2007 #1 NFL Draft Pick Goes To...

[TgE ARTdamage]

At this rate - Tampa Bay.

[xearlynovemberx]

Detroit

[xbrokendownx]

oakland

[Chriz2z]

Detroit
Great... so we can pick another promising WR who won't do anything but eat Big Macs.

Or we could get another QB even though our O-Line is shit. Joey>Brady at the same points in their careers.

[preppyak]

if Buffalo had a tougher schedule...after thier play today, I'd nominate them

[mikeford]

OAKLAND WILL NOT WIN A GAME

what dont you people understand about this?

[preppyak]

Great... so we can pick another promising WR who won't do anything but eat Big Macs.

Or we could get another QB even though our O-Line is shit. Joey>Brady at the same points in their careers.

Calvin Johnson would go #1...no doubt

[Chriz2z]

Calvin Johnson would go #1...no doubt
I'd pull an Eli and demand a trade.

[make_this_hurt]

OAKLAND WILL NOT WIN A GAME

what dont you people understand about this?
You are correct.

[crit]

oakland is a joke. they'll get it.

[SePaMc]

Oakland and Tennesee both suck.

At least Tenn showed some will to win against Indy today. Oakland choked it hard last week against Cleveland, and then they are blessed with an easy game against the niners which they probably won't pull out either.

OAK will probably get #1.

[Broken Parachute]

o a k l a n d

[Joe DeAndrea]

Oakland.

[Jason Tate]

Give it to the Titans ... Vince Young's doing really well down there. 0-5 .. bwahahahaha.

[Spicoli hey bud]

oakland is by far the worst team in the league.

how is this not obvious to everyone.

nothing about that team is good. except lamont.

[dekdog11]

OAKLAND

the titans will win a few games.
oakland maybe 1 at most.

[make_this_hurt]

It'll go like this:

1. Oakland
2. Cleveland
3. Tennessee
4. Detroit
5. Buffalo

[FondestMemory]

It'll go like this:

1. Oakland
2. Cleveland
3. Tennessee
4. Detroit
5. Buffalo

switch tennessee and cleveland for sure. and i think tampa bay will be top 5, replacing probably buffalo.

[Broken Parachute]

1. Oakland
2. Tennessee
3. Cleveland
4. Detroit
5. Tampa Bay

[make_this_hurt]

switch tennessee and cleveland for sure. and i think tampa bay will be top 5, replacing probably buffalo.
Cleveland won't win more than 3 games. Tennesse will win at least that many.. if only by luck.

[tambo41187]

if Buffalo had a tougher schedule...after thier play today, I'd nominate them

Seattle got blown out vs the bears in Chicago as well. Bills looked much better the 4 weeks prior to this.

[Yankees' #1 Fan]

oakland, no doubt.

[tambo41187]

You people are dumb if you think buffalo will be in the bottom 5 of the league...maybe the bottom 10.

[Scott Weber]

You people are dumb if you think buffalo will be in the bottom 5 of the league...maybe the bottom 10.
Yeah I really don't think today means too much. Right now, Chicago could beat anybody in the NFL by 20+ points at home.

[Broken Parachute]

You people are dumb if you think buffalo will be in the bottom 5 of the league...maybe the bottom 10.
Agreed. They've had a good season so far considering everyone projected them to be completely bad.

[Spicoli hey bud]

1) Oakland
2) Detroit
3) San Fran
4) Tennessee
5) Tampa

[make_this_hurt]

1) Oakland
2) Detroit
3) San Fran
4) Tennessee
5) Tampa
So wait... all those teams are gonna win more games than Cleveland... hahahahaha

[Spicoli hey bud]

So wait... all those teams are gonna win more games than Cleveland... hahahahaha
no. all of them are going to lose more games than cleveland. I ranked the bottom 5.

[make_this_hurt]

no. all of them are going to lose more games than cleveland. I ranked the bottom 5.
You know what I mean... Cleveland... is one of the worst 3 teams in the league... easily.

