Why Should We Vote For Oboma ?

[highpi]

i want some1 to give me a good reason. cuz im open minded somewhat and if u got soething good to say say it loud and in red

[GuitarR0cker1]

Because I say so bitch.

[anamericangod]

Wow. Please tell me you aren't actually able to vote.

Please.

[Chancetobe]

At least spell Obama correctly.

I typed in green cuse i'm rebelious.

edit: No, he is not old enough to vote.

[GuitarR0cker1]

At least spell Obama correctly.

I typed in green cuse i'm rebelious.
How is such of a nutjob if you are liberal?

[anamericangod]

How is such of a nutjob if you are liberal?

What the fuck does this even mean?

[.invisible ink.]

Hopefully if Obama is elected he'll improve the education system in this country, for all our sakes.

[highpi]

Hopefully if Obama is elected he'll improve the education system in this country, for all our sakes.
yah but he just says he is gonna make it better doesnt say what he is gonna but everything he says it will be better but how?

[Chancetobe]

How is such of a nutjob if you are liberal?

What the fuck does this even mean?

Yeah, this. WTF?

[GuitarR0cker1]

Yeah, this. WTF?
lol I hate it when I type fast. I meant to say How is he such of a nutjob if you are a liberal?

[CTMarshall]

haha...this political conversation is already headed nowhere.

[.invisible ink.]

You're right, nobody seems to be going into how they will actually improve this country, just that they will create "change". I'd like some specifics as well but am cynical enough to know that we probably won't get any. Both Obama and McCain stink to put it bluntly, it's just a matter of who stinks less.

[anamericangod]

yah but he just says he is gonna make it better doesnt say what he is gonna but everything he says it will be better but how?

I'm pretty sure he has given a lot of information about his plans, and for you to say that he only states he will make things "better" without offering any real solutions is simply wrong.

[Chancetobe]

lol I hate it when I type fast. I meant to say How is he such of a nutjob if you are a liberal?

My dad is a Republican.

[GuitarR0cker1]

I'm pretty sure he has given a lot of information about his plans, and for you to say that he only states he will make things "better" without offering any real solutions is simply wrong.
:nod:

[.invisible ink.]

I'm pretty sure he has given a lot of information about his plans, and for you to say that he only states he will make things "better" without offering any real solutions is simply wrong.


Many months ago I watched the debates and did not hear any specifics within them that really clarified his plans. I'd love to find out more if you know of any instances that can be cited. If not, it's cool, but it proves my point.

[highpi]

im asking for details ppl all you guys are doin is dancing around the question and getting side tracked just like obama

[anamericangod]

Many months ago I watched the debates and did not hear any specifics within them that really clarified his plans. I'd love to find out more if you know of any instances that can be cited. If not, it's cool, but it proves my point.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/feb/20/obamas-economic-plan/

http://www.denverpost.com/opinion/ci_8307758

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/iraq/

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/newenergy

[.invisible ink.]

thanks!

[anamericangod]

im asking for details ppl all you guys are doin is dancing around the question and getting side tracked just like obama

Have you gone to his website and read anything at all?

If you somehow haven't gone to the obvious source for a fairly basic outline of things that maybe you can understand, what about other sources? Have you looked anything up at all or are you just magically expecting some sort of Obama Synopsis For Fixing America to fall into your lap?

[saysmydoctor]

im asking for details ppl all you guys are doin is dancing around the question and getting side tracked just like obama
Wait, what did he get side-tracked from? He seems pretty focused.

[Chancetobe]

What I want to know, is why are you guys trying to turn this into a legitimate debate? My brother is just trying to rile people.

[anamericangod]

We were supposed to know this was your brother?

[saysmydoctor]

Why didn't your parents suffocate him as an infant? It should have been obvious then he would contribute little to society.

[Chancetobe]

Because he's made about 30 other threads that mention I am his sister.

And, I beg of you not to take him seriously.

[highpi]

Because he's made about 30 other threads that mention I am his sister.

And, I beg of you not to take him seriously.
this 1 im not joking im fully commited i just think most of this liberalism is just a cult scam to get youth to vote for "change" when they dont even no what it is.

[anamericangod]

Yeah man, anarchy in the UK.

[Chancetobe]

this 1 im not joking im fully commited i just think most of this liberalism is just a cult scam to get youth to vote for "change" when they dont even no what it is.

Maybe your political views are true, but, the bright font, bad typing and the being rude to people is clearly not you being serious. Its you being bored and trying to annoy people.

[TSLROCKS]

He removed the American flag off his plane! Do not vote Obama!!!!!

[GiggsOho]

attn this thread...

http://failblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/failboatnowboarding.jpg

[highpi]

He removed the American flag off his plane! Do not vote Obama!!!!!
uhh okay

[JimmyIymmiJ]

Hopefully if Obama is elected he'll improve the education system in this country, for all our sakes.

As an educator, let me just say that I am hanging my head in shame right now.

[AnarchyintheUS]

Because CNN and Arcade Fire say so, that's why.

[matt_bergeron]

Read a fucking news paper, a book (his book for instance) fuck, go to cnn.com....... form your own opinion.

[matt_bergeron]

He removed the American flag off his plane! Do not vote Obama!!!!!

.....ok guy from that bad synth-pop band.

[TSLROCKS]

.....ok guy from that bad synth-pop band.

Do people realize I was being sarcastic? haha

[se1046]

Hopefully if Obama is elected he'll improve the education system in this country, for all our sakes.

Well I know there's the whole no child left behind thing but here's one I sure wish we could leave behind and save some tax dollars on.

[se1046]

Because CNN and Arcade Fire say so, that's why.

Don't forget Nas.

[shit stroll]

oboma lol

[se1046]

oboma lol

Amazing isn't it?

[bduke13]

Cause hes going to improve our welfare system!

[MidCal]

i want some1 to give me a good reason. cuz im open minded somewhat and if u got soething good to say say it loud and in red

Are you fucking retarded? That's the only thing I can think of besides you being a complete idiot.

[matt_bergeron]

Do people realize I was being sarcastic? haha

haha i did.......i was just sort of adding to it???

[TSLROCKS]

haha i did.......i was just sort of adding to it???

uhh okay

That's the only reason i ask

[GiggsOho]

Don't forget Nas.


And Toby Keith.

[loveisdead]

And Toby Keith.
And Dave Mathews and Kanye West.

[theguy77]

lol I hate it when I type fast. I meant to say How is he such of a nutjob if you are a liberal?

when you're young you follow your parents views. if you arent a rebel at 20 ya got no heart but if you havent turned establishment by 30 ya got no brains

[theguy77]

im asking for details ppl all you guys are doin is dancing around the question and getting side tracked just like obama

thats what republicans always say about democrats. did you get that quote from your dad? i know i got that quote from my dad during bush vs gore before i was old enough to have an opinon.

[highpi]

when you're young you follow your parents views. if you arent a rebel at 20 ya got no heart but if you havent turned establishment by 30 ya got no brains
yah well if it was up to me i would rebel but i listen to both sides of the argument on politicas an i agree with my parents becuase liberalism now in days is wannabe communism give the poor money make the rich poor and fuck who ever else

[theguy77]

yah well if it was up to me i would rebel but i listen to both sides of the argument on politicas an i agree with my parents becuase liberalism now in days is wannabe communism give the poor money make the rich poor and fuck who ever else

its not that simple kid, if you want to dumb it down and exaggerate it that much, republicans are just protecting the interests of the richest and most powerful and fuck whoever else but its not that simple either. and dont get me wrong im pro-captialism but you probably dont have as well developed of an opinion as you think. the things you say are right out of the book of what republicans are supposed to say about the democratic party with no rhetoric behind it.

[shit stroll]

what is a politicas?

[GiggsOho]

just don't even bother, some kid decided to be cool and flame the politics thread. Obviously his porn subscription ran out and he needs something else to do tonight.

[loveisdead]

just don't even bother, some kid decided to be cool and flame the politics thread. Obviously his porn subscription ran out and he needs something else to do tonight.
This forum is getting bombarded with idiots.

[GiggsOho]

This forum is getting bombarded with idiots.

I'm sure it's only going to grow as the election gets nearer. Should be fun.

[theguy77]

just don't even bother, some kid decided to be cool and flame the politics thread. Obviously his porn subscription ran out and he needs something else to do tonight.

still, its good if somebody addresses his attempts at saying something poignant so he gets off his high horse and learns to open his eyes and figure things out for himself

[GiggsOho]

still, its good if somebody addresses his attempts at saying something poignant so he gets off his high horse and learns to open his eyes and figure things out for himself


but he isnt saying anything poignant, he is just spouting off b.s. to make all of us get mad. It's not even worht the effort, he's not here to pick up knowledge.

[theguy77]

but he isnt saying anything poignant, he is just spouting off b.s. to make all of us get mad. It's not even worht the effort, he's not here to pick up knowledge.

but he THINKS hes saying something poignant haha. it doesnt really make me mad, i was the same way when i was his probable age. i dont think hes trying to make us mad so much as just convince everybody that conservativism is the only logical political standpoint, which is something i honestly think he believes.

[highpi]

but he THINKS hes saying something poignant haha. it doesnt really make me mad, i was the same way when i was his probable age. i dont think hes trying to make us mad so much as just convince everybody that conservativism is the only logical political standpoint, which is something i honestly think he believes.
The exact opposite no 1 in this thread is providing evidence or anything? i want you guys to convice me!!!!!!!!!!!!! im willing to listen to anything if you can make a good point .

