Create Your Society

[Lueda Alia]

We were asked this question in my Sociology class, so I figured I'd present it to you guys as well since you're all pretty opinionated regarding how a society should work, etc.

If you could create your own society, obviously based on your own personal beliefs, how would you deal with the following or make them operate/function in your society? What purposes would they serve?

1. Economy (What kind? Why?)
2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)

I added the questions in the brackets just to give you guys an idea, so you don't necessarily need to answer them (or only them) directly. Anyway, this is almost like being in charge of re-writing the constitution! So have a go at it.

[loveisdead]

I wrote my final paper on this in philosophy my senior year. Before I give my answer, I have a few questions about what you're asking.

Family- How would anyone know what kind of family exists? I don't get what you're trying to say. Do you mean in terms of gay marriage?
Religion- Whatever society we create would not be able to change what religion's function is. Nor would any society be able to force how a religion deals with homosexuality or anything else.

Could you clear it up for me a little?

[JuneJuly]

Eda, you mean nuclear family versus an extended family?

No, nevermind.

[Lueda Alia]

I wrote my final paper on this in philosophy my senior year. Before I give my answer, I have a few questions about what you're asking.

Family- How would anyone know what kind of family exists? I don't get what you're trying to say. Do you mean in terms of gay marriage?
Religion- Whatever society we create would not be able to change what religion's function is. Nor would any society be able to force how a religion deals with homosexuality or anything else.

Could you clear it up for me a little?
Regarding family: you need to identify the functions of the family institution, their social issues, etc. For example, you can list the norms/values associated with families, what statuses are available, etc.

The same applies to Religion.

[Debut_Fin]

1. Economy (What kind? Why?)
- Socialize necessities (healthcare, education, shelter, etc)
- Capitalism for luxuries
- Obviously there are debates over what is a necessity and over time luxuries become necessities (cell phones, internet, etc) but for simplicity's sake this is my view.

2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
- heterosexual couples, homosexual couples, and single parenting would be allowed.
- you can't really say what kind of families will "exist"... that kind of just happens i think, unless i'm missing your point

3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
- your rights extend as far as they don't intrude on anyone else's rights.
- crime would be dealt with similar to how it is in America, although I'm not crazy about lawyers because clever lawyers can lead juries to come to "wrong" conclusions in my opinion, but I do like the whole "jury of your peers" idea
- I go back and forth all of the time on my opinion on the death penalty so I won't comment on that.

4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
- I really think a public school system CAN work very well and is good for society and for children if they are given adequate funding. None of that voucher bullshit.
- I also believe, based on my K-12 public schooling, that they teach you a lot of stuff that just doesn't matter. Kids graduate high school knowing all about Mesopotamia but knowing almost nothing about current events, which makes no sense to me. Also, I remember learning the different types of clouds in 5th grade and even at that age being like "this is a waste of time' Teach nutrition or something instead - something of value.

5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)
- If I'm being completely honest, I would be 100% fine in a society with no religion. We don't need it. We can be better than that. Religion does not lead to morality, like some claim it does. I believe that die hard theists curb society's development. Why study science when we can just say "IDK God did it". Of course if someone believed in God or any god, I would't have any right to tell them not to or not to congregate with other believers. I'm a BIG proponent of separation of church and state. America claims to have that ideal but I truly believe we are far from it. Homosexuality wouldn't be an "issue" in my society and every Tuesday would be Free Abortion Day. Not really for the second part though. Maybe. I have to think about it.


I could have put a lot more time and thought into this, but in a very very very general sense, this is kind of my mindset.

If I completely missed the point of what you were looking for I can elaborate.

Also I know you're Canadian and I referenced America a thousand times. Sorry about that.

[apoemtothedead]

King Mark

[boxingwithstars]

1. Economy
-Social Democracy (or Democratic Socialism if we're talking about creating a society from scratch and not reforming the one we live in now). Focus on small business and the working class instead of big industry. Single payer health care system. Progressive income tax (The wealthier you are, the more taxes you pay. Plain and simple.) Idealistically, a society that is controlled by the working class.

2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
-This is kind of impossible to answer since it's not up to me to decide what constitutes a family. Family would differ depending on the individuals involved and the government would be entirely respectful of that, granting all families equal protection under the law.

3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
-If you're doing something that hurts or could possibly hurt someone else, you can't do it, and you'll face consequences. Set up the judicial system similar to how it is now, but ONLY provide defendants with a public defender. This eliminates the problem of the rich being able to buy their way out of their crimes by purchasing a better lawyer.

4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
-Free public education for all. Instead of building charter schools that can function more freely because they don't have to adhere to the same rules as public schools, we should respect the fact that not all public schools are going to function the same and have the same set of rules, or be able to meet the same expectations. Allow schools and districts more freedom in structuring their classes and assessing their students. Of course, none of this is possible unless we allocate enough money to make it possible. If we fund all our public schools equally well, we won't need to privatize education.