[FondestMemory]

1. oakland
2. tennessee
3. tampa bay
4. detroit
5. cleveland

[The Matt Kaufman]

tennessee

[Talib Scottie]

Maybe they'll let Oakland simply draft a 1AA team, they'd perform just as well and without the egos.

[tambo41187]

Yeah I really don't think today means too much. Right now, Chicago could beat anybody in the NFL by 20+ points at home.

They are just nasty right now, i dont think Seattle is a bad team at all and they looked it against them. Obviously buffalo is not a good team, but is no way was this game indicative how how good or bad they are.

[AntsInMyPants92]

lets see oakland sucks, there defense is old and sucks, their offense sucks, who is their best player i'm guessing their #1 overall pick in 2007

[LeftWideOpen]

I still say Oakland wins 2 games and Detroit finishes 1-15. Detroit has no heart, at all. They are pretty disgusting to even think about, to be honest. I guess you could say the same about Oakland too though.

I say ...

1. Detroit
2. Oakland
3. Tennessee
4. Green Bay
5. Cleveland

[ThatGuy]

stop hating on vy tate...he's going to be a great pro

in my opinion anyway

oaktown is getting the #1 pick. unless a defensive guy makes a statement, i would trade it

[Clarett'sGreyGoose]

1. Oakland
2. Tampa Bay
3. Cleveland
4. Tennessee
5. Detroit

Just missing the cut: Green Bay, Miami, Houston, Arizona and the Jets. There's your possible Top 10.

[leftstranded]

it's gonna be oakland

[PunkVideoGuys]

I don't see how anyone could watch oakland play and not think they're the worst in the league. Detroit has almost won their last 2 games. Tennesee almost won today....its def oakland. They suck and they just don't give a shit

[SePaMc]

1. Oakland
2. Tampa Bay
3. Cleveland
4. Tennessee
5. Detroit

Just missing the cut: Green Bay, Miami, Houston, Arizona and the Jets. There's your possible Top 10.
I'm a San Fran fan, and I think AZ > SF.
They both suck though.

I don't see how anyone could watch oakland play and not think they're the worst in the league. Detroit has almost won their last 2 games. Tennesee almost won today....its def oakland. They suck and they just don't give a shit

Exactly. Tennessee lost to Indy by ONE Point. ONE.

Oakland lost by 18 to SF, and gave up a 21-3 lead last week. I thought they might have won today. Giving up that many points, but finally having things click...I thought they could probably put some shit together against the niners. But nope. Not even close. No way do they beat anyone imo. Maybe squeak one game out somewhere, and one win doesn't get you out of #32.

[KB3RG]

1)Oakland
2)Titans
3)Detroit
4)Cleveland
5)TB

[mikeford]

anyone who doesnt say oakland seriously has no business ever discussing football on this site again. there i said it.

they blew a 21 point lead TO THE BROWNS.

they lost to the FOURTY NINERS

theyre not beating denver next week, nor AZ in week 7
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the only game in there they have a shot in hell in the dark at winning is at houston, even still theyre definitely going 1-15 at best.

no QB, no RB, no defense, randy moss doesnt give a shit, a coach whos basically catatonic on the sidelines, this franchise is going NOWHERE

0-16

[KB3RG]

anyone who doesnt say oakland seriously has no business ever discussing football on this site again. there i said it.

they blew a 21 point lead TO THE BROWNS.

they lost to the FOURTY NINERS

theyre not beating denver next week, nor AZ in week 7
8 Sun, Oct 29 Pittsburgh (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=pit) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Oakland+Raiders +Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 4:15 PM 9 Mon, Nov 6 at Seattle (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=sea) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Seattle+Seahawk s+Tickets&partner=ot) ESPN 8:30 PM 10 Sun, Nov 12 Denver (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=den) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Oakland+Raiders +Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 4:05 PM 11 Sun, Nov 19 at Kansas City (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=kan) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Kansas+City+Chi efs+Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 1:00 PM 12 Sun, Nov 26 at San Diego (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=sdg) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=San+Diego+Charg ers+Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 4:05 PM 13 Sun, Dec 3 Houston (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=hou) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Oakland+Raiders +Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 4:05 PM 14 Sun, Dec 10 at Cincinnati (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=cin) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Cincinnati+Beng als+Tickets&partner=ot) CBS 1:00 PM 15 Sun, Dec 17 St. Louis (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=stl) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Oakland+Raiders +Tickets&partner=ot) FOX 4:15 PM 16 Sat, Dec 23 Kansas City (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=kan) Tickets (http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=Oakland+Raiders +Tickets&partner=ot) NFL 8:00 PM 17 Sun, Dec 31 at NY Jets (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=nyj)
the only game in there they have a shot in hell in the dark at winning is at houston, even still theyre definitely going 1-15 at best.

