The worst defense of a terrible band?

[viva la cymche!]

"They're really nice guys."

I'm sick and tired of hearing that. Does a band's niceness contribute to their songwriting and overall talent? I think not.

[tomakebelieve]

I really agree, even though I've used that excuse before or said something like "yeah, i don't like ___ but they're really nice guys."

what's even worse is when the band is utterly terrible and you can't even defend them as nice guys.

[voncorn]

"But they're REALLY catchy!"

[Osto]

"Theyre good for what they are"

[domotime2]

"they're talented" hahaha

[AussieBoy]

"they have really funny/cool videos though"

[llwilliamsll]

"I think they're a good band"

[theguy77]

"they're not good but i like them"

wtf?! i hate when people "accept" that their music "sucks"

[x togepi x]

"Theyre good for what they are"

this does not fit in this topic

[J7X]

"...but they're so hot!"

[Kneeka]

I remember saying to my friends after seeing brokencyde "yeah...his shoes are amazing though." .

[jcoop05]

this thread is actually hilarious I love it

[AP_Punk]

anal

[domotime2]

- "I don't know...I Just like them"

- "I like all kinds of music...."

- "...their old stuff was better"

- "The Devil Wears Prada IS unique"

- "They opened for a band I liked"

[EchoPark]

"The Cab play such heartfelt music"

[SamEyes]

I only use the really nice guys one if I like a band everyone else hates and it's my last attempt to get people to like them haha.

[fadedmemories]

THESE:
"Theyre good for what they are"

"...but they're so hot!"

[Bruycker]

"The guys on Absolutepunk say it's good"

[Regards]

"The guys on Absolutepunk say it's good"
lol

[OrangeJuice13]

"The guys on Absolutepunk say it's good"

Lawlzzzzz ha:-)

[absolutecrunk]

I have considered many times to make a thread about this very subject. This ALWAYS seems to happen that people will just excuse poor music because some guys are nice. Like "Well we met them when they played last month and they were the nicest guys. Totally down to earth." Who knew that a band struggling to make it and trying to accrue a fan base would be nice to people? That's the most genuine kindness I can imagine.

[Rodeo]

"At least they play instruments!"

[4N6 science]

"I really connect with their music."

and "They're really good at playing power chords!!"

[joeylksmacarena]

and always gotta love the "but they're so hawttt" excuse.

and i have actually had someone try to convince me that the jonas brothers were amazing, and her argument was "joe is going to marry me and all his songs are about me so they are the best band alive." and she was so serious about it, i wanted to slap her in the face.

[Rodeo]

and always gotta love the "but they're so hawttt" excuse.

and i have actually had someone try to convince me that the jonas brothers were amazing, and her argument was "joe is going to marry me and all his songs are about me so they are the best band alive." and she was so serious about it, i wanted to slap her in the face.


How someone can be THAT delusional is beyond me. That literally makes me sick to my stomach.

[John is a cult]

nothing can ever excuse the jonas brothers for how they execute music on a daily basis.
if i met one ever, I would fight him.

[joeylksmacarena]

nothing can ever excuse the jonas brothers for how they execute music on a daily basis.
if i met one ever, I would fight him.

it's not right to fight a girl
i'd do it anyway

man i hate them. so much.

[crushlustcrash]

"On their gig last night they said that (insert hometown) is the best city ever and we are the best crowd."

blah like they didnt say that every gig.

[Melkor]

'They make good music for their target audience.'

[SLoT]

"whatever" usually followed by any one of the excuses that's been said here already.

[lenard27]

"At least they play instruments!"
Except for plenty of "bands," you really can't use this excuse.

Not that I'm looking in the direction of Metro Station or anything.

[Closet Fan]

How about when shitty bands make excuses for themselves to justify their lack of talent?

[Jumpoff]

"They aren't the same people they were when Reinventing Axl Rose came out" :whistle:

[lucyrae]

"well they've only played, like, two shows before ..."

[jtsnazzy]

"I'm in the band."

[Burn That Shit]

But Anthony Green fronts them!

[x togepi x]

"music is subjective"

[what_ever]

"I'm friends with the band."

friends don't let friends make shitty music.

[Yes. And?]

"The Cab play such heartfelt music"
I hate that band so much.

