Help for dissertation on punk rock

[Dogfingers]

Hi guys, Im currently writing an essay on identity within the punk rock music genre and would appreciate your help. I'd be grateful if you could answer some simple questions about what punk rock means to you.

1)What does punk rock mean to you?

2)Does punk rock music influence how you dress? If so how and why?

3)Do you consider yourself a fan of any other music scene's? Indie, pop, rap, r'n'b for example.

4)Do you feel there is a division in the punk rock fans regarding the attitudes between older bands such as The Velvet Underground, The Sex Pistols and The Ramones and more recent punk bands such as Sum 41, Blink 182 and Green Day?

5)Do you think popularity effects a bands punk bands legitimacy? Is this 'selling out'?

Thanks for reading guys, feel free to be as strongly opinionated as you wish. I'd love to hear what you guys think so if you have anything else to add I'd appreciate it, cheers.

[alice+interiors]

Hi guys, Im currently writing an essay on identity within the punk rock music genre and would appreciate your help. I'd be grateful if you could answer some simple questions about what punk rock means to you.

1)What does punk rock mean to you?

2)Does punk rock music influence how you dress? If so how and why?

3)Do you consider yourself a fan of any other music scene's? Indie, pop, rap, r'n'b for example.

4)Do you feel there is a division in the punk rock fans regarding the attitudes between older bands such as The Velvet Underground, The Sex Pistols and The Ramones and more recent punk bands such as Sum 41, Blink 182 and Green Day?

5)Do you think popularity effects a bands punk bands legitimacy? Is this 'selling out'?

Thanks for reading guys, feel free to be as strongly opinionated as you wish. I'd love to hear what you guys think so if you have anything else to add I'd appreciate it, cheers.

you forgot fall out boy.

[Regards]

you forgot fall out boy.
lawlz.

[SickOfStars]

Hi guys, Im currently writing an essay on identity within the punk rock music genre and would appreciate your help. I'd be grateful if you could answer some simple questions about what punk rock means to you.

1)What does punk rock mean to you?

2)Does punk rock music influence how you dress? If so how and why?

3)Do you consider yourself a fan of any other music scene's? Indie, pop, rap, r'n'b for example.

4)Do you feel there is a division in the punk rock fans regarding the attitudes between older bands such as The Velvet Underground, The Sex Pistols and The Ramones and more recent punk bands such as Sum 41, Blink 182 and Green Day?

5)Do you think popularity effects a bands punk bands legitimacy? Is this 'selling out'?

Thanks for reading guys, feel free to be as strongly opinionated as you wish. I'd love to hear what you guys think so if you have anything else to add I'd appreciate it, cheers.

1) I can't really sum up what punk and "punk rock" means to me in one sentence. It's really a huge combination of a few different things. For one, it means operating under the music radar. There are 'punk rock' bands playing on clear channel labels, and I enjoy some of them, but they have nothing to do with what punk means to me. Basically, DIY or die. You can be on truly independent labels (No Idea, Level-Plane, etc,) but that's about it.

Also, the same can be said for shows. Small venues and basements. That's it. As soon as you have to get into the nitty gritty over promotion companies and whatnot, the jig is up.

As far as politics go, it isn't about being rude and unruly anymore. Anarchist beliefs are not necessary. Basically, total off the charts political beliefs to do with consumerism, society, preconceived notions, and any of the large -ism's and -phobias (racism, homophobia, etc). If you claim to be punk and say "***" without being satirical about it, then you should re-think your life. This, in effect, completely does away with the question of legitimacy for sites like "conservative punk".

And of course, the music itself. It can basically be in any style (as the recent 'folk-punk' movement has really shown everyone,) and the lyrical content can be varied. As long as it is tied to the community and the basic sounds that everyone works off of, it's all good.

2) I think it's inevitable. Sure, it's shallow, but chances are it's going to influence how you dress. I don't believe in the exaggerated "punk" dress portrayed in the mainstream. Chances are you're going to want to wear well-fitting jeans and t-shirts and maybe have longer hair. Also, vegetarianism and veganism being big parts of actual punk rock culture may influence what people DON'T wear.

