View Full Version : Is Indie a genre?
DilesMavis
09/28/08, 06:25 AM
Okokok. Silly question. Jajaja. But, I've been wondering this. I mean, I've heard it is and I've heard it isn't.
HangsLikeHeaven
09/28/08, 07:24 AM
lolll
DilesMavis
09/28/08, 07:35 AM
Maybe I should have worded this thread better :P. I just see it listed as a genre everywhere. Even a sub genre like "indie ______" confuses me, since the music is being mainly defined by it's production rather than its genre, right? The problem with a term like indie is that it is amazingly subjective and really has no solid definition for an artist.... I mean, eh, outside of that, you got the other issue when compared to other genres. You can define rock, define blues, define hip-hop, but in comparison, indie is a giant blanket that could be any genre, me thinks. I'm just curious. I mean if I'm wrong, I want to be corrected.
lew_1987
09/28/08, 07:36 AM
Technically, no.
Its more like a classification. I use it on Itunes to keep myself organized, stores sometimes use it to separate CDs to make things easier to find. Indie is a blanket term that can be all kinds of stuff as long as it doesn't fit easily into another genre.
DilesMavis
09/28/08, 07:38 AM
Yes, Indie is a genre.
Why do you think this? Just curious. Not lookin' for a big ol' debate or anything :P. I just want to hear your opinion.
I give it it's own genre, but sometimes I find myself grouping all of my favorite bands into it when telling other people about them who don't listen to indie music.
I sorta just did it there, too.
To clarify- no, not really a genre, but i use it for certain bands sometimes.
Technically, no.
this.
Though it's very commonly used to describe bands nowadays.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:24 AM
Indie is not, nor has it ever been a "genre." It's impossible. Any claims to the contrary are false.
fenderkid212
09/28/08, 10:23 AM
Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo, its way too broad of a term anymore to really classify anything
Danny Schme
09/28/08, 11:00 AM
My vote is that it is not a genre.
DilesMavis
09/28/08, 11:25 AM
this.
Though it's very commonly used to describe bands nowadays.
NVM.
x togepi x
09/28/08, 11:44 AM
It's not my fault, but indie is now a genre whether you like it or not. Look up artists like Death Cab, The Strokes, etc. and under genre it'll say indie. I didn't make it that way, that's just how it is. You're in denial.
just because a bunch of people misuse a genre doesn't mean that it's a genre. i've seen tons of people also use the word "their" instead of "there", does that also make that right?
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 12:35 PM
Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo, its way too broad of a term anymore to really classify anything
This is a rather stupid conjecture. It classifies the business state of bands/artists/musicians. This isn't negated because scenesters and uninspired journalists associate "Indie" with whatever new band is on one of the major's subsidiary distribution labels.
jtsnazzy
09/28/08, 02:45 PM
http://www.wikihow.com/Be-Indie (lol Great read)
As far as I know indie just refers to an independent artist or one on an independent label.
Colorblind!
09/28/08, 03:40 PM
I like the blanket term.
It helps distinguish bands like Nickelback from Born Ruffians, I prefer not to call everthing just "rock".
Hey Kevin
09/28/08, 03:52 PM
Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo, its way too broad of a term anymore to really classify anything
as true as your avatar is awesome
Indie is a monster that lives under your bed. Be damn scared if it finds its way out of there!
ForeverDelayed
09/28/08, 05:06 PM
Indie is a stupid word that is used to sell shitty music to hipster wannabes.
At one point in time indie at least meant something. It was never a genre or style however. Originally it meant artists that were signed to independent labels, but these days it's used to apply to bands on major labels who sell millions of records, which only increases its bullshit factor. Anyone who honestly thinks indie is a genre needs to be slapped and sterilized.
Indie is a stupid word that is used to sell shitty music to hipster wannabes.
At one point in time indie at least meant something. It was never a genre or style however. Originally it meant artists that were signed to independent labels, but these days it's used to apply to bands on major labels who sell millions of records, which only increases its bullshit factor. Anyone who honestly thinks indie is a genre needs to be slapped and sterilized.
Now that's just silly, I wouldn't call an 80s death metal band indie because they were signed to an independent label.
Also, wtf? I don't see many bands selling millions of records at all any more. Much less being called Indie.
ForeverDelayed
09/28/08, 05:21 PM
Now that's just silly, I wouldn't call an 80s death metal band indie because they were signed to an independent label.
Yeah that's true. But that was really the original qualifying thing... you never had to play a certain style or sound a certain way, to be "indie" you had to be on an independent label. Which is why the word is so meaningless, because I don't know anyone else who would call a death metal band indie either. It's always been a bullshit word, just a way of appealing to the people who think anything mainstream sucks.