no QB, no RB, no defense, randy moss doesnt give a shit, a coach whos basically catatonic on the sidelines, this franchise is going NOWHERE

0-16

you can not stressenough about the 21 point lead blown to browns enough. the browns are bad...Oakland proved they are the worst team

[fcknazisympathy]

oakland will be 0-16 and i hope the jets are right behind them at 2-14.

[bigmike]

Great... so we can pick another promising WR who won't do anything but eat Big Macs.

Or we could get another QB even though our O-Line is shit. Joey>Brady at the same points in their careers.
Yeah, exactly. If we some how tank the season and get the #1 pick, i hope we'd trade down for a few picks.
Calvin Johnson would go #1...no doubt
I'd much much much rather see us trade the #1 pick and actually start building a franchise. but we won't. we'd pick Dwayne jarret from USC over an obviously more talented reciever (a la charles rogers over andre johnson) and then Jarrett will eat his way out of the lineup within 2 years and then we're back at square one.


Edit: Also, no one's going winless this year. Oakland will be 2-14. I don't know how or who they'll beat, but no way will a team go winless. it's hard to do.

[mikeford]

not for oakland its not.

who the fuck else could they beat on that list other than houston?

their only chances were San Fran, Cleveland and Houston.

but they're 0 for 2 against those 3... so yeah.

[make_this_hurt]

not for oakland its not.

who the fuck else could they beat on that list other than houston?

their only chances were San Fran, Cleveland and Houston.

but they're 0 for 2 against those 3... so yeah.
100% A+

[preppyak]

not for oakland its not.

who the fuck else could they beat on that list other than houston?

their only chances were San Fran, Cleveland and Houston.

but they're 0 for 2 against those 3... so yeah.
I was trying to find a way to disagree with you, but I can't.

The Cincy game is too early in the season for them to have locked up a playoff spot, so they won't let up...and Kansas City, St Louis, and the NY Jets will either be fighting for a Wild Card spot or for pride in their last few weeks, so there is no way Oakland even gets a team with a bunch of back-ups in (assuming they could even beat that).

I think this is the 0-16 Raiders we are looking at...Randy Moss will probably be suspended by Week 10 is my guess

[make_this_hurt]

I was trying to find a way to disagree with you, but I can't.

The Cincy game is too early in the season for them to have locked up a playoff spot, so they won't let up...and Kansas City, St Louis, and the NY Jets will either be fighting for a Wild Card spot or for pride in their last few weeks, so there is no way Oakland even gets a team with a bunch of back-ups in (assuming they could even beat that).

I think this is the 0-16 Raiders we are looking at...Randy Moss will probably be suspended by Week 10 is my guess
Or traded.

[bigmike]

Or traded.
I'm pretty sure the NFL has a trade Deadline. Unless i'm way way out of the loop.

I still don't think they go winless. There's a reason why no one's done it since the Bucs.

[make_this_hurt]

I'm pretty sure the NFL has a trade Deadline. Unless i'm way way out of the loop.

I still don't think they go winless. There's a reason why no one's done it since the Bucs.
Oh I know. It's week 6 (I think).. which still gives them time to maybe trade him.

[fluke182]

I really do not see a way Oakland wins a game. I really think Ohio State would whip their asses right now. Well maybe not whip their asses, but it would be way too close. No less, Oakland has already earned the #1 pick, they just do not know it yet. With the #1 pick...the Oakland Raiders select....Brady Quinn from the University of Notre Dame.