[TeachBirds2Fly]

cause he is the Barrack Attack

[theguy77]

The exact opposite no 1 in this thread is providing evidence or anything? i want you guys to convice me!!!!!!!!!!!!! im willing to listen to anything if you can make a good point .

you came to us. why dont you explain to us your reasons for picking mccain?

[AP_Punk]

cuz he's not bush lol

[loveisdead]

The exact opposite no 1 in this thread is providing evidence or anything? i want you guys to convice me!!!!!!!!!!!!! im willing to listen to anything if you can make a good point .
McCain's plan for energy isn't as strong as Obama's. Offshore drilling is not going to solve anything, nor even be a quick relief as we will see none of it for at least 5 years. To me, healthcare is a human right, Obama's healthcare plan will give more people a chance to have it. The war in Iraq needs to come to an end. Our economy is shit and our government is spending too much. The first place we should cut spending on is that war, which is what Obama wants to do and McCain wants to do the complete opposite. This country needs a leader. Obama is a natural leader. McCain, not so much.

[highpi]

McCain's plan for energy isn't as strong as Obama's. Offshore drilling is not going to solve anything, nor even be a quick relief as we will see none of it for at least 5 years. To me, healthcare is a human right, Obama's healthcare plan will give more people a chance to have it. The war in Iraq needs to come to an end. Our economy is shit and our government is spending too much. The first place we should cut spending on is that war, which is what Obama wants to do and McCain wants to do the complete opposite. This country needs a leader. Obama is a natural leader. McCain, not so much.
finally the first real awnser thank you. i agree that with obama wants to make alterative enrgy but with out drilling their still wont be enought to help aid in the enrgy crisis and obama doesnt want nuclear enregy which i think is the safest and most effective. thank you again for giving me this info. it will help me make up my mind

[se1046]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.

[loveisdead]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.
So then why don't we put all our funding into developing an adequate alternative energy solution instead of spending money on off shore drilling? That would create even more competition. Sure, people may receive healthcare in certain situations but they are then left giving all their paychecks to the hospital that treated them to pay the hospital for the treatment. They don't have health insurance. A good read on the economy can be found here http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18787.htm . Inflation is at its highest rate in 17 years. If you don't think our economy is going down the shitter then you're delusional.
A leader of a country would compromise with people because a leader realizes that what is best for the country may not agree directly with their stance, but it is what would make the majority of the country satisfied. Obama has not backed down on any major issues which are the backbone of his campaign. I wouldn't even say he backed down to the Clintons, because if he did, he would have already named her VP.

[GiggsOho]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.


....last time I checked, Obama is up for the nomination, Not Hillary, and she is going to give a speech next week on why everyone should FOLLOW him.....:shrug:

[concernedparent]

Because Arcade Fire says so. I trust their opinion more than anyone else

[dai the flu]

anybody that thinks alternative energy is a viable solution is an idiot. lets think here for a second in the real world. the united states alone has somewhere around 180 million cars/trucks running on gasoline. i don't care how much money and time you invest in making new alternative energy, you cannot simply replace 180 MILLION cars with some new amazing hybrid. changing the oil-based energy system would take decades. notice the 's'. im not talking 10 years, im talking 40, 50+.
offshore drilling is the only realistic means to lower oil costs, anyone that says otherwise is delusional.

[anamericangod]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.

I don't have enough time right now to respond to all the nonsense in this post, but I hope that I remember to come back for it later.

[GiggsOho]

anybody that thinks alternative energy is a viable solution is an idiot. lets think here for a second in the real world. the united states alone has somewhere around 180 million cars/trucks running on gasoline. i don't care how much money and time you invest in making new alternative energy, you cannot simply replace 180 MILLION cars with some new amazing hybrid. changing the oil-based energy system would take decades. notice the 's'. im not talking 10 years, im talking 40, 50+.
offshore drilling is the only realistic means to lower oil costs, anyone that says otherwise is delusional.


You really need to do more research and learn about the world's oil supplies. Even with everything tapped, we have 30 years of oil left. The need for new energy isn't just because people are complaining about gas prices.

[heartspelunker]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.

obama is open to off shore drilling, but anyone who regards it as a miracle solution hasn't looked at all the facts.

someone show you where our economy is crap? seriously? look at the housing market, the increase in the prices of consumer goods which shows the expanding of a recession beyond the price of gasoline, what happened with freddie and fannie. executives are predicting that a large bank is going to fail within the year. the flippant comment about illegal immigrants shows, again, you aren't looking at current affairs. hospitals are deporting people back to their home countries without any authority from the government, which is a problem in itself.

while i do wish obama hadn't kowtowed to the clintons so immediately, what he's doing is diplomatic. his race with hilary was almost evenly split down the middle, to not acknowledge her supporters or her campaign would be ludicrous. he isn't backing down to anyone, he is showing his respect and at the same time helping his campaign, which you know, is kind of the goal.

to the original creator of this thread, people who rely on their opinions to be fed to them drive me crazy. if you want more facts about obama, read his proposals, read mccains proposals. read over speech transcripts, news articles, and interviews (particularly, i feel everyone should read, if they didnt watch, the saddleback civil forum.) just think of what would happen if people actually kept up on the news, haha.

[saysmydoctor]

obama is open to off shore drilling, but anyone who regards it as a miracle solution hasn't looked at all the facts.

someone show you where our economy is crap? seriously? look at the housing market, the increase in the prices of consumer goods which shows the expanding of a recession beyond the price of gasoline, what happened with freddie and fannie. executives are predicting that a large bank is going to fail within the year. the flippant comment about illegal immigrants shows, again, you aren't looking at current affairs. hospitals are deporting people back to their home countries without any authority from the government, which is a problem in itself.

while i do wish obama hadn't kowtowed to the clintons so immediately, what he's doing is diplomatic. his race with hilary was almost evenly split down the middle, to not acknowledge her supporters or her campaign would be ludicrous. he isn't backing down to anyone, he is showing his respect and at the same time helping his campaign, which you know, is kind of the goal.

to the original creator of this thread, people who rely on their opinions to be fed to them drive me crazy. if you want more facts about obama, read his proposals, read mccains proposals. read over speech transcripts, news articles, and interviews (particularly, i feel everyone should read, if they didnt watch, the saddleback civil forum.) just think of what would happen if people actually kept up on the news, haha.
:appl:

[theguy77]

Drilling offshore may not be the quickest fix but it's going to take just as much time to come up with a legit alternative energy source as it is to drill. The point of drilling is to increase competition which in turn lowers the cost. Healthcare is already provided to anyone that steps into a hospital. Ask any illegal immigrant. Someone please show me where our economy is crap. I'm still missing the facts here and would love for someone to show me how the economy is in the toilet. Our government is spending too much. Obama is not a natural leader. In fact a leader would not just back down and compromise with people (the Clintons) but would actually get them in line to follow him. I don't consider backing down to everyone leadership. A leader actually fights for what he/she believes in.

hillary clinton is not a leader. she is a politician. she plays the game well and uses her husband's status as an asset. obama is already proven to be the real leader to actually make compromises for the sake of his party's campaign if you just want to look at the political part of it, not even paying attention to the part where the issues and decisions come in. i honestly think most of what hillary does is geared behind making herself look good and not doing what she believes is right.

[dai the flu]

You really need to do more research and learn about the world's oil supplies. Even with everything tapped, we have 30 years of oil left. The need for new energy isn't just because people are complaining about gas prices.
i need to do research?
the latest estimates on proven oil reserves has us set for somewhere around 65 years. thats PROVEN reserves, that doesnt include probable and possible reserves. thats 65 years of oil available with current technology. eventually though obviously we will have to move away from oil, but lets not deflect the real issue here. when people talk about the current energy crisis, they aren't referring to a possible shortage 60 years down the road.

[open mind]

anybody that thinks alternative energy is a viable solution is an idiot. lets think here for a second in the real world. the united states alone has somewhere around 180 million cars/trucks running on gasoline. i don't care how much money and time you invest in making new alternative energy, you cannot simply replace 180 MILLION cars with some new amazing hybrid. changing the oil-based energy system would take decades. notice the 's'. im not talking 10 years, im talking 40, 50+.
offshore drilling is the only realistic means to lower oil costs, anyone that says otherwise is delusional.

there is no single solution, but there are plenty of things that can be done right now to alleviate our dependence on oil to a great degree.
setting up wind, hydro, and solar power where it makes sense to do so, using more efficient appliances, properly weatherizing houses, implementing more advanced coal technologies, and using hybrid cars or just not driving a suv/truck would all make a significant impact on oil consumption.

[TK]

Cold Fusion is a interesting alternative energy

[open mind]

i need to do research?
the latest estimates on proven oil reserves has us set for somewhere around 65 years. thats PROVEN reserves, that doesnt include probable and possible reserves. thats 65 years of oil available with current technology. eventually though obviously we will have to move away from oil, but lets not deflect the real issue here. when people talk about the current energy crisis, they aren't referring to a possible shortage 60 years down the road.

where do you get your statistics?

[TK]

there is no single solution, but there are plenty of things that can be done right now to alleviate our dependence on oil to a great degree.
setting up wind, hydro, and solar power where it makes sense to do so, using more efficient appliances, properly weatherizing houses, implementing more advanced coal technologies, and using hybrid cars or just not driving a suv/truck would all make a significant impact on oil consumption.

Do you think they should reinstate the 55mph speed limit?

[open mind]

Do you think they should reinstate the 55mph speed limit?

no.
i think the impact it would have on oil consumption would be to small to be worth the trouble....and i don't want to give the cops any more excuses to harrass otherwise law abiding citizens.

[TK]

no.
i think the impact it would have on oil consumption would be to small to be worth the trouble....and i don't want to give the cops any more excuses to harrass otherwise law abiding citizens.