As for "indie" bands that sell millions of albums, I sure hear Death Cab called indie a lot, and I'm pretty sure Plans went platinum and had a top 40 single on it. There are others, but that was who I had in mind when I wrote that.
x togepi x
09/28/08, 05:27 PM
Now that's just silly, I wouldn't call an 80s death metal band indie because they were signed to an independent label.
Also, wtf? I don't see many bands selling millions of records at all any more. Much less being called Indie.
they would be an indie band though. you're just wrong.
just because a bunch of people misuse a genre doesn't mean that it's a genre. i've seen tons of people also use the word "their" instead of "there", does that also make that right?
Descriptively, it's kind of hard to qualify any usage as more correct than another. If people know what is meant by "indie", it is right to use it as a description. However, as others have pointed out it largely has no meaning and thus isn't really describing anything but is a placeholder word designed to attract a specific audience like flies to one of those bug zapper things.
Prescriptivism tends to make language more useful overall, but in most cases the insiginifiability of a word makes it kind of a silly argument to have.
More cohesively, I would like to see a move towards truly phonetic alphabets which allow me to enscribe the way I throw dipthongs into meaningless situations like "caught" while not in "cot". Because most read those similarly.
Firefly1628
09/28/08, 05:38 PM
Maybe I should have worded this thread better :P. I just see it listed as a genre everywhere. Even a sub genre like "indie ______" confuses me, since the music is being mainly defined by it's production rather than its genre, right? The problem with a term like indie is that it is amazingly subjective and really has no solid definition for an artist.... I mean, eh, outside of that, you got the other issue when compared to other genres. You can define rock, define blues, define hip-hop, but in comparison, indie is a giant blanket that could be any genre, me thinks. I'm just curious. I mean if I'm wrong, I want to be corrected.
I toaly agree,
Indie is just a band on an independent label. People in small bands/unsigned bands used "indie" as a term for their music to make them selves feel that their getting somewhere. There are so many bands that are "Indie" because they are on independent record labels, recently (the past 5 years or so) people feel that "indie" has a distinct sound, and thats just people being iggnorant by thinking death cab for cutie, the postal service ETC "sound indie" but it just so happens the indie music they are listening to seem sound the same. there are plenty of harcore/counrty/rap/christan/gospel artists that are on independent labels and are by definition indie. BASICALLY claiming "indie" as a genre is coming from people trying to sound musically educated.
fenderkid212
09/28/08, 07:30 PM
This is a rather stupid conjecture. It classifies the business state of bands/artists/musicians. This isn't negated because scenesters and uninspired journalists associate "Indie" with whatever new band is on one of the major's subsidiary distribution labels.
You are a rather stupid person. In a general sense, the term has become a broad classification by more people than "scenesters" and "uninspired journalists", thats all I was saying. I wasn't implying I agreed with those people. But kudos on your use of the words "conjecture" and "negated". It made you appear to have more credibility on the subject than me
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 07:52 PM
Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo, its way too broad of a term anymore to really classify anything
You are a rather stupid person. In a general sense, the term has become a broad classification by more people than "scenesters" and "uninspired journalists", thats all I was saying. I wasn't implying I agreed with those people. But kudos on your use of the words "conjecture" and "negated". It made you appear to have more credibility on the subject than me
You're being foolish. Stop it.
Firstly, you make a rash, generalized claim ("Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo"), and when you're told that this is absurd, you whine.
It means nothing that it's a term applied in erroneous fashion by a large section of people. It's still a term applied to the business ethos of bands/acts/artists/musicians.
As Togepop said earlier, many people misuse the various forms of "there," (there, they're, their) but that doesn't validate it, nor does it render their "meaningless" because so many people use "there" in its place.
"I wasn't implying I agree with these people." If that's so, and you understand what Indie actually is and that it's misappropriation by people who don't doesn't somehow make it the right use of it, then why did you claim it's "meaningless" and offer up its wrongful usage as evidence of your comment, especially if you don't endorse this logic? Again, foolishness.
I never meant to infer that you stupid, just that you made a stupid comment. It happens. Accept it...or don't and get whiny. It's very common place on these forums.
fenderkid212
09/28/08, 08:03 PM
You're being foolish. Stop it.
Firstly, you make a rash, generalized claim ("Indie has become as meaningless as the word emo"), and when you're told that this is absurd, you whine.
It means nothing that it's a term applied in erroneous fashion by a large section of people. It's still a term applied to the business ethos of bands/acts/artists/musicians.