[mikeford]

and they will still suck

and probably go 0-16 next year too.

[fluke182]

and they will still suck

and probably go 0-16 next year too.
It's exciting times for Raiders football.

[ActorInThisPlay]

why is it necessary to create a thread every week after Tampa Bay loses? anyway, the last 2 games were very winnable for them and Gradkowski looked good today. The only problem is they have a really tough schedule. I think they can turn it around still but I think it's pretty unlikely. I think they'll end up like 5-11. I think Tennessee and Oakland are a lot worse then Tampa.

Also the 49ers are 2-3 and they don't look that terrible compared to the last few years. I said Alex Smith would have a good year and he is so far. I say they end up like 7-9.

[bigmike]

I really do not see a way Oakland wins a game. I really think Ohio State would whip their asses right now. Well maybe not whip their asses, but it would be way too close. No less, Oakland has already earned the #1 pick, they just do not know it yet. With the #1 pick...the Oakland Raiders select....Brady Quinn from the University of Notre Dame.
I will never buy that the top college team can beat the worst NFL team. The talent difference from college to the NFL is still too great. As bad as Oakland is, they would still beat Ohio State. And Michigan. And Florida. And USC. and anyone else.

[justinevans]

Oakland will have the first pick.

[KB3RG]

I hope Quinn goes to some team that occasionaly will play GB (Not Detroit) that way Hawk can sack the shit out of him....

Oakland = sucks.

I agree that even the best NCAA teams couldnt beat an NFL team

[make_this_hurt]

I hope Quinn goes to some team that occasionaly will play GB (Not Detroit) that way Hawk can sack the shit out of him....

Oakland = sucks.

I agree that even the best NCAA teams couldnt beat an NFL team
I think Oakland may be the exception. They can't pass, run, pass protect, play defense, play special teams, or even line up correctly.

Ohio St. would pwn Oakland. 31-10.

[livethesounds]

Give it to the Titans ... Vince Young's doing really well down there. 0-5 .. bwahahahaha.

Please give it to the Titans. I honestly dont want them to win more than 2 games, and with the reminaing scheudle they might not. The state of the Titans is not Vince Youngs fault, hes not even doing that bad, plus hes a rookie with a depleted o line, what did u expect?
Oakland will probably get the #1 spot and take a QB, I think the Titans will be shooting for 2 or 3.

[fcknazisympathy]

I wish Chad Pennington would get hurt already so we can start Clemens, tank the season and draft Peterson.

[Web250]

Oakland is awful. Maybe 1-15 if they can pull it out against Houston.

[fcknazisympathy]

Oakland will be 0-16, write it down.

[livethesounds]

Oakland is awful. Maybe 1-15 if they can pull it out against Houston.
They wont beat Houston, the Texans arnt as bad of a team as most think they are.

[fcknazisympathy]

They wont beat Houston, the Texans arnt as bad of a team as most think they are.

Yeah, if David Carr had any sort of line/RB they could be an 8-8 team.

[livethesounds]

Yeah, if David Carr had any sort of line/RB they could be an 8-8 team.

if they would have drafted Reggie Bush they would have a real future ahead of them. now they are a 2 man team with Carr & Johnson.

[make_this_hurt]

if they would have drafted Reggie Bush they would have a real future ahead of them. now they are a 2 man team with Carr & Johnson.
When Davis is healthy.. they'll be fine.

Their d is young... and has a ton of talent...

The just need an O-line... and maybe 1 more reciever.

[livethesounds]

When Davis is healthy.. they'll be fine.

Their d is young... and has a ton of talent...

The just need an O-line... and maybe 1 more reciever.

They need more veteran guys on D, and obviously they need an O line. Johnson and Moulds are two pretty good recivers, but after that its nobody.

[make_this_hurt]

They need more veteran guys on D, and obviously they need an O line. Johnson and Moulds are two pretty good recivers, but after that its nobody.
They don't need much on d. Everyone is young and will be get better in the next 2 yeras or so. There's no need to bring in veterans when most of them are young and have a ton of talent. They'll learn.