[joeylksmacarena]

Except for plenty of "bands," you really can't use this excuse.

Not that I'm looking in the direction of Metro Station or anything.

But Anthony Green fronts them!

:lol:

[thespearkid]

"They're just trying to have fun."

[zeropunk16]

"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man."

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/14/The.Big.Lebowski.1998.Screenshot.1. jpg

[lew_1987]

"They're really nice guys."

I'm sick and tired of hearing that. Does a band's niceness contribute to their songwriting and overall talent? I think not.

I think when people say that, they are trying to imply that the band should be exempt from personal attacks, because they are nice people. That's how I would use that statement... not that I ever have.

Some bands that I listen to are dicks, but I can still listen to the music. It works the same way.

[checkered.stars]

"The guys on Absolutepunk say it's good"
"Drew Beringer gave it a high rating."

[x togepi x]

They are awesome live.

this also doesn't belong in this thread.

[x togepi x]

Yes it does.

not really, i can see situations where good bands are poorly recorded but sound great live.

[SickOfStars]

"you have no right to take a shit on me for listening to music you don't like"

Oh, wait.... ;-)

[J7X]

"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man."


I love the way people think that merely because something is an "opinion," it magically can't be wrong.

Of course it can.

If you're of the opinion that that the earth is flat - you're wrong. It's no different to thinking that Tokio Hotel is any good.

[fadedmemories]

"They sound better live"

[J7X]

I think a band should sound better live - or at least on-par with their recorded stuff.

I hate going to see bands whose albums kick severeal shades of ass, only to have them be completely inept live.

[Tomkins]

i had someone tell me
"their music sucks...but the screaming is ok."
what kind of answer is that????

[myplanforescape]

Not really the same thing but this is just as bad.
"I listen to everything but country and rap."

[EchoPark]

Not really the same thing but this is just as bad.
"I listen to everything but country and rap."


this is what you hear all the popped collared brah douchebags saying to the skanks at the bar in my hometown when asked what music they are into.

[DRUMMERGIRL121]

"But they're really popular, so they must be good!"

Uh, not really.

[jcoop05]

Not really the same thing but this is just as bad.
"I listen to everything but country and rap."

wow....I can't tell you how much I hate when people say that

[aquabayside]

Not really the same thing but this is just as bad.
"I listen to everything but country and rap."


I actually can see that as being a valid answer to the shit on the radio, which is mostly all country and radio rap.

[domotime2]

They are awesome live.
woah woah this is a bad defense? if anything thats a good defense

[caLLmEnOoNe]

woah woah this is a bad defense? if anything thats a good defense
i agree

[Rodeo]

"They sound better live"


ahahha! Hear this one SOO much...

[Indoor Living]

"Their lead singer is related to Miley and Billy Ray Cyrus."

[x togepi x]

No it's a bad defence. Their songs and music is the same as ever no matter how good they are live and no amount of jumping around changes that.

oh yeah, you're right. the reason i think John Coltrane was way better live (having seen dvds) is because he jumped around a lot.




idiot.

[Jumpoff]

oh yeah, you're right. the reason i think John Coltrane was way better live (having seen dvds) is because he jumped around a lot.




idiot.

I think he was just applying it to bands that actually are terrible in the studio.. I.e. people who say Foxy Shazam are horrible in the studio but amazing live...

[imagination]

don't you like ______? they're like a watered down version of them


what

[andrewa5]

very true!

[funkel]

"Drew Beringer gave it a high rating."
/thread

Drew's cool, but yeah...

[llwilliamsll]

but i made out with one of them....
more along the lines off..."i like this band....they dont suck and i totally made out with their keytar player"

[alice+interiors]

They sold a lot of albums.

[funkel]

"They did an awesome pop-punkish cover of a Umbrella"

[llwilliamsll]

but they're influenced by *insert good band here*

[domotime2]

No it's a bad defence. Their songs and music is the same as ever no matter how good they are live and no amount of jumping around changes that.
the only reason I can see this being a bad defense is that usually....80% of the time if a person is a fan of a "terrible band" they'll probably like them live, so their opinion on what "a good live band" is, is kind of skewed.

why do scene kids go to every single show...and usually love every band on the bill...ya know.

but I mean, if a person is a fan of a band, and they like them even more because their live performance was great according to them, then its not a bad defense. Like thats a good reason to like a band

[bobby runs]

Wow I have never seen so many assholes in one thread. People like what they like, some like shitty music and other don't its what their taste is.

