino, Goodfellas, Mean Streets, Taxi Driver, and The Departed should be considered for one of the greatest film makers is laughable.

[IAmNietzche]

are you fucking retarded? i said i've heard of them. i know who they are. i'm familiar with them. that doesn't make them well known household names. i'd say at least 10 out of those 14 names would be completely lost on the average person. that is obscure. it doesn't mean they suck or i think they're any better or worse than scorsese. the fact that you don't think the guy who's made Raging Bull, Casino, Goodfellas, Mean Streets, Taxi Driver, and The Departed should be considered for one of the greatest film makers is laughable.
I do. I think he is in the top 20 greatest filmmakers. But just because the directors I named aren't household names doesn't make them less of a filmmaker than Scorcese. Michael Bay is a household name.

[IAmNietzche]

Here is a list of the best directors of all time consolidated from a bunch of lists. Check out where Marty is. I'm not saying this list is gospel, but it shows that I'm not the only one who rates him where I do.

http://www.theyshootpictures.com/gf1000_top100directors.htm

[dissident]

I do. I think he is in the top 20 greatest filmmakers. But just because the directors I named aren't household names doesn't make them less of a filmmaker than Scorcese. Michael Bay is a household name.

i never said it makes them less great, i said it's a reflection of your taste. i see a list like yours and i immediately think someone's just trying to be different and try and show off some faux film credibility.

[Thomas Balkcom]

you fucking kidding? only a couple of those aren't obscure. i've heard of most of them, but they're still not well known.

there's a substantial difference between being obscure and well known; there is somewhere in between.

[dissident]

also, i don't like counting influence or innovation as reason alone someone should be given recognition like this. orson welles influenced film in a lot of ways, but that doesn't make citizen kane any less of a chore to sit through.

[Thomas Balkcom]

watching Citizen Kane is a chore for you?

[abandonship]

i didn't like citizen kane either haha. touch of evil was even worse.

[dissident]

watching Citizen Kane is a chore for you?

fuck yes it is. i recognize the praise and it's influence but there are much more enthralling and entertaining movies.

[Thomas Balkcom]

i didn't like citizen kane either haha. touch of evil was even worse.

Haha, wow! Well, I have loved each and every time I have sat down to watch either but to each their own.

[abandonship]

i never said it makes them less great, i said it's a reflection of your taste. i see a list like yours and i immediately think someone's just trying to be different and try and show off some faux film credibility.

who would you put as your top 15 directors ?

[dissident]

anyone who claims to love citizen kane is a poser and a liar and are not to be taken seriously.

[Thomas Balkcom]

fuck yes it is. i recognize the praise and it's influence but there are much more enthralling and entertaining movies.

definitely but it's still quite an experience for me.

[Thomas Balkcom]

anyone who claims to love citizen kane is a poser and a liar and are not to be taken seriously.

sarcasm I hope?

[IAmNietzche]

anyone who claims to love citizen kane is a poser and a liar and are not to be taken seriously.
Wow, that's definitely a sig. worthy quote. I like Citizen Kane quite a lot.

[abandonship]

actually i loved the first 5 minutes of citizen kane

[Thomas Balkcom]

Wow, that's definitely a sig. worthy quote. I like Citizen Kane quite a lot.

well, goddamnit now I am forced to disregard everything you've ever said and never take you seriously again.

[IAmNietzche]

I can see not liking it. I can't really see calling anyone who does like it a liar though.

[Thomas Balkcom]

I can see not liking it too in the sense that there will never be a universally liked film.

[dissident]

who would you put as your top 15 directors ?


i'm not gonna order them and this is off the top of my head. also, these are my favorites i don't really give a fuck about listing "best"

scorsese
tarantino
james cameron
coen brothers
ron howard
pta
spieldberg
soderberg

that's enough.

[dissident]

let me rephrase, anyone under 40 who likes it is probably lying. it's just not enjoyable. the first time i watched it the time went by fast enough simply out of curiosity and it's technical strengths. but trying to watch it again i turned it off after an hour when i realized there was much more enjoyable things i could be doing.

[IAmNietzche]

let me rephrase, anyone under 40 who likes it is probably lying. it's just not enjoyable. the first time i watched it the time went by fast enough simply out of curiosity and it's technical strengths. but trying to watch it again i turned it off after an hour when i realized there was much more enjoyable things i could be doing.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean others can't. I feel like you're not getting that.

[Thomas Balkcom]

let me rephrase, anyone under 40 who likes it is probably lying. it's just not enjoyable. the first time i watched it the time went by fast enough simply out of curiosity and it's technical strengths. but trying to watch it again i turned it off after an hour when i realized there was much more enjoyable things i could be doing.

this may be the case with you, but I (and many others) do find it enjoyable.

[Thomas Balkcom]

damn, beaten again.