Hmm, I read that back when it was first put in place that it saved 178,000 barrels a day. It would save more today. But I suppose your last point was a good one, because I don't think too many people would abide by it.

I'm not exactly where I was going with this, but I agree with your original point.

[loveisdead]

Hmm, I read that back when it was first put in place that it saved 178,000 barrels a day. It would save more today. But I suppose your last point was a good one, because I don't think too many people would abide by it.

I'm not exactly where I was going with this, but I agree with your original point.
On Long Island the speed limit is 55 but the cops won't pull you over unless you're going over 70. It's pretty much fruitless to have the speed limit set at 55 since literally nobody abides by it.

[GiggsOho]

i need to do research?
the latest estimates on proven oil reserves has us set for somewhere around 65 years. thats PROVEN reserves, that doesnt include probable and possible reserves. thats 65 years of oil available with current technology. eventually though obviously we will have to move away from oil, but lets not deflect the real issue here. when people talk about the current energy crisis, they aren't referring to a possible shortage 60 years down the road.

seriously, I'm tired of responding to you, go flame the NHL about the Penguins or something, you're a complete waste of time.

[dai the flu]

seriously, I'm tired of responding to you, go flame the NHL about the Penguins or something, you're a complete waste of time.
mature.
you see, you spouted nonsense with no real information behind it. i quoted stats from the oil and gas industry journal that showed you're full of shit.
its such a job being the voice of reason on a website full of morons.

[TK]

mature.
you see, you spouted nonsense with no real information behind it. i quoted stats from the oil and gas industry journal that showed you're full of shit.
its such a job being the voice of reason on a website full of morons.

So, by your own words, we have 65 years years of reserve oil left. Then when should we start looking and investing in alternative energy sources, if it will take "40, 50+" years to make it a reliable source?

[open mind]

mature.
you see, you spouted nonsense with no real information behind it. i quoted stats from the oil and gas industry journal that showed you're full of shit.
its such a job being the voice of reason on a website full of morons.

i'm still wondering how they calculated those stats.

[asmolitor]

i'm still wondering how they calculated those stats.

guessing, mostly. it's all based on estimations of supply and projections of demand, neither of which can possibly be all that accurate.

[GiggsOho]

mature.
you see, you spouted nonsense with no real information behind it. i quoted stats from the oil and gas industry journal that showed you're full of shit.
its such a job being the voice of reason on a website full of morons.

........

So, by your own words, we have 65 years years of reserve oil left. Then when should we start looking and investing in alternative energy sources, if it will take "40, 50+" years to make it a reliable source?

i'm still wondering how they calculated those stats.

guessing, mostly. it's all based on estimations of supply and projections of demand, neither of which can possibly be all that accurate.


hahahahahaha. please, continue to make an ass out of yourself, it's quite comical and entertaining.

[timbedinosaur]

All I know is even if I could vote, I wouldn't vote for Obama for his lack of experience. McCain has experience, yes, but he's not really that great. So, it's basically picking what piece of shit smells least.

[Machu505]

The experience card is no longer useful for J-Mac because of Joe Biden.

[dai the flu]

hahahahahaha. please, continue to make an ass out of yourself, it's quite comical and entertaining.
i'll quote your post while answering the others you quoted.
1. we have an estimated 65 years of proven resources left. that means oil that we're 80-90% confident can be recovered by current technology. anything less than that is unproven, but still probable, making 65 years the low end of the estimate.
A. oil production and recovery technology is constantly improving.
B. alternative energy IS being invested in, researched, and improved upon, and i never said we shouldn't consider these. but people are looking for relief from the *current* energy crisis (high oil prices), and alternative energy will not provide any short-term relief, which people are looking for and we were discussing. the issue was not future oil depletion, so i'm not sure why you changed the subject to that.

2. how do they calculate 65 years?
you take current estimates of proved oil reserves. http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/reserves.html
divide by oil production rates
you get your estimated reserve life

3. how do they arrive at these proven oil reserve estimates?
here's a long read, maybe you should have someone read it for you.


There are a number of different methods of calculating oil reserves. These methods can be grouped into three general categories: volumetric, material balance, and production performance. Each method has it's advantages and drawbacks.
Volumetric Method
Volumetric methods attempt to determine the amount of oil-in-place by using the size of the reservoir as well as the physical properties of it's rocks and fluids. Then a recovery factor is assumed, using assumptions from fields with similar characteristics. OIP is multiplied by the recovery factor to arrive at a reserve number. The method is most useful early in the life of the reservoir, before significant production has occured.
The first step is to calculate the stock tank oil, or oil in place. This calculation is made using the volume of rock containing oil (Bulk Rock Volume, in the USA this is usually in acre-feet), percentage porosity of the rock in the reservoir, percentage water content of that porosity, and the amount of shrinkage that the oil undergoes when brought to the earth's surface.
The recovery factor is the percentage of the oil in place that can be produced from the reservoir. The recovery factor depends on the viscosity of the oil (resistance of the oil to flow), the permeability of the reservoir (ability of oil to flow through the pores in the reservoir rock to the well), and the resevoir drive(what creates and maintain pressure in the field besides pumps).
During the primary recovery stage, reservoir drive comes from a number of natural mechanisms. These include: natural water displacing oil upward into the well, expansion of the natural gas at the top of the reservoir, expansion of gas initially dissolved in the crude oil, and gravity drainage resulting from the movement of oil within the reservoir from the upper to the lower parts where the wells are located. Recovery factor during the primary recovery stage is typically 5-15%.
After natural reservoir drive diminishes, secondary recovery methods are applied. They rely on the supply of external energy into the reservoir in the form of injecting fluids to increase reservoir pressure, hence replacing or increasing the natural reservoir drive with an artificial drive. Typically this is done by injecting water in the reservoir using a number of injection wells. Typical recovery factor from water-flood operations is about 30%, depending on the properties of oil and the characteristics of the reservoir rock. On average, the recovery factor after primary and secondary oil recovery operations is between 30 and 50%.
After this stage, tertiary or enhanced oil recovery techniques may be applied. These refer to to a number of operations that are typically done towards the end of life of an oilfield, to maintain oil production and produce an additional 5-15% original OIP. Examples include injection of CO2, nitrogen, or steam to improve oil flow.
Materials Balance Method
The materials balance method for an oil field uses an equation that relates the volume of oil, water and gas that has been produced from a reservoir, and the change in reservoir pressure, to calculate the remaining oil. It assumes that as fluids from the reservoir are produced, there will be a change in the reservoir pressure that depends on the remaining volume of oil and gas. The method requires extensive pressure-volume-temperature analysis and an accurate pressure history of the field. It requires some production to occur (typically 5% to 10% of ultimate recovery), unless reliable pressure history can be used from a field with similar rock and fluid characteristics.
Production Decline Curve Method
The decline curve method uses production data to fit a decline curve and estimate future oil production. The three most common forms of decline curves are exponential, hyperbolic, and harmonic. It is assumed that the production will decline on a reasonably smooth curve, and so allowances must be made for wells shut in and production restrictions. The curve can be expressed mathematically or plotted on a graph to estimate future production. It has the advantage of (implicitly) including all reservoir characteristics. It requires a sufficient history to establish a statistically significant trend, ideally when production is not curtailed by regulatory or other artificial conditions.


I wouldn't really classify that as 'guessing' but if you're going to challenge my '65 years' comment which is based off of actual industry information, i'm a little surprised you let giggs '30 years' estimate slide so easily. he has yet to back it up. with anything.



so keep saying im comical and entertaining, when you're the clown who hasn't provided anything of substance or one shred of evidence to back up your side of the argument.

[TK]

i'll quote your post while answering the others you quoted.
1. we have an estimated 65 years of proven resources left. that means oil that we're 80-90% confident can be recovered by current technology. anything less than that is unproven, but still probable, making 65 years the low end of the estimate.
A. oil production and recovery technology is constantly improving.
B. alternative energy IS being invested in, researched, and improved upon, and i never said we shouldn't consider these. but people are looking for relief from the *current* energy crisis (high oil prices), and alternative energy will not provide any short-term relief, which people are looking for and we were discussing. the issue was not future oil depletion, so i'm not sure why you changed the subject to that.


You pointed out the difficulty of establishing a new alternative energy. I simply was trying to question what's more important, trying to discover more oil that's inevitably going to get more scarce and more unreasonable for mass use or trying to establish a new energy source that will get us by. Cold Fusion being one of them.

[dai the flu]

You pointed out the difficulty of establishing a new alternative energy. I simply was trying to question what's more important, trying to discover more oil that's inevitably going to get more scarce and more unreasonable for mass use or trying to establish a new energy source that will get us by. Cold Fusion being one of them.
believe me, im all for it and i understand that obviously eventually we will have to switch. my point is that people are looking for help now, people arent voting for mccain or obama with the idea that 30 years down the road the oil situation might get better. they're looking for relief relatively soon, and those saying alternative energy will provide that relief simply haven't thought things out completely. but yes obviously alternative energy needs perfected for the future.

[saysmydoctor]

Estimations = accurate.

Right?