I don't have a problem with people listening to Jonas Bros or HSM as long as they know that it sucks and they know it.

Most of my favorite music is looked at as "shitty" music but it's what I like. SO yeah get over yourselves.

[voncorn]

Wow I have never seen so many assholes in one thread. People like what they like, some like shitty music and other don't its what their taste is.

I don't have a problem with people listening to Jonas Bros or HSM as long as they know that it sucks and they know it.

Most of my favorite music is looked at as "shitty" music but it's what I like. SO yeah get over yourselves.

Flawed logic right there. Fans of that kind of music actually think very highly of it. You won't find a person who truly thinks the music that they listen to is shitty but still listen to it because they like it. Perhaps if they do admit the music is shitty to get people off their backs, they still don't truly think that the music they like is shitty, because they get enjoyment out of it!

People with "bad" taste aren't very musically inept, obviously, and so they will be pummeled to hell on a message board like this for not musically challenging themselves.

[bobby runs]

Flawed logic right there. Fans of that kind of music actually think very highly of it. You won't find a person who truly thinks the music that they listen to is shitty but still listen to it because they like it. Perhaps if they do admit the music is shitty to get people off their backs, they still don't truly think that the music they like is shitty, because they get enjoyment out of it!

People with "bad" taste aren't very musically inept, obviously, and so they will be pummeled to hell on a message board like this for not musically challenging themselves.
Not really, I know a good amount of people who listen to legit bands like Atmosphere but still enjoy listening to HSM.

There are actually some bands that a ton of people say are shitty but I enjoy listening to them. I will always like Simple Plan's first release even though I know there are way better records out there that have that same sound but better. It's just how it is.

[x togepi x]

Different situation.

not at all.

When you draw a distinction between live show and recorded music, which i think you need to do because they are separate things, I can't see why saying "well this band puts on a good live show", even if it's just entertaining because they do crazy shit (ie: GWAR) is a dumb defense. it's totally legit, the band just has another, but different, redeeming quality.

[fadedmemories]

ahahha! Hear this one SOO much...
Yup

[domotime2]

Not really, I know a good amount of people who listen to legit bands like Atmosphere but still enjoy listening to HSM.

There are actually some bands that a ton of people say are shitty but I enjoy listening to them. I will always like Simple Plan's first release even though I know there are way better records out there that have that same sound but better. It's just how it is.
this isnt really a thread making fun of people who like shitty bands....this is just making fun of some of the "shitty reasons" they like them.

[eatsound]

"gotta support those local bands.."


:)

[CellarGhosts]

"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man."

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/14/The.Big.Lebowski.1998.Screenshot.1. jpg
hahahaha. well played.

[Whimsikill]

"music is subjective"

Well, it's true.

[Whimsikill]

Flawed logic right there. Fans of that kind of music actually think very highly of it. You won't find a person who truly thinks the music that they listen to is shitty but still listen to it because they like it. Perhaps if they do admit the music is shitty to get people off their backs, they still don't truly think that the music they like is shitty, because they get enjoyment out of it!

People with "bad" taste aren't very musically inept, obviously, and so they will be pummeled to hell on a message board like this for not musically challenging themselves.

Not flawed logic. I think we're just looking at different definitions of what shitty is. If you define it as "not technically advanced, juvenile lyrics, generic chord progressions, sold mostly because of sex appeal" than his point is still valid. I know All Time Low fits most of those categories, but I'll still sing along to that stuff because for some reason I can't explain I just enjoy listening to it more. However, if you mean by shitty that it's not enjoyable to listen to, than yeah, it makes no sense.

The irony of your final sentence is delicious because what's musically "challenging" is subjective. If any of us went to a metal message board and name dropped Brand New, people would be on our asses "why are you listening to that gay emo wannabe-indie band? Listen to Meshuggah, at least they can play their instruments.!"

[Jumpoff]

Not flawed logic. I think we're just looking at different definitions of what shitty is. If you define it as "not technically advanced, juvenile lyrics, generic chord progressions, sold mostly because of sex appeal" than his point is still valid. I know All Time Low fits most of those categories, but I'll still sing along to that stuff because for some reason I can't explain I just enjoy listening to it more. However, if you mean by shitty that it's not enjoyable to listen to, than yeah, it makes no sense.