As Togepop said earlier, many people misuse the various forms of "there," (there, they're, their) but that doesn't validate it, nor does it render their "meaningless" because so many people use "there" in its place.
I wasn't implying you were stupid, just that you made a stupid comment. It happens. Accept it...or don't and get whiny. It's very common place on these forums.
i find it laughable that you consider yourself 100 percent correct and that i need to "accept it". all i meant to say was that it is too broad of a term anymore when trying to describe a band's sound.
IWasaCamera
09/28/08, 08:14 PM
This again.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:15 PM
i find it laughable that you consider yourself 100 percent correct and that i need to "accept it". all i meant to say was that it is too broad of a term anymore when trying to describe a band's sound.
It was never intended to describe a "band's sound."
You said it was a meaningless term. You're wrong. It's no more meaningless as, say, "Punk" despite the fact Avril Lavigne and acts like her are associated with the genre. Rampant misuse of something doesn't alter its original meaning. That isn't to say I'm attempting to claim Indie is comparable to Punk because it's Indie is a genre, because it isn't, but I find the allegory to fit.
Also, I'm drinking Diet Mountain Dew and it's delicious.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:16 PM
This again.
At least until discussions about what real "screamo" is rears its cliched head once more.
IWasaCamera
09/28/08, 08:17 PM
mmmm Mountain Dew.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:19 PM
mmmm Mountain Dew.
Regular or Diet, because I find Regular far too sludgy, whereas Diet has the sugary taste (thank you aspartame) with none of the sticky thickness (wow, this got sexy out of nowhere)?
they would be an indie band though. you're just wrong.
I know :-(
There's been a lot of stupidity in the Music forum as of late.
fenderkid212
09/28/08, 08:22 PM
It was never intended to describe a "band's sound."
You said it was a meaningless term. You're wrong. It's no more meaningless as, say, "Punk" despite the fact Avril Lavigne and acts like her are associated with the genre. That isn't to say I'm attempting to claim Indie is comparable to Punk because it's a genre, because it isn't, but I find the allegory to fit.
Also, I'm drinking Diet Mountain Dew and it's delicious.
lame
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:25 PM
lame
wet
IWasaCamera
09/28/08, 08:26 PM
Regular or Diet, because I find Regular far too sludgy, whereas Diet has the sugary taste (thank you aspartame) with none of the sticky thickness (wow, this got sexy out of nowhere)?
Regular but with a healthy amount of ice to take it down a notch. This goes for nearly all soft drinks.
This thread should deal exclusively with beverages from this post onward.
Ice is blegh. Makes things too cold.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:29 PM
Regular but with a healthy amount of ice to take it down a notch. This goes for nearly all soft drinks.
This thread should deal exclusively with beverages from this post onward.
Absolutely. Did you ever drink that Mountain Dew-esque beverage Surge? It was very much like Mountain Dew, only far more sugary and rich. I imagine it was the closest you can ever come to drinking lemon-ish syrup from a can. No matter how much you try to dilute it with ice/water, it would stay undrinkable...though it tasted fantastic on pancakes, coincidentally.
Does anyone know if that's discontinued?
Surge was ridiculous. More crazy than current energy drinks. Loved it.
And I'm pretty sure it's gone forever.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:31 PM
On the subject, Cherry Chocolate Dr. Pepper was an act of domestic terrorism...that we pay for.
kearn1tm
09/28/08, 08:32 PM
Surge was ridiculous. More crazy than current energy drinks. Loved it.
And I'm pretty sure it's gone forever.
They could have salvaged it had they just turned it into an exotic novelty ice cream topping. I suspect it would go famously with Superman Icecream or any other multicolored kid's flavor.
IWasaCamera
09/28/08, 08:34 PM
Absolutely. Did you ever drink that Mountain Dew-esque beverage Surge? It was very much like Mountain Dew, only far more sugary and rich. I imagine it was the closest you can ever come to drinking lemon-ish syrup from a can. No matter how much you try to dilute it with ice/water, it would stay undrinkable...though it tasted fantastic on pancakes, coincidentally.
Does anyone know if that's discontinued?
It was discontinued quite a few years ago (2001 I believe). Really not a fan at all although I admit I've never tried to pair it with pancakes.
It was the only soda my Grandpa would drink. Kinda funny.
IWasaCamera
09/28/08, 08:42 PM
Stewart's makes great soft drinks. Orange 'n Cream, yes please.
x togepi x
09/28/08, 08:44 PM
you can get surge in europe, fyi
A Love American
09/28/08, 08:48 PM
Hahah great thread
x togepi x
09/28/08, 08:55 PM
Descriptively, it's kind of hard to qualify any usage as more correct than another. If people know what is meant by "indie", it is right to use it as a description. However, as others have pointed out it largely has no meaning and thus isn't really describing anything but is a placeholder word designed to attract a specific audience like flies to one of those bug zapper things.