[asmolitor]

2. how do they calculate 65 years?
you take current estimates of proved oil reserves. http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/reserves.html
divide by oil production rates
you get your estimated reserve life


I wouldn't really classify that as 'guessing' but if you're going to challenge my '65 years' comment which is based off of actual industry information, i'm a little surprised you let giggs '30 years' estimate slide so easily. he has yet to back it up. with anything.

so why is there a 7% difference between the industry-based quantities at year-end 2005? and why does the quantity jump 12% in by january 1, 2007? (i'm looking at the world total supplies at the bottom) if it's due to finding oil in new locales, then what's to say oil could last 100 years if we found supplies elsewhere? if you had read my initial thought on it, you'd see i didn't complete write off the measures behind it- although, if the numbers are changing from year to year based on estimation, how can you come up with a concrete answer as to how long oil supplies will last?

to make that concise, if the current estimates are everchanging, how is it anything more than guessing, albeit educated or not?

also, and this goes for anyone, can anyone find the percentage of U.S. domestic (or better yet, world) consumption that can be solely attributed to automobile usage? i can't find that anywhere. if it's not a restrictively high proportion (90%+) wouldn't it make sense to develop alternative energies to defer other oil uses and save what we have for automobile usage? all things considered, you can't switch out hundreds of millions of engines overnight, and it'd be asking a lot of the american public to shell out for hybrids. i'm just wondering how much oil/gas consumption can be solely attributed to driving. i guess if there was a way to separate consumer driving from industry driving (truckers, etc) that'd help too.

[dai the flu]

so why is there a 7% difference between the industry-based quantities at year-end 2005? and why does the quantity jump 12% in by january 1, 2007? (i'm looking at the world total supplies at the bottom) if it's due to finding oil in new locales, then what's to say oil could last 100 years if we found supplies elsewhere? if you had read my initial thought on it, you'd see i didn't complete write off the measures behind it- although, if the numbers are changing from year to year based on estimation, how can you come up with a concrete answer as to how long oil supplies will last?

to make that concise, if the current estimates are everchanging, how is it anything more than guessing, albeit educated or not?
sorry my post might've seemed hostile towards you. i wasn't trying to be. i was annoyed at giggsoho calling me a joke without supplying reason.
i really am not sure why the difference in the two year's totals. maybe more oil fields discovered, maybe some nations being more forthcoming with their totals, some countries view these stats as state secrets and refuse to submit data....i really don't know why its changed.
but i do know we have more than '30 years worth with everything tapped'.
there may be a certain margin of error, but its not a blindly optimistic guess that we have at least 65 years worth left.

[dai the flu]

Estimations = accurate.

Right?
i'm guessing this is needless sarcasm. thats what i'd expect from you.
either way, these estimates are accurate enough to prove my point. if you look at the explanations behind the estimates, its hard to argue against it.

example:
the sun set here sometime around 8:45 tonight. based on this, i estimate that its going to set sometime around 8:45 tomorrow night.
exact science? no.
educated guess? yes.
accurate? accurate enough.

[anamericangod]

All I know is even if I could vote, I wouldn't vote for Obama for his lack of experience. McCain has experience, yes, but he's not really that great. So, it's basically picking what piece of shit smells least.

I'm pretty glad that you can't vote.

[anamericangod]

i'm guessing this is needless sarcasm. thats what i'd expect from you.
either way, these estimates are accurate enough to prove my point. if you look at the explanations behind the estimates, its hard to argue against it.

example:
the sun set here sometime around 8:45 tonight. based on this, i estimate that its going to set sometime around 8:45 tomorrow night.
exact science? no.
educated guess? yes.
accurate? accurate enough.

Actually, just because something has happened in the past has absolutely no relation to whether or not it will happen in the future. Sounds ridiculous, but it's true.

[asmolitor]

sorry my post might've seemed hostile towards you. i wasn't trying to be. i was annoyed at giggsoho calling me a joke without supplying reason.
i really am not sure why the difference in the two year's totals. maybe more oil fields discovered, maybe some nations being more forthcoming with their totals, some countries view these stats as state secrets and refuse to submit data....i really don't know why its changed.
but i do know we have more than '30 years worth with everything tapped'.
there may be a certain margin of error, but its not a blindly optimistic guess that we have at least 65 years worth left.

fair enough. i just find it hard to accept using things like "65 years" as a way to defer alternative energy investing, when the basis for it comes from everchanging estimations. that's all. i don't disagree with more drilling, but it shouldn't be the emphasis (it should be just short of an afterthought, i think). in my mind, a short-sighted solution won't fix the longer energy problem the world has created. regardless of the timing, the world will run out of oil - that's roughly indisputable. i don't see any legitimate reason why we should delay countering the effects of that. then again, i've always maintained that we'll have alternative energies when it's massively profitable for exxon/etc to change course.

[asmolitor]

there is no single solution, but there are plenty of things that can be done right now to alleviate our dependence on oil to a great degree.
setting up wind, hydro, and solar power where it makes sense to do so, using more efficient appliances, properly weatherizing houses, implementing more advanced coal technologies, and using hybrid cars or just not driving a suv/truck would all make a significant impact on oil consumption.

but how significant of an impact, taking driving out of the equation? i can't find a concrete answer for this anywhere.

also, and this goes for anyone, can anyone find the percentage of U.S. domestic (or better yet, world) consumption that can be solely attributed to automobile usage?

if anything using oil/gas (that aren't vehicles) could be converted to alternative energies, how much would that alleviate the solution? i think if someone stumbles onto that answer, it could shift the whole debate. but damn me if i can find it.

[open mind]

but how significant of an impact, taking driving out of the equation? i can't find a concrete answer for this anywhere.



if anything using oil/gas (that aren't vehicles) could be converted to alternative energies, how much would that alleviate the solution? i think if someone stumbles onto that answer, it could shift the whole debate. but damn me if i can find it.

ENERGY STAR qualified appliances incorporate advanced technologies that use 10–50% less energy and water than standard models.......water heaters, furnaces, and clothes dryers aren't a part of the energy star program, but the good ones will save you at least a hundred bucks a year on gas.
alternative energy even at this point could take care of at least 10% of our energy needs.
i know a properly weatherized house can save you hundreds of dollars in gas a year.....at least it can in alaska.
coal is a pretty clean and efficient energy source with the advances in technology we've seen.....i don't have any numbers handy, but it shouldn't be hard to find info on it.

[timbedinosaur]

I'm pretty glad that you can't vote.
you always have a problem with what I say. Seriously dude, you're no better than me, stop acting like you are. What is wrong with what I said?

[anamericangod]

you always have a problem with what I say. Seriously dude, you're no better than me, stop acting like you are. What is wrong with what I said?

I always have a problem with what you say? Not really, I don't know who you are.

I never said I was better than you, just glad that you can't vote yet because I disagree with your opinion.

[timbedinosaur]

I always have a problem with what you say? Not really, I don't know who you are.

I never said I was better than you, just glad that you can't vote yet because I disagree with your opinion.
You think Obama has experience?

[anamericangod]

You think Obama has experience?

I think that argument is overused and somewhat irrelevant. He hasn't been in office as long as McCain, but what does it matter? We live in a world that is constantly changing. Information is coming in all the time from countless sources. The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

John McCain was in a POW camp. That means nothing to me. He may have been in office longer, but his voting record, his attitude, and his statements are things that make me want to not have him become President.

Obama seems like he will be a great decision maker. McCain does not.

The "experience" argument doesn't hold a lot of weight, in my opinion.

[timbedinosaur]

I think that argument is overused and somewhat irrelevant. He hasn't been in office as long as McCain, but what does it matter? We live in a world that is constantly changing. Information is coming in all the time from countless sources. The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

John McCain was in a POW camp. That means nothing to me. He may have been in office longer, but his voting record, his attitude, and his statements are things that make me want to not have him become President.

Obama seems like he will be a great decision maker. McCain does not.

The "experience" argument doesn't hold a lot of weight, in my opinion.
I agree on some accounts but I also think that Obama says he'll do so many things, but barely ever says how he'll do it
McCain may not have the greatest policies but at least he elaborates more often than Obama. I'd rather have a man that knows what to do and how to do it, than have a man that will say things, but have no clue how to do them.

[anamericangod]

I agree on some accounts but I also think that Obama says he'll do so many things, but barely ever says how he'll do it
McCain may not have the greatest policies but at least he elaborates more often than Obama. I'd rather have a man that knows what to do and how to do it, than have a man that will say things, but have no clue how to do them.

Again I disagree. Obama has a plan for everything he has stated. Just as much as McCain.

[Jason Tate]

You think Obama has experience?
http://www.sptimes.com/2007/01/17/Worldandnation/Presidential_experien.shtml

[open mind]

i'm pretty sure abraham lincoln didn't have much experience before taking office.

[Stinger1921]

The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

From americangod......


dude really i didnt know that the president has advisors holy shit... you are a damn genious...

[paper halo]

The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

From americangod......


dude really i didnt know that the president has advisors holy shit... you are a damn genious...

Way to miss the point, dumbass.

[Machu505]

The whole experience argument is a tired one. With Joe Biden, the chairman of the foreign relations committee, as Obama's running mate, he has all the experience he needs.

i'm pretty sure abraham lincoln didn't have much experience before taking office.

He was a one term congressman.

[timbedinosaur]

Again I disagree. Obama has a plan for everything he has stated. Just as much as McCain.Honestly, I've listened to him, and yes I like some of his plans, but I still have never heard much about how he's going to do it. Now, if you could provide me proof, I will greatly reconsider this

[MyNameIsRoss]

yah but he just says he is gonna make it better doesnt say what he is gonna but everything he says it will be better but how?


Pardon?

[MyNameIsRoss]

The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

From americangod......


dude really i didnt know that the president has advisors holy shit... you are a damn genious...


If that is seriously what you got out of that post, you are a fucking moron.

[Machu505]

The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

From americangod......


dude really i didnt know that the president has advisors holy shit... you are a damn genious...