The irony of your final sentence is delicious because what's musically "challenging" is subjective. If any of us went to a metal message board and name dropped Brand New, people would be on our asses "why are you listening to that gay emo wannabe-indie band? Listen to Meshuggah, at least they can play their instruments.!"

I think they'd be quicker to say something like Cynic or Gorguts. Some Meshuggah tabs are LOL worthy.

"gotta support those local bands.."


:)

Can't lie. It's my reason for listening to a lot of subpar bands, and I'll continue to hide behind it.

hahahaha. well played.

... I didn't know hwo much better my avy would look in bold mode..

[CellarGhosts]

I think they'd be quicker to say something like Cynic or Gorguts. Some Meshuggah tabs are LOL worthy.



Can't lie. It's my reason for listening to a lot of subpar bands, and I'll continue to hide behind it.



... I didn't know hwo much better my avy would look in bold mode..
Haha, twins!

It looks pretty awesome either way. ;-)

[Tead42]

"They did an awesome pop-punkish cover of a Umbrella"

All Time Low is NOT shitty

[funkel]

All Time Low is NOT shitty
All Time Low did a cover of Umbrella?

And...no they are by no means great.

[Whimsikill]

I think they'd be quicker to say something like Cynic or Gorguts. Some Meshuggah tabs are LOL worthy.



Can't lie. It's my reason for listening to a lot of subpar bands, and I'll continue to hide behind it.



... I didn't know hwo much better my avy would look in bold mode..

You're probably right, I don't know if the guitars are complex are not, but since I play drums I know how highly regarded Tomas Haake is.

[Jumpoff]

You're probably right, I don't know if the guitars are complex are not, but since I play drums I know how highly regarded Tomas Haake is.

Yeha. I heard the drums were good but I also heard they use a drum machine with records of their drummer someitmes or something like that? Gorguts has a crazy drummer. Complexity to the point of stupidity might bother some though..

[Klatzke]

"they're not good but i like them"

wtf?! i hate when people "accept" that their music "sucks"
How about "their not particularly talented, but i like them.."

that acceptable? There's def a couple bands I'm that way about.

[Illuminate]

"They played a bad show, but on the cd they're really good"-in regards to scary kids scaring kids.

[2 fly and shy]

I like this defense:

"I'd like to see you try to do what they do!"

or

"they must be doing something right if they're popular"

[patrickswayze]

'It is a joke band'

I know for a fact that this one works like a charm. It's usually a paradox.

[Whimsikill]

Yeha. I heard the drums were good but I also heard they use a drum machine with records of their drummer someitmes or something like that? Gorguts has a crazy drummer. Complexity to the point of stupidity might bother some though..

Huh, I didn't know that. And yeah, extreme complexity does bother pretty much everyone except a few fans. But that was my point, that complexity doesn't make music objectively better

[theguy77]

How about "their not particularly talented, but i like them.."

that acceptable? There's def a couple bands I'm that way about.

if you like them, the music is good to you. talent and innovation only matter if you're speaking objectively. but i hate when people are all "yeah i listen to shitty music" because they're intimidated by well-versed posters who dislike that kind of music. its one thing if you concess objective qualities, like "this band isnt very creative" or something like that but what is good and what is shit is entirely based on whether you enjoy it or not.

[x togepi x]

Well, it's true.

sure, but if you cannot play your own fucking songs like some bands i've seen, i won't hesitate to claim you're not a real musician, music being subjective or not.

[theguy77]

sure, but if you cannot play your own fucking songs like some bands i've seen, i won't hesitate to claim you're not a real musician, music being subjective or not.

maybe they're just drunk :shrug:

/difficult and useless statement

[x togepi x]

maybe they're just drunk :shrug:

/difficult and useless statement

not an excuse. my band plays drunk. haha

[kearn1tm]

"they're not good but i like them"

wtf?! i hate when people "accept" that their music "sucks"

This is completely absurd. The thread is titled "worst defense of a terrible band." In this instance, readily admitting a band you enjoy isn't good wouldn't be "defending them" when an admission of their ineptitude has been submitted.