And yea, they def. need another reciever.

[Smithers]

hopefully it will not be the raiders. i don't want Brady Quinn anywhere near that scumbag Al Davis.

[xbrokendownx]

hopefully it will not be the raiders. i don't want Brady Quinn anywhere near that scumbag Al Davis.







the raiders arent going to pick brady quinn if they get the #1 pick, i can guarantee you that

[LeftWideOpen]

brady quinn will be lucky to crack the Top 10. The honeymoon is over for him.

[make_this_hurt]

brady quinn will be lucky to crack the Top 10. The honeymoon is over for him.
He'll go top 5. He's got everything (intelligence, arm strength, accuracy).. and does well in a pro style offense.

Especially since so many teams need qbs.

[Spicoli hey bud]

brady quinn will be lucky to crack the Top 10. The honeymoon is over for him.
unless he can bring Charlie Weiss with him, I agree.

[LeftWideOpen]

QB's arent that important right now in the NFL ...bottom line. Just look at some of the recent SB champs as evidence of that. Running backs, WR/TEs and defensive playmakers are what matter the most right now and the only 2 bad teams who might be looking for a QB, Oakland and Detroit, are going to look defense first. I think the fall of Matt Leinart this past year is evidence of that.

theres still a lot of debate whether Brady Quinn is even the best pro prospect at QB. Brohm, Smith, Stanton, Kevin Kolb ..they are all in the mix with Quinn. I don't think he goes until the early teens and it'll be to a team like Kansas City or Minnesota who thinks they are only a small upgrade away at QB from contending.

[Smithers]

He'll go top 5. He's got everything (intelligence, arm strength, accuracy).. and does well in a pro style offense.

Especially since so many teams need qbs.

Exactly. Oakland absolutely NEEDS a QB, and Quinn is the best pro-style one out there, the one you want to rebuild your franchise with. which is exactly what Oakland needs.

But if they don't pick first, he'll more than likely fall to them anyway, since Tennessee and Tampa Bay don't need a QB.

[make_this_hurt]

QB's arent that important right now in the NFL ...bottom line. Just look at some of the recent SB champs as evidence of that. Running backs, WR/TEs and defensive playmakers are what matter the most right now and the only 2 bad teams who might be looking for a QB, Oakland and Detroit, are going to look defense first. I think the fall of Matt Leinart this past year is evidence of that.

theres still a lot of debate whether Brady Quinn is even the best pro prospect at QB. Brohm, Smith, Stanton, Kevin Kolb ..they are all in the mix with Quinn. I don't think he goes until the early teens and it'll be to a team like Kansas City or Minnesota who thinks they are only a small upgrade away at QB from contending.
Oakland, Cleveland, Minnesota, Kansas City, Detroit... all need a qb. They have a ton of other pieces... yet can't win.

Especially, Detroit, Cleveland, and Oakland.

And considering 3 qbs were takin in the first 11 picks. That's a lot. A qb can help turn around a franchise (see Carson Palmer).

[LeftWideOpen]

Oakland, Cleveland, Minnesota, Kansas City, Detroit... all need a qb. They have a ton of other pieces... yet can't win.

Especially, Detroit, Cleveland, and Oakland.

And considering 3 qbs were takin in the first 11 picks. That's a lot. A qb can help turn around a franchise (see Carson Palmer).

Those 3 teams (Det,Oak,Cle) aren't going to go with a QB in the 1st round, for different reasons. Cleveland has put their faith behind Frye and the decision makers there are mainly defensive minded and they spent #1's lately on talent to put AROUND Frye. They aren't going to spend another #1 pick on a skill position when they know they have other holes to fill.

Oakland and Detroit, on the other hand, can't even count all there needs on both hands. When you need to rebuild an entire organization, you don't start with the QB because he's only as good as the people around him. Look at David Carr and Houston, if you need evidence of that. Detroit also learned this lesson with Joey Harrington.

as for teams like minnesota and kansas city, they won't be drafting Top 5 or even Top 10. And I just mentioned that those are two teams where I could see Quinn landing ...but it won't be till the early teens. Quinn hasn't even proven he's the best QB prospect. That's just what the media has annointed him because of his coach and his uniform.