5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)
-Completely secular government. People are free to practice any religion and free from any religious persecution. Churches should be required to turn over their financial information. Depending on their individual financial situation, they may or may not be required to pay taxes. Marriage is a primarily a legal and social institution, and only a religious institution if you want it to be. Religious views shouldn't prevent any one person or minority group from having full and equal civil rights.

[loveisdead]

:appl:

[StephenYoung]

No need for guidelines.

I want to live where everyone is equal, but I'm super rich, and own all the important resources.

My personal worth makes me worth more than most small and midsize states.

I have a personal army, and my house is called the death star.

[boxingwithstars]

4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
- I also believe, based on my K-12 public schooling, that they teach you a lot of stuff that just doesn't matter. Kids graduate high school knowing all about Mesopotamia but knowing almost nothing about current events, which makes no sense to me. Also, I remember learning the different types of clouds in 5th grade and even at that age being like "this is a waste of time' Teach nutrition or something instead - something of value.

You're right, the more we standardize education the more you'll notice we exclude certain topics and focus on things that--in the end--are wasteful.

The problem here is what is of value to one person is not of value to everyone, and vise versa. You might not have thought it was important to learn about the different types of clouds, but another student who was interested in meteorology probably loved that lesson. It also has a lot to do with HOW the information is being presented. It's my belief that a good teacher can make anything interesting and every topic relevant. So, the problem isn't necessarily with the material... but instead with the way it's being presented.

I think instead of going through the curriculum and deciding what needs to be eliminated and what needs to stay, a better solution would be to allow more choice within education. At all levels... for teachers, parents, and students. No two students are exactly the same, and no one should be receiving the exact same education. So instead of trying to make students fit into our model of school and learning, we should be modeling school to fit the student.

[Debut_Fin]

You're right, the more we standardize education the more you'll notice we exclude certain topics and focus on things that--in the end--are wasteful.

The problem here is what is of value to one person is not of value to everyone, and vise versa. You might not have thought it was important to learn about the different types of clouds, but another student who was interested in meteorology probably loved that lesson. It also has a lot to do with HOW the information is being presented. It's my belief that a good teacher can make anything interesting and every topic relevant. So, the problem isn't necessarily with the material... but instead with the way it's being presented.

I think instead of going through the curriculum and deciding what needs to be eliminated and what needs to stay, a better solution would be to allow more choice within education. At all levels... for teachers, parents, and students. No two students are exactly the same, and no one should be receiving the exact same education. So instead of trying to make students fit into our model of school and learning, we should be modeling school to fit the student.

I can agree with this, but I still think 1 nutrition lesson every once in a while (which is what we had) should EASILY take precedence over the different types of clouds since one is relevant to everyone and the other is more of a special interest to most

[open mind]

We were asked this question in my Sociology class, so I figured I'd present it to you guys as well since you're all pretty opinionated regarding how a society should work, etc.

If you could create your own society, obviously based on your own personal beliefs, how would you deal with the following or make them operate/function in your society? What purposes would they serve?

1. Economy (What kind? Why?)
2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)

I added the questions in the brackets just to give you guys an idea, so you don't necessarily need to answer them (or only them) directly. Anyway, this is almost like being in charge of re-writing the constitution! So have a go at it.


every bit of the economy would be highly regulated (so it wouldn't hurt the rest in the event of a catastrophe) and the poor would pay no taxes, the middle class would pay a small amount, and the rich would pay at least 60%. i think this model would encourage everyone at all levels of society to better themselves, their society, and bring a greater sense of solidarity. healthcare and education for all.

i would not give a crap about your family.....what matters is a loving environment in which to grow in, mental health, concern for your community, and being the best you can be at whatever you choose to do that month.

violent crimes and theft of any kind would be punished in varying levels based on severeness of the crime......but prison would not be a torture chamber of rape, mistreatment, and general fucked-uped-ness....it would be a place where people do what our current justice system claims it's doing........teaching people how to be good and productive citizens once they get out of jail. this would occur through many trade and broader educational programs......since most who enter jail are incredibly uneducated no one who enters the system will be released until they've gotten at least a ged. financial theft would also be treated just as (if not more) harshly as physical theft. we would not have capital punishment. lawyers would not be able to strike potential jurors. a jury would be 20 instead of 12.....and would by law require at least 3 individuals of the person on trials race to be in the jury. a judge would not be able to bar new and crucial dna evidence to a case.....especially when it comes to dipshits in texas who refuse to admit evidence that would exonerate an innocent man......but that state is used to being killers of innocent people........anyways......i would also decree that whatever amount of money that the prosecution spends on attempting to damn a man, the defense should receive equal funds. all drugs would also be legal and those who worked in the distribution of them would be seen as legitimate business men. those who become addicted would not be treated as criminals.....they would be treated the same as anyone else who suffers a mental ailment......but those who commit gross acts of violence or destroy/steal an inordinate amount of property would be required to pay for their crimes, under the influence or not.

i believe i've already created a very loose system of education in the education thread that's on the current page.

religion does not belong in government. those who choose to get involved in it should not harbor any sense of self superiority....if they do they're not only missing the point of religion......they're assholes.