Moreover, I love a few bands that are rather awful. There's nothing wrong with enjoying music you find to be "bad." I'd suggest it makes you more aware and able to properly look at music in a pragmatic light. I love those fucking Fall Out Boy buffoons, but I the music they make is godawful.

[x togepi x]

This is completely absurd. The thread is titled "worst defense of a terrible band." In this instance, readily admitting a band you enjoy isn't good wouldn't be "defending them" when an admission of their ineptitude has been submitted.

Moreover, I love a few bands that are rather awful. There's nothing wrong with enjoying music you find to be "bad." I'd suggest it makes you more aware and able to properly look at music in a pragmatic light. I love those fucking Fall Out Boy buffoons, but I the music they make is godawful.

anyone who really disagrees with this is either no fun or reading too much john stewart mill.

[kearn1tm]

anyone who really disagrees with this is either no fun or reading too much john stewart mill.

Bentham > Mill

...

Yeah, I'm using that one again.

[x togepi x]

Bentham > Mill

...

Yeah, I'm using that one again.

nihilism > utilitarianism

[kearn1tm]

nihilism > utilitarianism

Existentialism > Nihilism

[KidRobot]

"they're not good but i like them"

wtf?! i hate when people "accept" that their music "sucks"

Some people just like immature poppy music and just live with it. And most likely they don't feel like arguing with you about it.

[x togepi x]

Existentialism > Nihilism

existentialists are nihilists that sold out.

[kearn1tm]

existentialists are nihilists that sold out.

Haha.

[carpexdiem]

- "...their old stuff was better"
Ahaha. I'm guilty.

"gotta support those local bands.."
:)
Also guilty. But when it's your friend's band and he thinks it's the best thing ever, what can you say, really?

All Time Low is NOT shitty
-cough- yes, they are -cough-

"Their lead singer is related to Miley and Billy Ray Cyrus."

But Anthony Green fronts them!

"The guys on Absolutepunk say it's good"
My favorites. x]

"At least they write their own music!"

"What kind of songs would you write if your pregnant ex-girlfriend overdosed?"

"He used to be able to scream."

[Klatzke]

if you like them, the music is good to you. talent and innovation only matter if you're speaking objectively. but i hate when people are all "yeah i listen to shitty music" because they're intimidated by well-versed posters who dislike that kind of music. its one thing if you concess objective qualities, like "this band isnt very creative" or something like that but what is good and what is shit is entirely based on whether you enjoy it or not.
Alright, i agree then. That makes sense. There are plenty of bands I like that I wouldn't consider all that talented/creative but I still like them just because.

[Indoor Living]

Ahaha. I'm guilty.


Also guilty. But when it's your friend's band and he thinks it's the best thing ever, what can you say, really?


-cough- yes, they are -cough-






My favorites. x]

"At least they write their own music!"

"What kind of songs would you write if your pregnant ex-girlfriend overdosed?"

"He used to be able to scream."

Fucking classic.

[CellarGhosts]

Ahaha. I'm guilty.


Also guilty. But when it's your friend's band and he thinks it's the best thing ever, what can you say, really?


-cough- yes, they are -cough-






My favorites. x]

"At least they write their own music!"

"What kind of songs would you write if your pregnant ex-girlfriend overdosed?"

"He used to be able to scream."
Haha. I just got this one thrown at me a few days ago, actually.

[kearn1tm]

if you like them, the music is good to you.

No. Fall Out Boy isn't "good to me." They're minimalist Pop Rock with obnoxious lyrics. I just so happen to enjoy their brand of shitty, 3-chord power riffs and faux-soul singer voice. It's the mark of self-awareness and impartiality to notice that you may enjoy bad music or any other entertainment medium.

but i hate when people are all "yeah i listen to shitty music" because they're intimidated by well-versed posters who dislike that kind of music. its one thing if you concess objective qualities, like "this band isnt very creative" or something like that but what is good and what is shit is entirely based on whether you enjoy it or not.

Stop making absurd generalizations. They make your arguments laughable.

[jcoop05]

No. Fall Out Boy isn't "good to me." They're minimalist Pop Rock with obnoxious lyrics. I just so happen to enjoy their brand of shitty, 3-chord power riffs and faux-soul singer voice. It's the mark of self-awareness and impartiality to notice that you may enjoy bad music or any other entertainment medium.