Congratulations! I'm adding you to my list of idiots in the politics forum:

se1406
highpi
captainhampton
ActionActionFan
Pathfinder
AnarchyintheUS
Stinger1921

[GiggsOho]

i'll quote your post while answering the others you quoted.
1. we have an estimated 65 years of proven resources left. that means oil that we're 80-90% confident can be recovered by current technology. anything less than that is unproven, but still probable, making 65 years the low end of the estimate.
A. oil production and recovery technology is constantly improving.
B. alternative energy IS being invested in, researched, and improved upon, and i never said we shouldn't consider these. but people are looking for relief from the *current* energy crisis (high oil prices), and alternative energy will not provide any short-term relief, which people are looking for and we were discussing. the issue was not future oil depletion, so i'm not sure why you changed the subject to that.

2. how do they calculate 65 years?
you take current estimates of proved oil reserves. http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/international/reserves.html
divide by oil production rates
you get your estimated reserve life

3. how do they arrive at these proven oil reserve estimates?
here's a long read, maybe you should have someone read it for you.


There are a number of different methods of calculating oil reserves. These methods can be grouped into three general categories: volumetric, material balance, and production performance. Each method has it's advantages and drawbacks.
Volumetric Method
Volumetric methods attempt to determine the amount of oil-in-place by using the size of the reservoir as well as the physical properties of it's rocks and fluids. Then a recovery factor is assumed, using assumptions from fields with similar characteristics. OIP is multiplied by the recovery factor to arrive at a reserve number. The method is most useful early in the life of the reservoir, before significant production has occured.
The first step is to calculate the stock tank oil, or oil in place. This calculation is made using the volume of rock containing oil (Bulk Rock Volume, in the USA this is usually in acre-feet), percentage porosity of the rock in the reservoir, percentage water content of that porosity, and the amount of shrinkage that the oil undergoes when brought to the earth's surface.
The recovery factor is the percentage of the oil in place that can be produced from the reservoir. The recovery factor depends on the viscosity of the oil (resistance of the oil to flow), the permeability of the reservoir (ability of oil to flow through the pores in the reservoir rock to the well), and the resevoir drive(what creates and maintain pressure in the field besides pumps).
During the primary recovery stage, reservoir drive comes from a number of natural mechanisms. These include: natural water displacing oil upward into the well, expansion of the natural gas at the top of the reservoir, expansion of gas initially dissolved in the crude oil, and gravity drainage resulting from the movement of oil within the reservoir from the upper to the lower parts where the wells are located. Recovery factor during the primary recovery stage is typically 5-15%.
After natural reservoir drive diminishes, secondary recovery methods are applied. They rely on the supply of external energy into the reservoir in the form of injecting fluids to increase reservoir pressure, hence replacing or increasing the natural reservoir drive with an artificial drive. Typically this is done by injecting water in the reservoir using a number of injection wells. Typical recovery factor from water-flood operations is about 30%, depending on the properties of oil and the characteristics of the reservoir rock. On average, the recovery factor after primary and secondary oil recovery operations is between 30 and 50%.
After this stage, tertiary or enhanced oil recovery techniques may be applied. These refer to to a number of operations that are typically done towards the end of life of an oilfield, to maintain oil production and produce an additional 5-15% original OIP. Examples include injection of CO2, nitrogen, or steam to improve oil flow.
Materials Balance Method
The materials balance method for an oil field uses an equation that relates the volume of oil, water and gas that has been produced from a reservoir, and the change in reservoir pressure, to calculate the remaining oil. It assumes that as fluids from the reservoir are produced, there will be a change in the reservoir pressure that depends on the remaining volume of oil and gas. The method requires extensive pressure-volume-temperature analysis and an accurate pressure history of the field. It requires some production to occur (typically 5% to 10% of ultimate recovery), unless reliable pressure history can be used from a field with similar rock and fluid characteristics.
Production Decline Curve Method
The decline curve method uses production data to fit a decline curve and estimate future oil production. The three most common forms of decline curves are exponential, hyperbolic, and harmonic. It is assumed that the production will decline on a reasonably smooth curve, and so allowances must be made for wells shut in and production restrictions. The curve can be expressed mathematically or plotted on a graph to estimate future production. It has the advantage of (implicitly) including all reservoir characteristics. It requires a sufficient history to establish a statistically significant trend, ideally when production is not curtailed by regulatory or other artificial conditions.


I wouldn't really classify that as 'guessing' but if you're going to challenge my '65 years' comment which is based off of actual industry information, i'm a little surprised you let giggs '30 years' estimate slide so easily. he has yet to back it up. with anything.



so keep saying im comical and entertaining, when you're the clown who hasn't provided anything of substance or one shred of evidence to back up your side of the argument.

Hey, ya should have done this earlier and maybe I wouldn't have said all those things about you.


Furthermore, the reason I said 30 is because I also have read estimates that say its 30 years left, But, the truth is, our estimates are wrong, period. No one knows how much oil there is left.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-10784_3-9803819-7.html

http://bubbleinthedesert.blogspot.com/2008/06/how-much-oil-do-we-have-left.html

http://economics.about.com/b/2007/08/16/how-much-oil-is-left-we-will-never-run-out-of-oil.htm

http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/



Furthermore, saying that "alternative energy doesn't solve anything today" is an extremely narrow way of looking at the situation:

All these companies investing in trying to find alt energy is only going to create jobs and stimulate economic growth. This right here has all the links to back that up: http://www.altenergystocks.com/



So continue to keep your head in the sand, and continue to think off-shore drilling will help things. The rest of society will pass you by.

[saysmydoctor]

Congratulations! I'm adding you to my list of idiots in the politics forum:

se1406
captainhampton
ActionActionFan
Pathfinder
AnarchyintheUS
Stinger1921
Where the fuck highpi!

[Machu505]

Where the fuck highpi!

Shit I forgot about that troll. Editted.

[anamericangod]

The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

From americangod......


dude really i didnt know that the president has advisors holy shit... you are a damn genious...

I'm glad I could inform you. Thank you for the compliment.

[OldJersey]

I think that argument is overused and somewhat irrelevant. He hasn't been in office as long as McCain, but what does it matter? We live in a world that is constantly changing. Information is coming in all the time from countless sources. The President doesn't make decisions based on information that he alone has. There will be advisors and cabinet members who have more than enough knowledge and "experience" to give Obama the information he needs.

John McCain was in a POW camp. That means nothing to me. He may have been in office longer, but his voting record, his attitude, and his statements are things that make me want to not have him become President.

Obama seems like he will be a great decision maker. McCain does not.

The "experience" argument doesn't hold a lot of weight, in my opinion.

Wonderfully said.

[Stinger1921]

Sarcasim apprecitated.. Ha.. But on a side note... earlier when we were talking about the health care/ people with their hands out / socialism thing .. i just want to let you know why i view it the way i do.....

A little backround information.... My dad owns a Small grocery store in a very poor part of town. Every day i see people walking in that i know for a fact are very capable of working, but they dont. I could point out at least 200 people that i know from the store who get their government checks once or twice a month and are unemployed and very lazy. I mean it is really rediculous, honestly you probably think im full of shit, but dude these guys are pathetic. They talk about how they never have any money, and if you say to them, " why dont you just go and get a job." They think you are kidding. It is the way they were raised so they think its okay to milk the government and do absolutley nothing for their country during their life times. These same people are the ones who make us pay for their emergency room bills. And you said that no matter what their is a bill. I beg to dissagree with you on that, these people have no money, the bill goes to the government or state or whatever and guess who pays for it, you and me, the taxpayers.

Now i know there are alot of cases out there where bad things have happened to people and families and they really need it. But it is because of the lazy bastards that milk the system that it can not work. Once again this is not a utopia. What is the harm in actually rewarding someone for working hard their entire life. Is it right for them to get taxed to death because a ton of people just dont want to work. If you want something you have to work hard to achieve it. It shouldnt just be givin to you.

[Stinger1921]

oh and that was for americangod by the way

[Machu505]

Sarcasim apprecitated.. Ha.. But on a side note... earlier when we were talking about the health care/ people with their hands out / socialism thing .. i just want to let you know why i view it the way i do.....

A little backround information.... My dad owns a Small grocery store in a very poor part of town. Every day i see people walking in that i know for a fact are very capable of working, but they dont. I could point out at least 200 people that i know from the store who get their government checks once or twice a month and are unemployed and very lazy. I mean it is really rediculous, honestly you probably think im full of shit, but dude these guys are pathetic. They talk about how they never have any money, and if you say to them, " why dont you just go and get a job." They think you are kidding. It is the way they were raised so they think its okay to milk the government and do absolutley nothing for their country during their life times. These same people are the ones who make us pay for their emergency room bills. And you said that no matter what their is a bill. I beg to dissagree with you on that, these people have no money, the bill goes to the government or state or whatever and guess who pays for it, you and me, the taxpayers.

Now i know there are alot of cases out there where bad things have happened to people and families and they really need it. But it is because of the lazy bastards that milk the system that it can not work. Once again this is not a utopia. What is the harm in actually rewarding someone for working hard their entire life. Is it right for them to get taxed to death because a ton of people just dont want to work. If you want something you have to work hard to achieve it. It shouldnt just be givin to you.

Allow me to address the whole "universal healthcare" thing:

It's a human right. No matter how lazy or jobless someone is, it's not their fault if they're sick, the need to be treated and their bill have to paid.

[MyNameIsRoss]

oh and that was for americangod by the way

Lol.his username is clearly anamericangod.

[Stinger1921]

Lol.his username is clearly anamericangod.

well thank you bud.. your cleary a douchebag hahah

[Jason Tate]

well thank you bud.. your cleary a douchebag hahah
You're.

