EU constitution

[WithStamin]

Click (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe/06/13/eu.constitution/)

Does anyone this that this will actually go through? To me, it looks like France's next grab at trying to become the world's second superpower to balance the US while making the smaller states in the EU irrelavent. What do you think of this, PeeDster?

[BustaNutz]

A few things:

First of all the look for the EU to replace NATO. NATO was formed for the sole purpose of combating the Soviet Union and communism in the Cold War. Since the Cold War ended NATO is really an organization with no set goal, and no mission. France and a few other nations see NATO as being another US-controlled organization. The EU would allow for them to get away from American influence.

Second, the EU is doing as it sees fit, and in this particular circumstance, this is NONE of our business. The desire to implement a populace-based voting system is not a bad idea, in fact we have one house of congress based on this system, and while smaller countries such as Latvia or Lithuania may not be heard the same, in a military conflict involving the EU, Latvia and Lithuania will not be supplying the same amount of troops or support, so their vote will actually mean less. So while yes there are arguments for both sides it is understandable why they (the EU) would want this system.

Last, the EU is really going to accomplish very little even without the US, because France and the UK's relationship is every bit as rocky as the relationship between the US and France. And in this case the UK and France are the two presiding powers.

[yeat182]

Originally posted by BustaNutz
A few things:

First of all the look for the EU to replace NATO. NATO was formed for the sole purpose of combating the Soviet Union and communism in the Cold War. Since the Cold War ended NATO is really an organization with no set goal, and no mission. France and a few other nations see NATO as being another US-controlled organization. The EU would allow for them to get away from American influence.

Second, the EU is doing as it sees fit, and in this particular circumstance, this is NONE of our business. The desire to implement a populace-based voting system is not a bad idea, in fact we have one house of congress based on this system, and while smaller countries such as Latvia or Lithuania may not be heard the same, in a military conflict involving the EU, Latvia and Lithuania will not be supplying the same amount of troops or support, so their vote will actually mean less. So while yes there are arguments for both sides it is understandable why they (the EU) would want this system.

Last, the EU is really going to accomplish very little even without the US, because France and the UK's relationship is every bit as rocky as the relationship between the US and France. And in this case the UK and France are the two presiding powers.

so what benifit is it to lithuania or latvia to even be in the EU if their vote won't count as much? why wouldn't they want to be in NATO with the US? I

[BustaNutz]

Originally posted by yeat182
so what benifit is it to lithuania or latvia to even be in the EU if their vote won't count as much? why wouldn't they want to be in NATO with the US? I

Well actually neither of them is in NATO yet. They're former soviet states and in November of last year at the Prague conference they were both invited to accession talks (to discuss joining). However, most nations realize NATO is pointless (it's run it's course), and it accomplishes nothing, proof of this is at the Prague conference they argued over new voting procedures FOR A WEEK. That was all that happened along with inviting a few former soviet states to discuss joining.

Latvia and Lithuania would have some say in the EU, and it would offer them economic support packages as well as a chance to bring their military up to standards (moving from outdated soviet weapons into newer English and French-made weapons). The downside (and what they are fighting against) is the way that the EU wants to skew is voting system. But even if it does, the former soviet states which were invited to join the EU (ten in all) will benefit greatly from being allowed membership. Moreso even than they would from joining NATO. NATO has also discussed military standardization but debate looms over which weapons to use (American, English or French) as well as who foots the bill. The EU has agreed that all nations will foot the bill for this and that makes it a more attainable goal.

Sorry if that was jumbled...

[Alex Djaferis]

bustanutz has said pretty much everything i would have...
I havnt been following news to much lately here so im a bit lost reading all that. I think it will follow through because in the end...the smaller countries no matter how much noise theyll try to make will be completely ignored by the likes of France, Germany, Italy etc etc....Yeat, for the smaller ex communist block countries being inthe EU will benefit them no matter how many votes theyre allowed to get. Economically it SHOULD in theory help them...and they desperately need it...and they knew the circumstances theyd be in if they join the EU but they all did everything they could to join...

I think i'll read the papers in the next few days hehe...i havnt been following anything important. im in complete Summer Mode!

[yeat182]

Originally posted by BustaNutz
Well actually neither of them is in NATO yet. They're former soviet states and in November of last year at the Prague conference they were both invited to accession talks (to discuss joining). However, most nations realize NATO is pointless (it's run it's course), and it accomplishes nothing, proof of this is at the Prague conference they argued over new voting procedures FOR A WEEK. That was all that happened along with inviting a few former soviet states to discuss joining.

Latvia and Lithuania would have some say in the EU, and it would offer them economic support packages as well as a chance to bring their military up to standards (moving from outdated soviet weapons into newer English and French-made weapons). The downside (and what they are fighting against) is the way that the EU wants to skew is voting system. But even if it does, the former soviet states which were invited to join the EU (ten in all) will benefit greatly from being allowed membership. Moreso even than they would from joining NATO. NATO has also discussed military standardization but debate looms over which weapons to use (American, English or French) as well as who foots the bill. The EU has agreed that all nations will foot the bill for this and that makes it a more attainable goal.

Sorry if that was jumbled...


cool, i was just thinking that it is kind of bogus to join up if you aren't even going to have equal say in what goes on.