If you're referring to studded belts, plaid pants, and doc martin boots though, no way. Shit's fake as can be. Same with mohawks. A lot of fans of the actual punk/hardcore/folkpunk/whatever movement going on these days are not noticeable through how "offensive" their clothing is. Like I've said before, it's not the same as it used to be. This isn't 1977 anymore.

3) I listen to as much music as possible. I listen to plenty of music that isn't punk, or even independent. However, punk and hardcore will always be what I consider "home base," where my beliefs and attitudes are accepted and where I feel most at home in a musical community.

4) As far as the bands you listed, no. There isn't. The newer bands you mentioned were either complete exploitations of the word "punk" or pop-punk bands that happened to get big and write poppier songs (see: blink.) The older bands were before punk completely established itself as an underground movement. I think the main division you'd find with fans of those bands is the ones that like the older bands (minus the Sex Pistols, they were a sham) are more likely to be intelligent music listeners rather than 16 year old pacsun shopping skater boys/girls.

5) It isn't as much how popular they are as how they are set up in the music industry. A hardcore band called Circle Takes the Square opened for Fear Before the March of Flames, who are not punk rock by any stretch of the word, both through their music and their record label placement. CTTS is still on "Robotic Empire," a humongous, completely independent label. So, even though their fanbase has grown considerably because of that, they are still embodying the idea of punk through not being on an "official" clear channel label, writing songs purely to cater to others, etc etc. You can be popular as fuck, as long as you're not a part of the mainstream music industry.


Notes: I think you should do a little more research. It sounds like you're coming into this essay thinking you're going to write about Fat Wreck bands like NOFX and Lagwagon vs. "pop-punk" bands like Blink 182, Sum 41, and Fall Out Boy, while discussing stereotypical "punk" fashion (which shouldn't even be a factor anyway.) You'll find that even what you may be considering "punk rock" bands are on the fringe because of label involvement. If you need any help, just hit me up and I can point you in a few directions.

[Pat k]

I just did an historiographical essay about the punk rock subculture. You need to check out Dick Hebdige's Subculture: The Meaning of Style. Read that, look at the footnotes, and then check out the books that respond to Hebdige.

I am sure you know all about that as a PHD student, but I'm just trying to be helpful.

[Brandon Allin]

I don't think this survey is regarding "punk rock" in any way, shape, or form. if we're talking green day and sum 41, count me out, but if we're discussing bands like stiff little fingers, minor threat, the business, or cock sparrer, I'll come back to you.

[SickOfStars]

I don't think this survey is regarding "punk rock" in any way, shape, or form. if we're talking green day and sum 41, count me out, but if we're discussing bands like stiff little fingers, minor threat, the business, or cock sparrer, I'll come back to you.

check my comment. Let's at least try to get him on the right track if he's not on it now, ya know?

[summer skin]

I thought CTTS were on equal vision?

[Brandon Allin]

check my comment. Let's at least try to get him on the right track if he's not on it now, ya know?
too long, skimmed through it. you've got the jist of what I would've said.

[SickOfStars]

I thought CTTS were on equal vision?

Not to my knowledge. I know Hot Cross signed to EV, but I'm pretty sure CTTS are still on RE.

[summer skin]

Not to my knowledge. I know Hot Cross signed to EV, but I'm pretty sure CTTS are still on RE.
nvm...i just saw them on merchnow and made the assumption.

[Dogfingers]

1) I can't really sum up what punk and "punk rock" means to me in one sentence. It's really a huge combination of a few different things. For one, it means operating under the music radar. There are 'punk rock' bands playing on clear channel labels, and I enjoy some of them, but they have nothing to do with what punk means to me. Basically, DIY or die. You can be on truly independent labels (No Idea, Level-Plane, etc,) but that's about it.

Also, the same can be said for shows. Small venues and basements. That's it. As soon as you have to get into the nitty gritty over promotion companies and whatnot, the jig is up.

As far as politics go, it isn't about being rude and unruly anymore. Anarchist beliefs are not necessary. Basically, total off the charts political beliefs to do with consumerism, society, preconceived notions, and any of the large -ism's and -phobias (racism, homophobia, etc). If you claim to be punk and say "***" without being satirical about it, then you should re-think your life. This, in effect, completely does away with the question of legitimacy for sites like "conservative punk".