[MyNameIsRoss]

well thank you bud.. your cleary a douchebag hahah

"Your" is meant to show possession. You're is what you are looking for. It's a contraction, don't-you-know?!

[Machu505]

Haha the title of this thread misspells Obama's name.

[Stinger1921]

"Your" is meant to show possession. You're is what you are looking for. It's a contraction, don't-you-know?!


Dude good one, thanks for correcting me, im glad you could figure out what i was trying to say though, good job man.

[Jason Tate]

Dude good one, thanks for correcting me, im glad you could figure out what i was trying to say though, good job man.
I'm.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Haha the title of this thread misspells Obama's name.

haha, typical redneck, rightwing bullshit. They believe it's a deep insult to the person they're referring to if they mispell their name.

[Machu505]

haha, typical redneck, rightwing bullshit. They believe it's a deep insult to the person they're referring to if they mispell their name.

Haha I live in West Virginia; you don't have to tell me what rednecks are like.

[MyNameIsRoss]

I'm.


:-d

[Stinger1921]

I'm.
Ha Ha well played Tate well played.... You'RE cutting me real deep with all of these corrections. Haha

[MyNameIsRoss]

Dude good one, thanks for correcting me, im glad you could figure out what i was trying to say though, good job man.

I'm having fun.

[OldJersey]

That dang oboma aint gonna do no dang nutin for no good anythin....MCCAIN 08'

/redneck

[MyNameIsRoss]

Ha Ha well played Tate well played.... You'RE cutting me real deep with all of these corrections. Haha

:ok:

[Machu505]

That dang oboma aint gonna do no dang nutin for no good anythin....MCCAIN 08'

/redneck

qmKgITJejfg

[MyNameIsRoss]

qmKgITJejfg


Beats Nas' ass anyday! yeehaw!

[OldJersey]

qmKgITJejfg


dear lord....

that was atrocious

[Stinger1921]

Allow me to address the whole "universal healthcare" thing:

It's a human right. No matter how lazy or jobless someone is, it's not their fault if they're sick, the need to be treated and their bill have to paid.


A human right. Where are you coming up with this stuff. We have the rights to these and these only these, Life, Liberty, Property and pursuit of happiness. According to our founding fathers at least. We are not born with the right to go to disneyland, or starbucks. We are not born with the right to kidney dialysis, or chemotherapy. All legit rights have the same thing in common, they are rights to action, not to rewards from other people. The American rights impose no obligations on other people, just the negative obligation to leave you alone. This way it guarantees you the chance to "WORK" for what you want. Not to be given it without effort by somebody else.

Politicians say that you are entitled to something simply because it exists and you want or need it. You are entitled to be given it by the government. Where does the government get it from? What does the government have to do to private citizens? To their individual rights? To their REAL rights, in order to carry out the promise of showering free services on the people?

[GiggsOho]

qmKgITJejfg


LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Really?!?! I mean, really. I'm laughing so hard I might throw up. I can't breathe.

[Machu505]

A human right. Where are you coming up with this stuff. We have the rights to these and these only these, Life, Liberty, Property and pursuit of happiness. According to our founding fathers at least. We are not born with the right to go to disneyland, or starbucks. We are not born with the right to kidney dialysis, or chemotherapy. All legit rights have the same thing in common, they are rights to action, not to rewards from other people. The American rights impose no obligations on other people, just the negative obligation to leave you alone. This way it guarantees you the chance to "WORK" for what you want. Not to be given it without effort by somebody else.

Politicians say that you are entitled to something simply because it exists and you want or need it. You are entitled to be given it by the government. Where does the government get it from? What does the government have to do to private citizens? To their individual rights? To their REAL rights, in order to carry out the promise of showering free services on the people?

First of all, I never said anything about Disneyland or Starbucks. Second of all, I think healthcare would fall under "life" seeing as if your in a waiting room having a heart attack for 6 hours you might not live.

[Machu505]

LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Really?!?! I mean, really. I'm laughing so hard I might throw up. I can't breathe.

I'm amazed the building where it was shot didn't explode from the high level of douchebags in there.

[Stinger1921]

I'm having fun.

Dude me too. Especially after i do this. :bow: :bow: hahhaha

[OldJersey]

A human right. Where are you coming up with this stuff. We have the rights to these and these only these, Life, Liberty, Property and pursuit of happiness. According to our founding fathers at least. We are not born with the right to go to disneyland, or starbucks. We are not born with the right to kidney dialysis, or chemotherapy. All legit rights have the same thing in common, they are rights to action, not to rewards from other people. The American rights impose no obligations on other people, just the negative obligation to leave you alone. This way it guarantees you the chance to "WORK" for what you want. Not to be given it without effort by somebody else.

Politicians say that you are entitled to something simply because it exists and you want or need it. You are entitled to be given it by the government. Where does the government get it from? What does the government have to do to private citizens? To their individual rights? To their REAL rights, in order to carry out the promise of showering free services on the people?

You say all this stuff about people getting money from the government and just not doing anything with their lives or getting jobs, but your basing it all off assumptions, maybe some people are gettin unemployment right now because they are going through struggles in life you have no fucking idea about. The government issues unemployment checks from others taxes because we are SUPPOSED to be a united country, a country that is here for each other when we are in need of others help. Sure some people might take advantage of it, and im sure those that do will not go very far with the 200 dollars they get every 2 weeks. But the way you put it you make it sound like anyone that does not have a job and collects unemployment is just a lackadaiscal asshole taking everyone elses tax money, which is just not the case. Try thinkin outside of your own mind buddy.

[MyNameIsRoss]

qmKgITJejfg


"Play that AMERICAN GI- TAR!" hahahahahaha, woot w00t

[anamericangod]

A human right. Where are you coming up with this stuff. We have the rights to these and these only these, Life, Liberty, Property and pursuit of happiness. According to our founding fathers at least. We are not born with the right to go to disneyland, or starbucks. We are not born with the right to kidney dialysis, or chemotherapy. All legit rights have the same thing in common, they are rights to action, not to rewards from other people. The American rights impose no obligations on other people, just the negative obligation to leave you alone. This way it guarantees you the chance to "WORK" for what you want. Not to be given it without effort by somebody else.

Politicians say that you are entitled to something simply because it exists and you want or need it. You are entitled to be given it by the government. Where does the government get it from? What does the government have to do to private citizens? To their individual rights? To their REAL rights, in order to carry out the promise of showering free services on the people?

We have a right to property?

I guess somebody should go tell that to all the homeless people.

[GiggsOho]

We have a right to property?

I guess somebody should go tell that to all the homeless people.

Do you know where mine is, dude? My rent is kinda high, I wanna start building my sweet house.

[Machu505]

Do you know where mine is, dude? My rent is kinda high, I wanna start building my sweet house.

Property includes pets right? Where the fuck is my Giraffe government?

[Stinger1921]

First of all, I never said anything about Disneyland or Starbucks. Second of all, I think healthcare would fall under "life" seeing as if your in a waiting room having a heart attack for 6 hours you might not live.


So we are giving charity now? Don't abolish charity by calling it something else. If a person is getting health care for NOTHING, simply because he is breathing, he is still getting charity, whether or not some call it a "right." To call it a Right when the recipient did not EARN it is merely to compound the evil. It is charity still, though now extorted by criminal tactics of force, while hiding under a dishonest name.

As with any good or service that is provided by men, if you try to make its possession by all a right, you basically enslave the providers of the service, wreck the service, and end up depriving the very consumers you are supposed to be helping. To call "medical care" a right will enslave the doctors and destroy the quality of medical care in this country, as socialized medicine has done around the world, wherever it has been tried.

[Stinger1921]

We have a right to property?

I guess somebody should go tell that to all the homeless people.


A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.

[OldJersey]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.


Soo when did you earn your right to post in here?

[Jason Tate]

It's pretty funny watching someone with no grasp on reality talking right now ... "they have only the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" -- except, uh, Health Care, which would give someone life, liberty, and the happiness of still living.

:rotfl:

[Machu505]

So we are giving charity now? Don't abolish charity by calling it something else. If a person is getting health care for NOTHING, simply because he is breathing, he is still getting charity, whether or not some call it a "right." To call it a Right when the recipient did not EARN it is merely to compound the evil. It is charity still, though now extorted by criminal tactics of force, while hiding under a dishonest name.

As with any good or service that is provided by men, if you try to make its possession by all a right, you basically enslave the providers of the service, wreck the service, and end up depriving the very consumers you are supposed to be helping. To call "medical care" a right will enslave the doctors and destroy the quality of medical care in this country, as socialized medicine has done around the world, wherever it has been tried.

I have a right to be protected by the police, so are cops slaves? No. My cousin lives in Canada where universal healthcare is active, he said it doesn't at all decrease the quality of treatment.

[MyNameIsRoss]

So we are giving charity now? Don't abolish charity by calling it something else. If a person is getting health care for NOTHING, simply because he is breathing, he is still getting charity, whether or not some call it a "right." To call it a Right when the recipient did not EARN it is merely to compound the evil. It is charity still, though now extorted by criminal tactics of force, while hiding under a dishonest name.

As with any good or service that is provided by men, if you try to make its possession by all a right, you basically enslave the providers of the service, wreck the service, and end up depriving the very consumers you are supposed to be helping. To call "medical care" a right will enslave the doctors and destroy the quality of medical care in this country, as socialized medicine has done around the world, wherever it has been tried.


Those poor Canadian-Slave-Doctors. Are you serious?