[abandonship]

ikiru > wild strawberries > citizen kane

[IAmNietzche]

ikiru > wild strawberries > citizen kane
Three randoms or the three best?

[abandonship]

Three randoms or the three best?

I just thought they had simliarities in their stories

[gilatron5000]

haha, that is certainly possible. Not a single one? I am not the biggest Aronofsky fan but I like each of films in some respect.The only one I really "liked" was The Wrestler. I thought Requiem for a Dream was really well done, but it's too much to watch. Which I suppose is a good thing?

But I hated The Fountain. I did not get the praise it got.


List is laughable, but if we're talking about overrated directors, I've only got 3 words....

James. Fucking. Cameron.I was surprised it took as long as it did to mention Cameron.

Don't get me wrong, I LIKE him, but people like...masturbate to his movies.

[dissident]

that's because avatar is the closest he's come to making something bad, and that movie's only flaw is how empty it is. cameron's had a stellar career. anyone who makes something as good as the director's cut of The Abyss deserves a pass and a shitload of praise

[IAmNietzche]

I just thought they had simliarities in their stories
They definitely do. And I'd rank them that way according to my enjoyment of them.

[dissident]

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean others can't. I feel like you're not getting that.


if this were the case with everything, all discussions would be "i'm glad you liked it, i didn't, that's just your opinion man". that's boring and way too polite.

[IAmNietzche]

that's because avatar is the closest he's come to making something bad, and that movie's only flaw is how empty it is. cameron's had a stellar career. anyone who makes something as good as the director's cut of The Abyss deserves a pass and a shitload of praise
This is the man whose directorial debut was Piranha Part Two: The Spawning.

[Thomas Balkcom]

if this were the case with everything, all discussions would be "i'm glad you liked it, i didn't, that's just your opinion man". that's boring and way too polite.

a person who likes a film and a person who does not like the same film are perfectly capable of discussing the film beyond "I liked/ didn't liked it."

[dissident]

This is the man whose directorial debut was Piranha Part Two: The Spawning.

a film he had basically nothing to do with? nice try nietzche

[dissident]

a person who likes a film and a person who does not like the same film are perfectly capable of discussing the film beyond "I liked/ didn't liked it."

funny, i don't recall getting into this discussion with you. go take a lap or something.

[Thomas Balkcom]

funny, i don't recall getting into this discussion with you. go take a lap or something.

sorry bud.

[dissident]

well if you're gonna stay, you might as well know up front that i don't take anything you say seriously.

[Thomas Balkcom]

well if you're gonna stay, you might as well know up front that i don't take anything you say seriously.

oh I know, you stated previously that anyone who likes Citizen Kane should not be taken seriously so I assumed as much.

[IAmNietzche]

a film he had basically nothing to do with? nice try nietzche
He penned the script and shot the entire thing.

[abandonship]

Cameron is definitely overrated. Personally I didn't like the Terminators. Alien is far superior to Aliens. Avatar looked awesome; however, the script was laughable. The Abyss was decent but nothing spectacular.

[reductiondesign]

A few thoughts after reading through this thread:


It's surprising to me that no one has suggested Spielberg as an overrated director. (Personally, I think he deserves most of the praise he gets, but that praise is for all the wrong films. Saving Private Ryan and Schindler's List pale in comparison to Munich or Minority Report.)

Vertigo is a better film than Citizen Kane in most aspects, but they're each one of the best films in history.

His comments about Tarantino are spot-on; parts of his films are absolutely brilliant, but the rest is just pop culture and conversation.

I'll throw in Kathyrn Bigalow as overrated; as an exmaple, The Hurt Locker isn't nearly as good as everyone's making it out to be. Having her be the first female to win Best Director is an insult to people like Jane Campion or Maya Deren. Hell, I think that Miranda July has a more consistent vision than Bigelow.

[Thomas Balkcom]

A few thoughts after reading through this thread:


It's surprising to me that no one has suggested Spielberg as an overrated director. (Personally, I think he deserves most of the praise he gets, but that praise is for all the wrong films. Saving Private Ryan and Schindler's List pale in comparison to Munich or Minority Report.)

I really thought someone had mentioned Spielberg already, interesting.

[reductiondesign]

Also, my personal vote for best director of all time goes to Kubrick.

[reductiondesign]

I really thought someone had mentioned Spielberg already, interesting.

I might have missed it, to be fair.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Also, my personal vote for best director of all time goes to Kubrick.

does this coincide with who you'd vote for in terms of favorite director of all time?

[IAmNietzche]

A few thoughts after reading through this thread:


It's surprising to me that no one has suggested Spielberg as an overrated director. (Personally, I think he deserves most of the praise he gets, but that praise is for all the wrong films. Saving Private Ryan and Schindler's List pale in comparison to Munich or Minority Report.)