Stop making absurd generalizations. They make your arguments laughable.

what was absurd about his generalization? I think he is right. If you enjoy something then it has to be "good" to you to some extent. unless a person's ego and perceived "goodness" of music won't allow them to admit that they like something that doesn't fit into their normal idea of good.

sorry I know that was a little confusing haha

[theguy77]

This is completely absurd. The thread is titled "worst defense of a terrible band." In this instance, readily admitting a band you enjoy isn't good wouldn't be "defending them" when an admission of their ineptitude has been submitted.

Moreover, I love a few bands that are rather awful. There's nothing wrong with enjoying music you find to be "bad." I'd suggest it makes you more aware and able to properly look at music in a pragmatic light. I love those fucking Fall Out Boy buffoons, but I the music they make is godawful.

even if we're talking bands like fall out boy who don't particularly show much musicianship, and write generic music without much regard to an even balance of dynamics or variety of accents, if you enjoy them i would still consider you thinking they were a good take on a genre that isnt objectively anything special. but they obviously appeal to you in other, more trivial subjective ways. if its appealing, it's good, simple as that.

[theguy77]

No. Fall Out Boy isn't "good to me." They're minimalist Pop Rock with obnoxious lyrics. I just so happen to enjoy their brand of shitty, 3-chord power riffs and faux-soul singer voice. It's the mark of self-awareness and impartiality to notice that you may enjoy bad music or any other entertainment medium.

but is it really "bad" or is it just simple, juvenile, and lacking ingenuity? those things are objective and can be reasons why you'd consider it "bad" but if you enjoy it, in my opinion, there are other things that are good about the music -- in your case its a perceived self-mockery that you think is commendable, and that along with its engaging breed of pop-sensibility end up redeeming everything that's bad about the music for you.

Stop making absurd generalizations. They make your arguments laughable.

i wasnt generalizing everyone's intentions, just those specific people. in your case the reasoning is very different. i agree with you and togepi in the sense that this forum would be lame if everyone's ability to express negative opinions was immediately blocked by the "music is subjective" dogma, but im speaking in lew of those people who forget that, regardless how soundly and aggressively an opinion is voiced, it is still an opinion. im not taking posters like you down for ranting about why some music sucks i mean its a messageboard and we're lucky that its not one subject to an overload of trolling, im taking posters on the OTHER side of the argument down for being CONVINCED that there's no reason to listen to or enjoy bands they already enjoy.

[teenagetwilight]

"ur all jealus bcuz their on lik teh MTVS n they got a plat single n there related to miley cyrus n ur not looliezzzz"

[kearn1tm]

but is it really "bad" or is it just simple, juvenile, and lacking ingenuity?

All of which make them bad.

those things are objective and can be reasons why you'd consider it "bad"

What I said.

but if you enjoy it[...]

This entirely depends on how you enjoy it. If you listen to Fall Out Boy fully aware that they're junk food and occasionally indulge in them, then you can clearly distinguish between "good" and "bad" music, and still find it in yourself to profess your love for the certain sects of awful music, despite their inherent and obvious flaws, but again, are keenly observant of these flaws and make no qualms that they do, in fact, exist. Fall Out Boy is shitty and derivative ersatz Pop Punk delivered in a package I find appealing, despite the fact they suck.

in my opinion, there are other things that are good about the music -- in your case its a perceived self-mockery that you think is commendable, and that along with its engaging breed of pop-sensibility end up redeeming everything that's bad about the music for you.

This logic is why you're continually berated by Topegi. "Because I like it, it's good." Not only that, but it's frustrating that you project this mindset onto everyone else. "If you like it, it's good. It's lame you're conforming to those elitistas by acknowledging it's apparent lack of quality." You're still making generalizations whether you think you are or not. You assume that nearly everyone must find whatever they enjoy to be good, which is incredibly erroneous to begin with, and that if they do acknowledge the perceived lack of quality about something they enjoy, they're doing so merely to save face while posting on this forum. You may think you're not making generalizaitons, but that's really all you've done in these posts.

[caLLmEnOoNe]

"They're really nice guys."

I'm sick and tired of hearing that. Does a band's niceness contribute to their songwriting and overall talent? I think not.
haha i heard this one the other day

[theguy77]

All of which make them bad.