Prescriptivism tends to make language more useful overall, but in most cases the insiginifiability of a word makes it kind of a silly argument to have.
More cohesively, I would like to see a move towards truly phonetic alphabets which allow me to enscribe the way I throw dipthongs into meaningless situations like "caught" while not in "cot". Because most read those similarly.
i don't think it's at all insignificant or silly to argue that indie only means independent and not a real genre because we're talking about how its use as a genre is just one more way the mainstream rapes the underground. anyone in any countercultural subculture, like most of the music that comes out of the underground on one level, should be, even at their most apathetic, wiling to correct people for misuse of their words/signs/symbols/etc, not out of some misguided attempt to be right in an objective/universal sense, but to defend their own subculture's space.
even if we are talking about a more universal reason for arguing, one has to realize that genres are a part of that classification system related to music, making them not common language, but rather technical jargon, which does have specific and obvious meanings within that context. When asking someone "is indie a genre", we're really asking "if we are defining things within this context (related to music's taxonomy), is indie a genre?" and in that context it's quite easy to say "no, it's not". whether or not it's used as a descriptor in other cases is largely irrelevant.
indie has got to be one of the broadest terms for bands.
every band that is consider indie can be actually put into another genre based upon their musical elements.
what band's or styles does one consider to fall under the indie genre (if they believe in the indie genre):
Death Cab, Interpol, Radiohead, etc etc.: This stuff could easily fall under Alternative or Adult Contemporary or just plan old Rock, even then, these bands are selling out high profile tours... last I checked that is not even close to anything the "Indie" as a genre stood for anyway, so people are way off on dropping this kind of style in the indie genre.
Bear Vs Shark, Les Savy Fav, etc etc: Yes they have slower songs, but apply way more to the post hardcore genre in a live setting than shit like Thursday and Glassjaw do, so really here, the heavier side of indie can fall under most Post-_____ genres.
A lot of kids seem to lump tons of midwestern and 90s emo into just being indie. I feel that is a bastardization in intself and I don't even like much of that emo stuff released way before my time liking music.
shit could go on and on on, pick a band you consider indie, take any post-___ genre or rock genre and based on their musical structure they can fall right under it.
A Love American
09/28/08, 09:22 PM
Indie is not a genre, because DCFC sounds nothing like Fugazi.
Anthony Lutz
09/29/08, 04:41 AM
This kind of goes hand in hand with the emo.
nicgiovanni
09/29/08, 09:34 AM
punk. punk rock. proto punk. garage rock. indie rock. indie pop. lofi. slowcore. love rock. twee pop. riot grrrl. post punk. post rock. post hardcore. hardcore. metalcore. emocore. emo. power violence. emo violence. crust. thrash. peace punk. anarcho punk. death rock. dance rock. electroclash. deathcore. goth rock. death disco. folk. anti-folk. folk punk. alt country. americana. rockabilly. psychobilly. bluegrass. country. outlaw country. electro. electronica. kraut rock. industrial. jazz. free jazz. gypsy jazz. freak folk. noisecore. noise rock. noise. psychedelic rock. psychedelic pop. psychedelic folk. blues. shoegaze. glam rock. glitter rock. black metal. death metal. d-beat. grindcore. surf rock. disco. afro beat. noise pop. power pop. pop punk. grunge.
shall i go on? i haven't even begun. too many genres. ridiculous.
nicgiovanni
09/29/08, 09:42 AM
Death Cab, Interpol, Radiohead...
take any post-___ genre or rock genre and based on their musical structure they can fall right under it.
Interpol is a post punk band. "Turn On The Bright Lights" is basically Joy Division all over again. They're not an indie rock band what so ever.
Death Cab(they suck period) would be considered "indie pop", maybe even power pop. Not Indie Rock. At all.
and Radiohead was never and will never be an indie rock band. they were never on an independent label. they exist in a completely different ball park.
and please tell me in a case such as post rock, how Godspeed You! Black Emperor, a collective band of musicians, artists, and anarchists, who speak of injustice and social order are like say Mogawi, one of those most boring bands in the entire world. Because sometimes they play loud soft loud soft? Bullshit.