And of course, the music itself. It can basically be in any style (as the recent 'folk-punk' movement has really shown everyone,) and the lyrical content can be varied. As long as it is tied to the community and the basic sounds that everyone works off of, it's all good.

2) I think it's inevitable. Sure, it's shallow, but chances are it's going to influence how you dress. I don't believe in the exaggerated "punk" dress portrayed in the mainstream. Chances are you're going to want to wear well-fitting jeans and t-shirts and maybe have longer hair. Also, vegetarianism and veganism being big parts of actual punk rock culture may influence what people DON'T wear.

If you're referring to studded belts, plaid pants, and doc martin boots though, no way. Shit's fake as can be. Same with mohawks. A lot of fans of the actual punk/hardcore/folkpunk/whatever movement going on these days are not noticeable through how "offensive" their clothing is. Like I've said before, it's not the same as it used to be. This isn't 1977 anymore.

3) I listen to as much music as possible. I listen to plenty of music that isn't punk, or even independent. However, punk and hardcore will always be what I consider "home base," where my beliefs and attitudes are accepted and where I feel most at home in a musical community.

4) As far as the bands you listed, no. There isn't. The newer bands you mentioned were either complete exploitations of the word "punk" or pop-punk bands that happened to get big and write poppier songs (see: blink.) The older bands were before punk completely established itself as an underground movement. I think the main division you'd find with fans of those bands is the ones that like the older bands (minus the Sex Pistols, they were a sham) are more likely to be intelligent music listeners rather than 16 year old pacsun shopping skater boys/girls.

5) It isn't as much how popular they are as how they are set up in the music industry. A hardcore band called Circle Takes the Square opened for Fear Before the March of Flames, who are not punk rock by any stretch of the word, both through their music and their record label placement. CTTS is still on "Robotic Empire," a humongous, completely independent label. So, even though their fanbase has grown considerably because of that, they are still embodying the idea of punk through not being on an "official" clear channel label, writing songs purely to cater to others, etc etc. You can be popular as fuck, as long as you're not a part of the mainstream music industry.


Notes: I think you should do a little more research. It sounds like you're coming into this essay thinking you're going to write about Fat Wreck bands like NOFX and Lagwagon vs. "pop-punk" bands like Blink 182, Sum 41, and Fall Out Boy, while discussing stereotypical "punk" fashion (which shouldn't even be a factor anyway.) You'll find that even what you may be considering "punk rock" bands are on the fringe because of label involvement. If you need any help, just hit me up and I can point you in a few directions.

Thats great stuff cheers, the idea for my research was basically to contradict a load of theorists I've been reading who claim that to be a so called member of a musical subgenre you have to make sacrifices in terms of taste i.e. it's more about what you don't like than what you actually like. But with music constantly cannibalising other genres I really don't believe this stands for much in todays climate. What seems to rear its head a lot though is the idea of punk being 'underground' and the idea of 'selling out', this from what I've read and who I've spoken to seems to be the primary punk ethos. What I want to concentrate on is what exactly entails 'selling out', can something be popular and punk? I hate to mention them but for a band that arguably embodied punk (for many) the pistols sold a hell of a lot of records. It's basically a study on whether elitism is apparent in subcultures. Thanks again for that.

[SickOfStars]

Thats great stuff cheers, the idea for my research was basically to contradict a load of theorists I've been reading who claim that to be a so called member of a musical subgenre you have to make sacrifices in terms of taste i.e. it's more about what you don't like than what you actually like. But with music constantly cannibalising other genres I really don't believe this stands for much in todays climate. What seems to rear its head a lot though is the idea of punk being 'underground' and the idea of 'selling out', this from what I've read and who I've spoken to seems to be the primary punk ethos. What I want to concentrate on is what exactly entails 'selling out', can something be popular and punk? I hate to mention them but for a band that arguably embodied punk (for many) the pistols sold a hell of a lot of records. It's basically a study on whether elitism is apparent in subcultures. Thanks again for that.

no problem. and like I said, don't equate popularity with selling out. it's major label involvement. theoretically, an unsigned hardcore punk band could be popular as hell without being involved in the industy at all (highly unlikely)

glad I could help.