[make_this_hurt]

Those 3 teams (Det,Oak,Cle) aren't going to go with a QB in the 1st round, for different reasons. Cleveland has put their faith behind Frye and the decision makers there are mainly defensive minded and they spent #1's lately on talent to put AROUND Frye. They aren't going to spend another #1 pick on a skill position when they know they have other holes to fill.

Oakland and Detroit, on the other hand, can't even count all there needs on both hands. When you need to rebuild an entire organization, you don't start with the QB because he's only as good as the people around him. Look at David Carr and Houston, if you need evidence of that. Detroit also learned this lesson with Joey Harrington.

as for teams like minnesota and kansas city, they won't be drafting Top 5 or even Top 10. And I just mentioned that those are two teams where I could see Quinn landing ...but it won't be till the early teens. Quinn hasn't even proven he's the best QB prospect. That's just what the media has annointed him because of his coach and his uniform.
Detroit will take a qb. I'd put money on it. Kitna is only there to fill in for a year or two until they get someone in the draft. If Quinn is on the board, they'll take him. They need help with the o-line too... but when you have a talented qb on the board... and you need a qb... you take him. Espeically since good offensive lineman can easily come in later rounds.

[mikeford]

QB's arent that important right now in the NFL ...bottom line. Just look at some of the recent SB champs as evidence of that. Running backs, WR/TEs and defensive playmakers are what matter the most right now and the only 2 bad teams who might be looking for a QB, Oakland and Detroit, are going to look defense first. I think the fall of Matt Leinart this past year is evidence of that.

theres still a lot of debate whether Brady Quinn is even the best pro prospect at QB. Brohm, Smith, Stanton, Kevin Kolb ..they are all in the mix with Quinn. I don't think he goes until the early teens and it'll be to a team like Kansas City or Minnesota who thinks they are only a small upgrade away at QB from contending.

theres so much fundamentally wrong with this that i dont even know where to begin.

trent green is good. i hate to be the one to tell you this. unless that hit ended his career and damon huard is here to stay, they dont need a QB.

lets take a quick look at the recent SB champs and losers for that matter and how "unimportant" their QB is to their sucess.

2006: Steelers (Roesthleburger (ill never be able to spell this dudes name) ) vs. Seahawks (Hasselback)
okay, so youre wrong here since both of those dudes are at the very least above average QBs and matter a great deal to their team.
2005: New England (Brady... duh) v. Eagles (Mcnabb is their whole goddamn team since they didnt have a running game this season, and basically still dont in 2006-2007)
2004: New England (Brady again) v. Carolina (you're gonna tell me jake delhomme is directly determining whether they are winning games or not? steve smith might be THEE most important guy but delhomme is probably #2 on that team.)
2003: Ill conceed this one to your point, I guess, even though Rich Gannon was still good back then for the Raiders.
2002: Pats v. Rams theres no arguing both of the QBs are directly instrumental in the success. Kurt Warner was still on his deal with the devil at the time.
2001: Worst SB of all time we don't talk about this one it never happened.
2000: Rams v. Titans... Kurt Warners deal with the Devil + Steve McNair co-MVP that year... yeah QB not important there either.


so uh yeah.

[LeftWideOpen]

theres so much fundamentally wrong with this that i dont even know where to begin.

trent green is good. i hate to be the one to tell you this. unless that hit ended his career and damon huard is here to stay, they dont need a QB.

lets take a quick look at the recent SB champs and losers for that matter and how "unimportant" their QB is to their sucess.