Vertigo is a better film than Citizen Kane in most aspects, but they're each one of the best films in history.

His comments about Tarantino are spot-on; parts of his films are absolutely brilliant, but the rest is just pop culture and conversation.

I'll throw in Kathyrn Bigalow as overrated; as an exmaple, The Hurt Locker isn't nearly as good as everyone's making it out to be. Having her be the first female to win Best Director is an insult to people like Jane Campion or Maya Deren. Hell, I think that Miranda July has a more consistent vision than Bigelow.
You say Bigelow is overrated and then use The Hurt Locker as an "example". Well, give me another example of one of her films that is overrated haha. You mean too say THL is overrated, I'm sure.

Bigelow deserves the award this year. She isn't competing against all the female directors that have ever lived. And also, haha @ Deren, have you seen here films? The Academy would never have given her an award even if she was a man, her films are to out there.

[dissident]

He penned the script and shot the entire thing.

"After the first week of shooting, the set harmony was disturbed by some discussions about the work between the director and the producers (the executive producer, Ovidio G. Assonitis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ovidio_G._Assonitis), asked to verify the day-to-day activities, arguing with most of Cameron's choices), so whilst Cameron was only responsible for the shooting, most of the decisions were under Assonitis' authority."

i'd say that successfully discredits it as being cameron's debut. he himself has all but disowned the thing, and by all accounts the terminator is his major debut.

[andrewshungry]

this guy is ridiculous.

[reductiondesign]

does this coincide with who you'd vote for in terms of favorite director of all time?

No. My favorite director is Paul Thomas Anderson.

Bigelow deserves the award this year. She isn't competing against all the female directors that have ever lived. And also, haha @ Deren, have you seen here films? The Academy would never have given her an award even if she was a man, her films are to out there.

That's not my point. For a film as mediocre as The Hurt Locker to be the film people look back in three decades as the first Best Director win for a female is horrible.

However "out there" Deren's films are, she's still had quite the impact.

[dissident]

Cameron is definitely overrated. Personally I didn't like the Terminators. Alien is far superior to Aliens. Avatar looked awesome; however, the script was laughable. The Abyss was decent but nothing spectacular.

there are so many things wrong with this. i'm being fairly tongue in cheek about citizen kane, but i absolutely mean this - men who don't like the first two terminator films are wrong. not an opinion. and the abyss is astounding.

[Thomas Balkcom]

No. My favorite director is Paul Thomas Anderson.


I assumed as much, I was just curious.

[reductiondesign]

You say Bigelow is overrated and then use The Hurt Locker as an "example". Well, give me another example of one of her films that is overrated haha. You mean too say THL is overrated, I'm sure.

That is the film she'd win the Award for, after all. Sorry if my wording was poor.

[abandonship]

there are so many things wrong with this. i'm being fairly tongue in cheek about citizen kane, but i absolutely mean this - men who don't like the first two terminator films are wrong. not an opinion. and the abyss is astounding.

What is so good about them?

[SlappedActor]

Hahaha Maya Deron. There's a name I never expected to see dropped.

[reductiondesign]

I assumed as much, I was just curious.

Jumping tangentially based on your avatar: Did you see The Limits of Control?

[dissident]

A few thoughts after reading through this thread:


It's surprising to me that no one has suggested Spielberg as an overrated director. (Personally, I think he deserves most of the praise he gets, but that praise is for all the wrong films. Saving Private Ryan and Schindler's List pale in comparison to Munich or Minority Report.)

Vertigo is a better film than Citizen Kane in most aspects, but they're each one of the best films in history.

His comments about Tarantino are spot-on; parts of his films are absolutely brilliant, but the rest is just pop culture and conversation.

I'll throw in Kathyrn Bigalow as overrated; as an exmaple, The Hurt Locker isn't nearly as good as everyone's making it out to be. Having her be the first female to win Best Director is an insult to people like Jane Campion or Maya Deren. Hell, I think that Miranda July has a more consistent vision than Bigelow.

no, spieldberg is praised for all the right films. as great as munich and minority report are, to say they are that much better than private ryan or schindler's list is hysterical

and no one is overrating kathryn fucking bigalow. someone's biggest credit being point break isn't exactly praise.

[reductiondesign]

there are so many things wrong with this. i'm being fairly tongue in cheek about citizen kane, but i absolutely mean this - men who don't like the first two terminator films are wrong. not an opinion. and the abyss is astounding.

You are aware that art is, by definition, subjective, right?

[IAmNietzche]

No. My favorite director is Paul Thomas Anderson.



That's not my point. For a film as mediocre as The Hurt Locker to be the film people look back in three decades as the first Best Director win for a female is horrible.

However "out there" Deren's films are, she's still had quite the impact.
Impact or not, she'd never win an Oscar so there's no point in bringing her up. No matter what you think of the film, The Hurt Locker is critically acclaimed (for good reason) and I think Ms. Bigelow deserves the award.