[&IllBeTheReason]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.
I shared your same opinion about the welfare issue growing up because Cubans are republican and that's all I heard. Unfortunatly, it is a selfish and closed-minded opinion. This probably won't make sense to you, but sometimes people need to be on welfare for a little while so they can get their lives back on track and be successful. Part of the responsibility of being a Democratic president is being able to help those people get job's or job training while they finally have the money to put their kids in daycare and feed them regularly. Bill Clinton did an amazing job of getting many people jobs and off of welfare when he was resident, and that was one of my biggest reasons for voting for Hillary Clinton had she been nominated. Now whether Obama will be as good is certainly questionable, it is apparent that he will do alot more good that someone like McCain.

edit: I was a bit off topic.

[Jason Tate]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.
I'd like to introduce you to the Bill of Rights (http://www.constitution.org/billofr_.htm). None of which I have paid for or "earned" beside being born here.

[GiggsOho]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.

Oh, you have to buy rights now? I wonder how much my parents paid for their pursuit of happiness. I heard back in the 30's you could get your "pursuit" for a nickel.

[Machu505]

Oh, you have to buy rights now? I wonder how much my parents paid for their pursuit of happiness. I heard back in the 30's you could get your "pursuit" for a nickel.

I think I paid $9.82 for my life when I was born. I could be mistaken though.

[GiggsOho]

I think I paid $9.82 for my life when I was born. I could be mistaken though.

Dude, that's so cheap! Did you get it wholesale at Sam's club?

I can't find "lives" on EBay. Can you send me a link?

[OldJersey]

So we are giving charity now? Don't abolish charity by calling it something else. If a person is getting health care for NOTHING, simply because he is breathing, he is still getting charity, whether or not some call it a "right." To call it a Right when the recipient did not EARN it is merely to compound the evil. It is charity still, though now extorted by criminal tactics of force, while hiding under a dishonest name.

As with any good or service that is provided by men, if you try to make its possession by all a right, you basically enslave the providers of the service, wreck the service, and end up depriving the very consumers you are supposed to be helping. To call "medical care" a right will enslave the doctors and destroy the quality of medical care in this country, as socialized medicine has done around the world, wherever it has been tried.


Besides the bullshit.com site you get this stupid stuff from, have you ever actually talked to someone who lives in a country with socialized medicine? Because i hear the bullshit your spewing right now about universal healthcare from many people but they all just gather up this info from the internet and dont actually try to talk to people that you know....LIVE in the fucking country and EXPERIENCE it everyday of their lives. I do know a few people from Canada and they say it works tremendously up there.

[&IllBeTheReason]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.
I believe you're confusing rights with priviledges.:shrug:

[Machu505]

Dude, that's so cheap! Did you get it wholesale at Sam's club?

I can't find "lives" on EBay. Can you send me a link?

Yeah I got it wholesale. I'm one of six so it was pretty cheap.

[GiggsOho]

Yeah I got it wholesale. I'm one of six so it was pretty cheap.


Wow, I mean I know Robert Byrd looks out for his own, but that's a hell of a deal you have going on is WV.

[Machu505]

Wow, I mean I know Robert Byrd looks out for his own, but that's a hell of a deal you have going on is WV.

Robert Byrd is the man! Too bad he's gonna die soon. After all, he didn't make his payments on his life.

[GiggsOho]

Robert Byrd is the man! Too bad he's gonna die soon. After all, he didn't make his payments on his life.


What government bureau watches over that? IRS? HHS? HUD? I mean, I live in D.C., and I have never seen a "Department of Life" building.

[Machu505]

What government bureau watches over that? IRS? HHS? HUD? I mean, I live in D.C., and I have never seen a "Department of Life" building.

It's invisible so no one can break in and steal all the life.

[anamericangod]

A right is something you earn. By purchasing the property. If you dont earn it than you have no right.

Oh my god.

[GiggsOho]

It's invisible so no one can break in and steal all the life.

Oh, that's how it works. That's how it hasn't been given out on a no-bid gov't contract to a company Cheney once ran.

Also they must do that so Karl Rove doesn't take it and only let rich, white, old mean handle paying for it.

I also think that's where the WMD's are.

[Machu505]

Oh, that's how it works. That's how it hasn't been given out on a no-bid gov't contract to a company Cheney once ran.

Also they must do that so Karl Rove doesn't take it and only let rich, white, old mean handle paying for it.

I also think that's where the WMD's are.

Yep. Little known fact: Obama once broke into the building and stole some life, so he's really 436.

[GiggsOho]

Also little-known fact: Obama is really Jesus. He actually has all say who can buy life from the invisible building.

/evangelicals

[Stinger1921]

Besides the bullshit.com site you get this stupid stuff from, have you ever actually talked to someone who lives in a country with socialized medicine? Because i hear the bullshit your spewing right now about universal healthcare from many people but they all just gather up this info from the internet and dont actually try to talk to people that you know....LIVE in the fucking country and EXPERIENCE it everyday of their lives. I do know a few people from Canada and they say it works tremendously up there.


Hahah ya good example. douche bag.. good old canada.. great country way better the the U.S. haha

[Machu505]

Also little-known fact: Obama is really Jesus. He actually has all say who can buy life from the invisible building.

/evangelicals

So THAT'S why 1% of Americans think he's Jewish!

[Machu505]

Hahah ya good example. douche bag.. good old canada.. great country way better the the U.S. haha

It's a free er country too: http://www.stateofworldliberty.org/report/rankings.html

[Jason Tate]

Hahah ya good example. douche bag.. good old canada.. great country way better the the U.S. haha
Don't have kids.

[Stinger1921]

Soo when did you earn your right to post in here?


When did lazy shits earn the right to get paid health care just because they cant afford it. Or work hard enough to achieve it?

[GiggsOho]

When did lazy shits earn the right to get paid health care just because they cant afford it. Or work hard enough to achieve it?

Dude, they bought it when they bought their lives at Sam's Club. They were running a Labor day package deal.

[Stinger1921]

Don't have kids.


Do you have any moral values, if so could you give me a brief list of yours, if you have any?

[Stinger1921]

Oh my god.


Good one man...

[Jason Tate]

When did lazy shits earn the right to get paid health care just because they cant afford it. Or work hard enough to achieve it?
Obviously they should all die. Who needs lazy people, they're not worth saving.

[Stinger1921]

Those poor Canadian-Slave-Doctors. Are you serious?


I love it.. you never have any arguments your self or any points to make.. you just disagree with people with nothing ever to back your self up .. haha. its funny.. keep it up

[Jason Tate]

Do you have any moral values, if so could you give me a brief list of yours, if you have any?
Don't help lazy people - ever - is at the top of my list.

Sorry, but your insanity can't be covered with your guise of morality.

[Stinger1921]

Obviously they should all die. Who needs lazy people, they're not worth saving.


No they should get off their ass and get a job, and pay for their own shit and stop mooching off of the country. It is not this countries job to pay for its citizens healthcare. Our country is here to protect us, not pay for every damn part of our lives. Once again socialism does not work people, what will it take for you to understand this?

[MyNameIsRoss]

Hahah ya good example. douche bag.. good old canada.. great country way better the the U.S. haha

This is a good point?

[Stinger1921]

Don't help lazy people - ever - is at the top of my list.

Sorry, but your insanity can't be covered with your guise of morality.


Thats what i thought, the world moral to you is ancient history. Because you have none.

[GiggsOho]

Thats what i thought, the world moral to you is ancient history. Because you have none.

lol wut

My morals include good grammar and spelling. You should refund that life that you bought.

[Stinger1921]

This is a good point?


Ya i want others who aren't familiar with your dumb ass remarks, with no points to make yourself to know your an idiot when it comes to politics.

[Jason Tate]

No they should get off their ass and get a job, and pay for their own shit and stop mooching off of the country. It is not this countries job to pay for its citizens healthcare. Our country is here to protect us, not pay for every damn part of our lives. Once again socialism does not work people, what will it take for you to understand this?
And those that have jobs and can't afford health care? What should they do?

"Our country is here to protect us ..." just not from things like viruses, illnesses, accidents, diseases, infections, or anything medically related. That's how your sentence should really read.

Virtually all of Europe has publicly sponsored and regulated health care - it works. The US is the only (http://www.iom.edu/?id=17848) wealthy, industrialized nation to not offer it.

Most of the uninsured (>80% (http://www.iom.edu/Object.File/Master/17/740/Fact%20sheet%201%20%20universal.pdf )) are from working families. Not "the lazy." But don't let facts get in your way.

[MyNameIsRoss]

I love it.. you never have any arguments your self or any points to make.. you just disagree with people with nothing ever to back your self up .. haha. its funny.. keep it up


....and you make stupid accusations about whole populations and classes of people you know nothing about.

'Keep it up'.

and you should take Tate's advice about not re-producing.

[Jason Tate]

Thats what i thought, the world moral to you is ancient history. Because you have none.
Have plenty ... a good run down would be reading Lila (http://www.amazon.com/Lila-Inquiry-Morals-Robert-Pirsig/dp/0553299611).

[MyNameIsRoss]

Ya i want others who aren't familiar with your dumb ass remarks, with no points to make yourself to know your an idiot when it comes to politics.


Elementary grammar. Learn it.

[anamericangod]

CAN'T POST ANYMORE GOTTA GET MY FREE PROPERTIEZ

x

[Stinger1921]

lol wut

My morals include good grammar and spelling. You should refund that life that you bought.


whoops, i mispelled a word ,, big deal,, im typing like a madman here, because im being attacked from all angles, so forgive me for incorrectly using a word, im sorry if you still couldnt figure out what i am trying to say....

[GiggsOho]

whoops, i mispelled a word ,, big deal,, im typing like a madman here, because im being attacked from all angles, so forgive me for incorrectly using a word, im sorry if you still couldnt figure out what i am trying to say....