2006: Steelers (Roesthleburger (ill never be able to spell this dudes name) ) vs. Seahawks (Hasselback)
okay, so youre wrong here since both of those dudes are at the very least above average QBs and matter a great deal to their team.
2005: New England (Brady... duh) v. Eagles (Mcnabb is their whole goddamn team since they didnt have a running game this season, and basically still dont in 2006-2007)
2004: New England (Brady again) v. Carolina (you're gonna tell me jake delhomme is directly determining whether they are winning games or not? steve smith might be THEE most important guy but delhomme is probably #2 on that team.)
2003: Ill conceed this one to your point, I guess, even though Rich Gannon was still good back then for the Raiders.
2002: Pats v. Rams theres no arguing both of the QBs are directly instrumental in the success. Kurt Warner was still on his deal with the devil at the time.
2001: Worst SB of all time we don't talk about this one it never happened.
2000: Rams v. Titans... Kurt Warners deal with the Devil + Steve McNair co-MVP that year... yeah QB not important there either.


so uh yeah.

every year you just mentioned after 2000 is evidence to my point. i'm not saying that you don't need an adequate QB ...but all those teams were loaded with defensive talent or outstanding playmakers at RB and WR.

New England - won it with defense, 1st.
Carolina - got there because of defense 1st.
Pittsburgh - defense/running game, 1st.
Seattle - Shaun Alexander and his MVP season.
Tampa Bay - defense.
Baltimore - defense
N.Y Giants - defense and running game
St. Louis - Marshall Faulk, Torry Holt, Issac Bruce.

my point is, you don't need your QB to be the focus of your franchise in order to win these days. Teams like Detroit and Oakland are so fundamentally flawed that the QB is only one of many worries. And you don't begin to rebuild around a QB ..he should be one of the last guys you bring in. Shore up the offensive line, the defense and the running game 1st. Those are what win Super Bowls, not just the guy taking the snap from the center.

[LeftWideOpen]

as for Trent Green, talent isnt the question. It's age. The dude is going to be 37 before next season starts.

[FondestMemory]

frye will get at least another season in cleveland. they won't pull the plug on his project after one season. they need to build a line in front of him.

he makes some shit decisions, but nobody could be successful behind the line they have going now.

however, if smith is available for them and the pick makes sense for them to take him, i don't know that they pass on him. he'd have to compete for the starting job though, it wouldn't be handed to him.

[bigmike]

I think Oakland may be the exception. They can't pass, run, pass protect, play defense, play special teams, or even line up correctly.

Ohio St. would pwn Oakland. 31-10.
Wrong. Completely wrong. Oakland looks bad against the best football players in the world. the NFL >>>>>> College in terms of talent and it will always be that way. A college team couldn't ever beat the worst NFL team, the talent, the size of OL/DL lines, the speed of the players. These aren't just no bodies, these are all guys on the raiders, that excelled in college. Pros are always better than College sports. Especially in a game where it would be 18-22 year olds vs. 22-40 year olds with more experience, knowlege of the game, and better schemes and just over all better talent.
Oakland will be 0-16, write it down.
Nope. they will win 1 game. and possibly the stars and planets align for a 2nd victory some how. This team isn't worse than the panthers team a handful of years ago that went 1-15. even they won a game. There's a reason why it hasn't happened since the Bucs went winless what? 30 some odd years ago?

[make_this_hurt]

Wrong. Completely wrong. Oakland looks bad against the best football players in the world. the NFL >>>>>> College in terms of talent and it will always be that way. A college team couldn't ever beat the worst NFL team, the talent, the size of OL/DL lines, the speed of the players. These aren't just no bodies, these are all guys on the raiders, that excelled in college. Pros are always better than College sports. Especially in a game where it would be 18-22 year olds vs. 22-40 year olds with more experience, knowlege of the game, and better schemes and just over all better talent.

Ohio St.'s offensive line is bigger than some pro lines. They average what... 6'6" or 6'7" and 320. That's humungo.

Speed wise... Ginn and Gonzalez are as fast as most NFL recievers... pittman will be an NFL back next year.

I will say taht I was being somewhat facetious.. but I do not think Oakland would win by a lot.

[mikeford]

i really dont know if oakland could beat the top 5 college teams.