[Thomas Balkcom]

Jumping tangentially based on your avatar: Did you see The Limits of Control?

yes and I loved it, did you?

[Thomas Balkcom]

and on Deren, as a sidenote, I had to write a paper on Divine Horsemen and it was one of the most difficult things I had to do that semester.

[IAmNietzche]

Hahaha Maya Deron. There's a name I never expected to see dropped.
I did a double-take.

[dissident]

this guy is ridiculous.

go listen to some anberlin jams and let the adults talk.

[abandonship]

On the female director note, I thought Carol Reed was a girl for a while haha.

[dissident]

What is so good about them?

uh they are two of the finest action films ever made? the terminator was made on a shoe string budget and everything except for the skeletal t-1000 at the end still holds up today. T2 shouldn't need a fucking explanation, you should just know it as truth. a pre-requisite for having a pair of testicles should be the love of terminator 2.

[IAmNietzche]

On the female director note, I thought Carol Reed was a girl for a while haha.
Haha, nice.

[IAmNietzche]

I wanna go to bed but there are too many good dissident posts. I don't want to miss anything.

[reductiondesign]

no, spieldberg is praised for all the right films. as great as munich and minority report are, to say they are that much better than private ryan or schindler's list is hysterical

and no one is overrating kathryn fucking bigalow. someone's biggest credit being point break isn't exactly praise.

Schindler's List is an average film about an extraordinary subject. Saving Private Ryan suffers from the same problem as Inglourious Basterds—the brilliant parts are weighed down by the rest of the film.

His best film is Close Encounters of the Third Kind, but that, Munich, Catch Me If You Can, Jaws, and Minority Report are all superior to the first two movies I mentioned.

Regarding Bigelow, The Hurt Locker is getting a lot more praise than Point Break ever will.

[Thomas Balkcom]

I wanna go to bed but there are too many good dissident posts. I don't want to miss anything.

hahaha

[dissident]

You are aware that art is, by definition, subjective, right?

you are aware that not everything is an opinion right? some things are objectively better than others. there are movies that i love that i can see why others might not. and there are movies that i love that i can't find fault with no matter how i try to look at them. T2 is one of those. it's a perfectly crafter action adventure film, there is not a single thing wrong with it outside of a few instances of poor dialogue.

[Thomas Balkcom]

on that note, thank God for some discussion (even in the direction this has gone) because I cannot sleep for whatever reason.

[dissident]

I wanna go to bed but there are too many good dissident posts. I don't want to miss anything.

your condescension is precious.

[dissident]

Regarding Bigelow, The Hurt Locker is getting a lot more praise than Point Break ever will.

sure it is, but point break will forever be the bigger movie. and hardly anyone even knows a woman directed either of them.

[reductiondesign]

Impact or not, she'd never win an Oscar so there's no point in bringing her up. No matter what you think of the film, The Hurt Locker is critically acclaimed (for good reason) and I think Ms. Bigelow deserves the award.

No, not for good reason. I'd rather see Avatar win Best Picture than The Hurt Locker. It shows such potential in the beginning and the end, but the rest of the film is just not that good. The character development is poor, the story nearly grinds to a halt in the middle, and scenes drag on and on when they shouldn't.

yes and I loved it, did you?

One of my favorites of '09, easily. The cinematography was near-perfect.

[Thomas Balkcom]

sure it is, but point break will forever be the bigger movie. and hardly anyone even knows a woman directed either of them.

is this really true?

[reductiondesign]

you are aware that not everything is an opinion right? some things are objectively better than others. there are movies that i love that i can see why others might not. and there are movies that i love that i can't find fault with no matter how i try to look at them. T2 is one of those. it's a perfectly crafter action adventure film, there is not a single thing wrong with it outside of a few instances of poor dialogue.

You can't be serious.

[IAmNietzche]

you are aware that not everything is an opinion right? some things are objectively better than others. there are movies that i love that i can see why others might not. and there are movies that i love that i can't find fault with no matter how i try to look at them. T2 is one of those. it's a perfectly crafter action adventure film, there is not a single thing wrong with it outside of a few instances of poor dialogue.
and the plot holes of course.

[dissident]

is this really true?

yes. i mean maybe some of you film dorks around here knew, but mostly people just think it's a good movie and haven't paid attention to who made it.

[IAmNietzche]

No, not for good reason. I'd rather see Avatar win Best Picture than The Hurt Locker. It shows such potential in the beginning and the end, but the rest of the film is just not that good. The character development is poor, the story nearly grinds to a halt in the middle, and scenes drag on and on when they shouldn't.
Disagree. The length of the scenes are perfect, the entire film has a slow burning tension that pervades even the scenes that in your mind "drag on". The film is paced extremely well.