GY!BE sounds nothing like Mogawi. Mogawi sounds nothing like Explosions, Explosions sounds nothing like Do Make Say Think.
genres be damned.
alice+interiors
09/29/08, 10:06 AM
There's already a thread about defining indie.
skashroomking
09/29/08, 10:10 AM
there are tons of threads about this,
but im not gona look for em so thus, here is my message
skashroomking
09/29/08, 10:11 AM
peace be with u
and i believe indie has to be considered a genre
peace be with u
and i believe indie has to be considered a genre
there are tons of threads about this,
but im not gona look for em so thus, here is my message
Fail.
and please tell me in a case such as post rock, how Godspeed You! Black Emperor, a collective band of musicians, artists, and anarchists, who speak of injustice and social order are like say Mogawi, one of those most boring bands in the entire world. Because sometimes they play loud soft loud soft? Bullshit.
GY!BE sounds nothing like Mogawi. Mogawi sounds nothing like Explosions, Explosions sounds nothing like Do Make Say Think.
genres be damned.
Because post-rock's blanket definition is "using rock instruments in a non-rock way, usually instrumentally."
All the post-something genres are collective messes with various subgenres anyway. Explosions is straight up guitar-driven post-rock while Godspeed would be apocolyptic crescendo movement-based post-rock. Being able to loop it all together under the post-rock moniker makes it easier as a listener.
Circa1628
01/23/09, 10:15 AM
not this thread again. WHY!?!
IWasaCamera
01/23/09, 10:32 AM
mmmm Mountain Dew.
Stewart's makes great soft drinks. Orange 'n Cream, yes please.
That's why.
Circa1628
01/23/09, 10:33 AM
oh, ok
IWasaCamera
01/23/09, 10:44 AM
Been enjoying Brio quite a bit lately too, although chinotto is not everyone's cup of tea.
IWasaCamera
01/23/09, 10:57 AM
Do they not have something like this (http://www.italyfromtheinside.com/2006/08/chinotto-soft-drink.html) in the States?
Circa1628
01/23/09, 10:58 AM
Do they not have something like this (http://www.italyfromtheinside.com/2006/08/chinotto-soft-drink.html) in the States?
I have never seen it
IWasaCamera
01/23/09, 11:04 AM
Apparently San Pellegrino makes a chinotto drink as well, only slightly stronger than Brio which may put some people off ha. Still worth a try if you ever see it in a grocery store
EatItSucka
01/23/09, 11:23 AM
If indie is a genre, so is emo.
If indie is a genre, so is emo.
No one denies emo is a genre. But indie is not.
Regards
01/23/09, 11:35 AM
I like coffee.
EatItSucka
01/23/09, 11:38 AM
No one denies emo is a genre. But indie is not.
I think Emo is a disgrace. I dont see why people follow that trend, like its cool to be emo or something. I think any genre can be emoish, so I don't really believe it should have its own genre.
I think Emo is a disgrace. I dont see why people follow that trend, like its cool to be emo or something. I think any genre can be emoish, so I don't really believe it should have its own genre.
You apparently have no clue what emo actually is.
chipdip18
01/23/09, 11:40 AM
Guys, guys, it's all okay. We'll replace the blanket term "Indie" with Chipdipcore.
Regards
01/23/09, 11:43 AM
I've already been doing that though :shrug:
EatItSucka
01/23/09, 11:43 AM
You apparently have no clue what emo actually is.
Please explain. The media has altered my view on it, so I never really gave it a chance.
Regards
01/23/09, 11:50 AM
Please explain. The media has altered my view on it, so I never really gave it a chance.
http://www.absolutepunk.net/showthread.php?t=166516
Please explain. The media has altered my view on it, so I never really gave it a chance.
http://absolutepunk.net/showthread.php?t=166516
Read up. Get educated.
Regards
01/23/09, 11:53 AM
lol, sorry dude.
EatItSucka
01/23/09, 12:01 PM
Thanks for the edumacation.
I think its a contradiction. A metal band can have an emo sound just like hardcore. If a band has a metal/emo sound, what are they considered?
chipdip18
01/23/09, 12:03 PM
Too bad he uses the term indie in there inappropiately haha.
chipdip18
01/23/09, 12:05 PM
I've already been doing that though :shrug:
That's good. Chipdipcore is hot.
Regards
01/23/09, 12:13 PM
That's good. Chipdipcore is hot.
I'm actually in a Chipdipcore band. Instead of using myspace to get our name out we use carrier pigeons we resurrected from the dead.
chipdip18
01/23/09, 12:14 PM
I'm actually in a Chipdipcore band. Instead of using myspace to get our name out we use carrier pigeons we resurrected from the dead.
Wow that is sooo CxDxcore.
DilesMavis
01/23/09, 02:26 PM
Wow this is kind of an old thread of mine. Looking back on this now I feel kind of idiotic for asking this.
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