[make_this_hurt]

i really dont know if oakland could beat the top 5 college teams.
Ohio St. may be the only one... mainly because of their huge/great o and d lines. But I really am not sure who would win.

[FondestMemory]

ohio state's o-line is big, but warren sapp is better than them.

ohio state's defense is good, but moss would tear up that secondary.

as horrible as oakland is, every player on that team is nfl potential. not every player on osu will end up playing pro by a long shot.

big mike's right on this one. easily.

[bigmike]

ohio state's o-line is big, but warren sapp is better than them.

ohio state's defense is good, but moss would tear up that secondary.

as horrible as oakland is, every player on that team is nfl potential. not every player on osu will end up playing pro by a long shot.

big mike's right on this one. easily.
Yeah. I think the speed is the big thing. OSU won't see a team with speed like an NFL team. Nothing even close to it. In football, i just don't think a college team can ever hang with the worst nfl teams.

[fcknazisympathy]

Yeah. I think the speed is the big thing. OSU won't see a team with speed like an NFL team. Nothing even close to it. In football, i just don't think a college team can ever hang with the worst nfl teams.

What about 2005 USC vs 2006 Oakland Raiders? I think that USC team had around 10 players go to the NFL with some more coming this year (Jarrett, Steve Smith)

[make_this_hurt]

What about 2005 USC vs 2006 Oakland Raiders? I think that USC team had around 10 players go to the NFL with some more coming this year (Jarrett, Steve Smith)
Last year's OSU team had more than that. 9 Defensive starters.. plus Mangold and Holmes.

[FondestMemory]

What about 2005 USC vs 2006 Oakland Raiders? I think that USC team had around 10 players go to the NFL with some more coming this year (Jarrett, Steve Smith)

that's still less than 15 nfl players against a roster of 52 nfl players.

the talent level at the top may not be that big of a gap, but the difference between talent from top to bottom is enormous.

[bigmike]

What about 2005 USC vs 2006 Oakland Raiders? I think that USC team had around 10 players go to the NFL with some more coming this year (Jarrett, Steve Smith)
Give me the Raiders by 14 or more.

NFL defenses would shut down the passing game for the most part and leinart would probably throw a few INT's and a TD or two. Just because they'll have like 20 kids go to the NFL doesn't mean they would have beaten an NFL team as college students. Leinart would struggle against an NFL defense, hence the big learning curves for QB's coming out of college and they would be able to shut down the run because warren sapp is better than any D-Lineman the Trojans saw in 05.

[bigmike]

Last year's OSU team had more than that. 9 Defensive starters.. plus Mangold and Holmes.
a roster full of NFL talent > less than 20 NFL players and a bunch of kids who's careers will end with their graduations.

[make_this_hurt]

a roster full of NFL talent > less than 20 NFL players and a bunch of kids who's careers will end with their graduations.
Oh, I know. But I still don't think it would as bad as you make it out to me. Oakland can barely run plays... let alone execute them.

[bigmike]

Oh, I know. But I still don't think it would as bad as you make it out to me. Oakland can barely run plays... let alone execute them.
Yes.... against NFL teams. Put them against a college team and that would improve.

[make_this_hurt]

Yes.... against NFL teams. Put them against a college team and that would improve.
I mean against themselves... they can barely get them off without a penalty or someone doing the wrong thing.

Plus.. who's gonna throw the ball for the Raiders? No one can even complete the ball to Moss...

I do think Jordan would rough them up on the ground though... he's a beast.

[bigmike]

I mean against themselves... they can barely get them off without a penalty or someone doing the wrong thing.

Plus.. who's gonna throw the ball for the Raiders? No one can even complete the ball to Moss...

I do think Jordan would rough them up on the ground though... he's a beast.
Yeah, would you need to throw the ball with Lamont Jordan running for 150+? And when they crowd the box, then you go up top. Also, the pass rush would be immensely slower, as a whole, then what the Chargers, Chiefs, etc etc throw at them week in week out. The game would be very, very slow to all of the raiders, thus, allowing them to make better decisions.

Andrew Walter did excel at throwing the ball in college. So against a college defense he could excel again.