No I get what you were trying to say, and have been watching what you have been saying. People should buy their rights. Hence why you are being attacked. Oh, and you're an idiot.

[anamericangod]

No they should get off their ass and get a job, and pay for their own shit and stop mooching off of the country. It is not this countries job to pay for its citizens healthcare. Our country is here to protect us, not pay for every damn part of our lives. Once again socialism does not work people, what will it take for you to understand this?

Are you fucking dumb? Not everyone is healthy enough to work. Socialism does not work, but socialized programs do.

What will it take for you to understand this?

[Jason Tate]

whoops, i mispelled a word ,, big deal,, im typing like a madman here, because im being attacked from all angles, so forgive me for incorrectly using a word, im sorry if you still couldnt figure out what i am trying to say....
I'd like "freedom" for $300 Alex.

[ThereIsNo]

Hey everyone this thread is magic

[&IllBeTheReason]

whoops, i mispelled a word ,, big deal,, im typing like a madman here, because im being attacked from all angles, so forgive me for incorrectly using a word, im sorry if you still couldnt figure out what i am trying to say....
I believe you're being attacked because you're letting your closed-mindedness get the best of your facts. Or lackthere of.

[ThereIsNo]

Ok as far as universal health care goes. If you look at the 10 best Health Care systems in the world they are all European countries that are single payer systems. They understand that health care is a basic human right. Universal care does not enslave the provider, there is a very simple fix to keep this from happening. You pay doctors based on merit, not a set salary. The better care they provide the more money they make, which is an incentive to provide quality care to eveyone.

[Stinger1921]

Are you fucking dumb? Not everyone is healthy enough to work. Socialism does not work, but socialized programs do.

What will it take for you to understand this?


Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.

[GiggsOho]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.

Right, and that isn't being outsourced at all...

[Jason Tate]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.
Epic Fail.

[Machu505]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.

I'm calling fake account.

[anamericangod]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.

Yeah, because we've done such a great job of establishing a democracy in Iraq, as well as preventing terrorist attacks on American soil the past 10 years.

Not to mention all of our troops are properly equipped and receiving the highest care possible.

It's not like we have outsourced our wars to corporate mercenaries, or that troops are being electrocuted in their showers.

[ThereIsNo]

Stinger both sides in this country believe that the 47 million uninsured (14 million children) is a problem. Since you hate the idea of a federal insurence program what are your thoughts on how to fix it?

[Machu505]

Yeah, because we've done such a great job of establishing a democracy in Iraq, as well as preventing terrorist attacks on American soil the past 10 years.

Not to mention all of our troops are properly equipped and receiving the highest care possible.

It's not like we have outsourced our wars to corporate mercenaries, or that troops are being electrocuted in their showers.

God bless America.

[Stinger1921]

lol wut

My morals include good grammar and spelling. You should refund that life that you bought.


Ya most liberals have no morals. I figured as much.

[Jason Tate]

Stinger both sides in this country believe that the 47 million uninsured (14 million children) is a problem. Since you hate the idea of a federal insurence program what are your thoughts on how to fix it?
"They're all lazy and should get a job."

Seriously.

[SoggY ThE OnE]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.

I agree with most of this sentence

[MyNameIsRoss]

Ya your right, there is one socialized program that does work, its called the military. More people should join it.


Wowzers, haha. In high school, I got an opt out. Fuck you.

[GiggsOho]

Ya most liberals have no morals. I figured as much.

LOL. I guess I'll start listening to Rush Limbaugh to be "saved."

[ThereIsNo]

The war is a huge failure if we left tomorrow that country is in just as bad a shape as when we first arived. An inefficet government that can't provide for it's people and still tons of sectratarian violence. We have just managed to lose 4K troops and waste over half a trillion dollars in the process of changing the actors.

[anamericangod]

"They're all lazy and should get a job."

Seriously.

They should all join the military, obviously.

[Jason Tate]

Ya most liberals have no morals. I figured as much.
And yet somehow all those with "no morals" are trying to figure out a way to provide health care to 14 million children. Morally bankrupt I tell you.

[Jason Tate]

I agree with most of this sentence
That's too bad.

[GiggsOho]

Sick kids don't need insurance, they just need Jesus.

[Jason Tate]

LOL. I guess I'll start listening to Rush Limbaugh to be "saved."
He's the morally superior human being.

[Jason Tate]

Sick kids don't need insurance, they just need Jesus.
And guns!

[Stinger1921]

LOL. I guess I'll start listening to Rush Limbaugh to be "saved."


Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?

[MyNameIsRoss]

Ya most liberals have no morals. I figured as much.

Again, a vastly ridiculous statement. I blame your parents.

[Machu505]

Ya most liberals have no morals. I figured as much.

Mmmhmm. We totally don't try and end pointless wars that kill thousands or anything.

[Machu505]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?

That's me!

[Stinger1921]

The war is a huge failure if we left tomorrow that country is in just as bad a shape as when we first arived. An inefficet government that can't provide for it's people and still tons of sectratarian violence. We have just managed to lose 4K troops and waste over half a trillion dollars in the process of changing the actors.


Tell me i have a supporter against all of these libs? Please ha

[paper halo]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?

Wow, sounds a right evil cunt doesn't he.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?


Yes, Yes, and Yes. I'm guessing you hate gays, are for 12 year old girls giving birth to rapist's children, and you and your father go hunting every weekend ( whenever the stupid fucking seasons are, of course).

Fuck bag?

[Jason Tate]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?
We should all bow to our moral superior. He shall save us.

[&IllBeTheReason]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?
In a nutshell; pro-brains.

[Jason Tate]

Tell me i have a supporter against all of these libs? Please ha
You can call me morally bankrupt all you want ... at least I can read.

[GiggsOho]

And guns!

Did you know Jesus and Moses conquered the Romans with guns?!

[Jason Tate]

Did you know Jesus and Moses conquered the Romans with guns?!
It's because those crazy Romans were pro-choice.

[ThereIsNo]

Pretty sure marriage in this country is a joke, over half the marriages in this country end in divorce, and nothing is said about that. But when two consenting adults who happen to be the same sex decide they want to wed people go ape shit

[Machu505]

Did you know Jesus and Moses conquered the Romans with guns?!

And with the aid of Ronald Reagan!

[Stinger1921]

Wow, sounds a right evil cunt doesn't he.


How douche? Im just trying to explain to all of these damn liberals on this website, that the morals of this country, that once made it unbelievable are slowing fading away. And ruining the country.

[Machu505]

How douche? Im just trying to explain to all of these damn liberals on this website, that the morals of this country, that once made it unbelievable are slowing fading away. And ruining the country.

Oh no! More freedom, safer streets, and choice? That's communist bullshit right thar.

[Stinger1921]

We should all bow to our moral superior. He shall save us.


Im just wondering if you guys are because if you are all, then i feel really bad for you.

[ThereIsNo]

Stinger how would you fix the countries problems? You hate everyones positions but have given no ideas on how to handle any of the issues.

[ThereIsNo]

Jesus was not a republican

[paper halo]

How douche?

What?

Im just trying to explain to all of these damn liberals on this website, that the morals of this country, that once made it unbelievable are slowing fading away. And ruining the country.

And everyone is just trying to explain to you that you're full of complete and utter shit.

I don't see how gay marriage, abortion, and gun control could ruin America, but then, I'm not a fucking moron.

[GiggsOho]

Ya that would help fuck bag, oh and im guessing you are pro gay marriage, pro choice, and pro gun control too?

No this is a fuck bag:

http://www.gizmowatch.com/images/fukbag_48.jpg

And with the aid of Ronald Reagan!

http://www.it-is-law.com/dump/ReaganSmash.gif

[Jason Tate]

How douche? Im just trying to explain to all of these damn liberals on this website, that the morals of this country, that once made it unbelievable are slowing fading away. And ruining the country.
The country was founded on adultery, rape, murder, lies, and persecution by race and gender.

Yes ... we just now are losing our "morals." :rolleyes: Are you home schooled?

[Jason Tate]

Im just wondering if you guys are because if you are all, then i feel really bad for you.
What the fuck does this even say?

[Machu505]

http://www.it-is-law.com/dump/ReaganSmash.gif



I almost spit my coke zero all over my keyboard from laughter at that.

[MyNameIsRoss]

How douche? Im just trying to explain to all of these damn liberals on this website, that the morals of this country, that once made it unbelievable are slowing fading away. And ruining the country.

It's unbelievable that you believe this. McCain will certainly save us sinners!

Fuck off.

[anamericangod]

What the fuck does this even say?

Lol.

Stinger has transcended the English language.

[konvalbr]

What?



And everyone is just trying to explain to you that you're full of complete and utter shit.

I don't see how gay marriage, abortion, and gun control could ruin America, but then, I'm not a fucking moron.

you're from the UK, no one in america gives a shit what you think about our politics.

[paper halo]

Oops, wrong idiot.

[MyNameIsRoss]

you're from the UK, no one in america gives a shit what you think about our politics.

America is not the world. You and Stinger should get married. Whoops, then you would go to hell, that's right.

[Stinger1921]

Stinger how would you fix the countries problems? You hate everyones positions but have given no ideas on how to handle any of the issues.


Okay bud, First of all deport every single illegal immigrant we can get our hands on. Get them out of this country. Thats were half of the problem is anyways. They come over illegally, and get sick, have no money, oh and who pays for them, we do. You and me. And you are ok with that. We need to drill all in America until the middle eastern countries, lower the price of oil. Oh and guess who isnt letting us drill in the U.S. LIBERALS Basically,,, STOP SOCIALISM..... It is ruining this great country. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN6s1KVFBNg ...