[deanster321]

1. Economy
-Social Democracy (or Democratic Socialism if we're talking about creating a society from scratch and not reforming the one we live in now). Focus on small business and the working class instead of big industry. Single payer health care system. Progressive income tax (The wealthier you are, the more taxes you pay. Plain and simple.) Idealistically, a society that is controlled by the working class.

2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
-This is kind of impossible to answer since it's not up to me to decide what constitutes a family. Family would differ depending on the individuals involved and the government would be entirely respectful of that, granting all families equal protection under the law.

3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
-If you're doing something that hurts or could possibly hurt someone else, you can't do it, and you'll face consequences. Set up the judicial system similar to how it is now, but ONLY provide defendants with a public defender. This eliminates the problem of the rich being able to buy their way out of their crimes by purchasing a better lawyer.

4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
-Free public education for all. Instead of building charter schools that can function more freely because they don't have to adhere to the same rules as public schools, we should respect the fact that not all public schools are going to function the same and have the same set of rules, or be able to meet the same expectations. Allow schools and districts more freedom in structuring their classes and assessing their students. Of course, none of this is possible unless we allocate enough money to make it possible. If we fund all our public schools equally well, we won't need to privatize education.

5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)
-Completely secular government. People are free to practice any religion and free from any religious persecution. Churches should be required to turn over their financial information. Depending on their individual financial situation, they may or may not be required to pay taxes. Marriage is a primarily a legal and social institution, and only a religious institution if you want it to be. Religious views shouldn't prevent any one person or minority group from having full and equal civil rights.
I know I'm being kind of lazy by not contributing anything myself, but I honestly agree with this pretty much word for word.

[<*)))><]

I want everything to based on Jet Packs

[plyb]

every bit of the economy would be highly regulated (so it wouldn't hurt the rest in the event of a catastrophe) and the poor would pay no taxes, the middle class would pay a small amount, and the rich would pay at least 60%. i think this model would encourage everyone at all levels of society to better themselves, their society, and bring a greater sense of solidarity. healthcare and education for all.
This sounds like it may have a huge flaw... You can't have taxes result in a raise in salary lead to a loss of overall funds because of a obscenely large increase in taxes. It will create a stagnant society. Obviously, just listing 3 sections, you are being very broad... but taxes have to be a slow rise as your income rises, not an exponential gain.

[open mind]

This sounds like it may have a huge flaw... You can't have taxes result in a raise in salary lead to a loss of overall funds because of a obscenely large increase in taxes. It will create a stagnant society. Obviously, just listing 3 sections, you are being very broad... but taxes have to be a slow rise as your income rises, not an exponential gain.

yeah i'd probably break into 8-10 brackets.....and it wouldn't be a system in which you were taxed on the first dollar you made, it'd be a system in which every dollar you made after oh...250k would be taxed at the highest level.

i don't believe that would create a stagnant society.....it certainly didn't following wwII.

[plyb]

yeah i'd probably break into 8-10 brackets.....and it wouldn't be a system in which you were taxed on the first dollar you made, it'd be a system in which every dollar you made after oh...250k would be taxed at the highest level.

i don't believe that would create a stagnant society.....it certainly didn't following wwII.
I am not sure I am completely following... are you saying, basically, you would have brackets, like 0-35, then 35-55, ect, ect where, in this example, everyone's first 35k is taxed the same. Then say you are making 50... so only 15 of your 50 is taxed based off that bracket. And so on and so forth.

If so, that seems in intriguing to me.

[open mind]

I am not sure I am completely following... are you saying, basically, you would have brackets, like 0-35, then 35-55, ect, ect where, in this example, everyone's first 35k is taxed the same. Then say you are making 50... so only 15 of your 50 is taxed based off that bracket. And so on and so forth.

If so, that seems in intriguing to me.

i think we're more or less on the same page here....but i'm not entirely sure of that.

i'd go with the first 35k being tax free, then everything after 35k to say 50k being taxed at maybe 10%, then everything after 50k to 70k being taxed at 20%, then everything after 70k to 90k being taxed at 25%.....and so on and so forth.

it's not all that different from our current structure except those in the highest brackets would pay more then they currently do.....and loopholes would be non-existant.

[plyb]

yep, same page. confusion mostly stemmed from my ignorance about the tax system in the first place.

[Simulcast]

1. Economy Workers exist on an equal footing. They collect raw materials (things like natural gas and precious metals and minerals) and deposit them into a central processing facility. A nexus if you will. Sites may require expansions with multiples nexuses in order to maximize income. All resources go into war production and the means of sustaining it; divided between war machines and new technologies, like hardened armor and extended weapons range.
2. Family Exists solely within the Nexus. Primary function is to produce workers to increase income rate.
3. Deviance and crime With everyone working towards a common goal this is irrelevant. However in the rare case of civil disobedience, offenders will be sent to the front lines.
4. Educational institution Research centers where new technologies are simultaneously developed and learned. Things like cloaking abilities, psionic powers, and warp tech.
5. Religion Caste system, based on the "Path to Ascension".

[loveisdead]

Starcraft is a fun game.

[Simulcast]

Starcraft is a fun game.

I like you even more now.

[loveisdead]

I like you even more now.

Haha, I haven't played in forever.

[Colinmac36]

i love america.

[saysmydoctor]

This thread requires additional pylons.

[Simulcast]

lol

[loveisdead]

This thread requires additional pylons.

:lol:

[loveisdead]

1. Economy (What kind? Why?)
Open Mind is onto what I would pretty much do. A very progressive tax structure (I'd probably say under 30k won't have to deal with hardly any taxes and over 250k gets slammed with them pretty hard). That tax money would be spent on a lot of infrastucture as well as education. Basically, my economic ideas wouldn't differ all that much from how we do things in America, except that I'd change where I spend the tax money and tax a bit differently. And I'd absolutely have a single-payer health care system.
2. Family (What sort of families will exist?)
We went over this on aim. I think this is a silly question. Whatever family would like to exist.
3. Deviance and crime (What determines what is deviant? How will you deal with crime? What about punishment?)
I'm pretty much okay with how things are done here in America. Though I do think the idea of having public defenders represent the accused may be a good idea.
4. Educational institution (Besides the obvious function that it serves -- keep in mind the issues that have arised in our own societies and explain how you would avoid them in your own)
I think that taxes needed to be spread equally to all public schools. The way it is set up in America is totally fucked. I'm not against private schools. If someone wants to spend the money to send their kid to one then that's fine with me.
5. Religion (What are its functions? How do they deal with issues such as homosexuality?)
Religion's functions won't change much. If people want to go to church and worship then they can. It wouldn't have any place in government at all, but what people want to do with their religion is completely up to them. A better question might be directed towards religious institutions, as I believe they cause more problems then religion alone (which is really just a philosophy).

Sort of a sloppy answer. Maybe I'll try to come across as more intelligent later haha.

[GuitarR0cker1]

1. Economy- A pretty strange mix between anarcho-syndicalism, social democracy and capitalism. Basic needs would be provided to everyone under a certain income level and a fixed minimum income is in existence for everyone which supplements any income earned through employment. Employment is not as permanent for a certain creative class that are essentially free agents of the economy, while employment is much more permanent for the working class where there's a lot of attachment towards the business they're a part of considering that they make many major decisions democratically. There is only an income tax and certain fees and tolls that make up the tax base however the tax rate is extremely high. The government supplies a 10 year pension/vacation plan which allows people to break for leisure whenever they chose as long as it is set 1 year in advance or there is a good reason that meets certain criteria.
Oh and urban planning is extremely dense. Nearly everyone lives in packed urban areas (there are no low density suburbs) and there's little in the way of auto transportation. It's very easy to be taken to wilderness areas. This is a really fragmented explanation but the general idea is that wasteful energy use would be severely reduced by a change in living standards.
2. Family- The idea of the nuclear family would be de-emphasized more in favor of community and communal living through how living structures are planned. I'm not sure how practical this would be but other than this there would be no guidelines as to what a nuclear family looks like. There would be no incentives to marry. In fact marriage would only be for the religious. The only important familial civil institution would be that of guardianship over children.
3. Deviance and crime- Drug use wouldn't be stigmatized or prosecuted during leisure time unless harm was caused to others because of the drugs' effects. However on the job drug use is severely punished by employers and any damages done to property or other individuals because of the drug would be prosecuted to the fullest extent. Other than this the system would be pretty similar to America's except with no death penalty and a larger emphasis on rehabilitation.
4. Educational institution- Public education across the board, with lots of variation between schools starting at the middle school level which can lead kids in different directions based on their learning styles and interests. Higher level education would be paid for the government but would be administered by private institutions.
5. Religion- Religion's importance would be diminished in this society but would still play a ceremonial role. The government has no role in it but the changes in society have led to fundamentalist thought being wiped out for the most part.

I'm just throwing out ideas and theories out there. I'm assuming this is building a society from scratch. Don't be too harsh toward my ideas guys, I came up with these on the spot haha.

[anab]

I want to create it soon.

[BopRock]

2 words
Robot Dinsaurs