What I said.

This entirely depends on how you enjoy it. If you listen to Fall Out Boy fully aware that they're junk food and occasionally indulge in them, then you can clearly distinguish between "good" and "bad" music, and still find it in yourself to profess your love for the certain sects of awful music, despite their inherent and obvious flaws, but again, are keenly observant of these flaws and make no qualms that they do, in fact, exist. Fall Out Boy is shitty and derivative ersatz Pop Punk delivered in a package I find appealing, despite the fact they suck.

This logic is why you're continually berated by Topegi. "Because I like it, it's good." Not only that, but it's frustrating that you project this mindset onto everyone else. "If you like it, it's good. It's lame you're conforming to those elitistas by acknowledging it's apparent lack of quality." You're still making generalizations whether you think you are or not. You assume that nearly everyone must find whatever they enjoy to be good, which is incredibly erroneous to begin with, and that if they do acknowledge the perceived lack of quality about something they enjoy, they're doing so merely to save face while posting on this forum. You may think you're not making generalizaitons, but that's really all you've done in these posts.

whatever. i do not like bad things. i would think this was a pretty obvious mindset for people to have. i mean in my experience "bad" is an adjective used to describe something you do not like. saying something like, "it's poorly written, but i like it anyway" makes more sense to me, because that doesnt limit out the possibility of it being "addictive" or "hilarious" or any of those other good traits that may draw you to the music. "bad" to me means theres nothing you like about it.

and some people do say that to save face, i didnt say everybody, i just said that i hate when thats the case. thats not a generalization, i didnt say "people just say that to save face" i said "i hate when people say that to save face". and i dont know why you dropped the "elitistas" mock, i never said nor do i hold the opinion that voicing your opinion more shrewdly, or praising only music that is challenging in some way, makes you elitist. it makes you more interesting if anything, as long as there's no unwarranted condescension involved.

[x togepi x]

whatever. i do not like bad things. i would think this was a pretty obvious mindset for people to have. i mean in my experience "bad" is an adjective used to describe something you do not like. saying something like, "it's poorly written, but i like it anyway" makes more sense to me, because that doesnt limit out the possibility of it being "addictive" or "hilarious" or any of those other good traits that may draw you to the music. "bad" to me means theres nothing you like about it.

and some people do say that to save face, i didnt say everybody, i just said that i hate when thats the case. thats not a generalization, i didnt say "people just say that to save face" i said "i hate when people say that to save face". and i dont know why you dropped the "elitistas" mock, i never said nor do i hold the opinion that voicing your opinion more shrewdly, or praising only music that is challenging in some way, makes you elitist. it makes you more interesting if anything, as long as there's no unwarranted condescension involved.

ah yes, the simplistic black and white view. it's common coming from you.

[theguy77]

ah yes, the simplistic black and white view. it's common coming from you.

this does not compute. im actually a computer, i speak in binary. everything is either 0 or 1.

[Nevuk]

"music is subjective"
hey.... that ones incredibly hard to disprove

[Nevuk]

sure, but if you cannot play your own fucking songs like some bands i've seen, i won't hesitate to claim you're not a real musician, music being subjective or not.
Oh well yeah, that's a bit different. For me even in these cases it depends on how they handle the situation. (IE, the matches don't have strings but still play salty eyes live in a longer version transcribed to their own instruments, with lots of extra parts and only using the recording of the strings to signal that the song is starting to play. That's neat. Just using pre-recorded parts like another band was doing is just fucking horrible)

[x togepi x]

this does not compute. im actually a computer, i speak in binary. everything is either 0 or 1.

well i mean, you're ignoring the fact that it's possible to like a band ironically, which would be knowing that they're bad.

[theguy77]

by ironically liking a band, do you mean you listen to them because its amsuing to hear a medley of characteristics of bad music? if thats what you mean, i personally consider that a product of mockery, which is sort of different from liking the artist even though you like listening to it. its kind of like the laughing at someone vs. laughing with someone, where you dont think they're intentionally funny but you perceive an indirect sense of comedic relief from their actions, and this is fabricated from your perception of their actions, not by the intent of the actions by themselves.

but i could well be way off base with what you're trying to say, maybe its a sense of enjoyment i just dont have for music.

[x togepi x]

by ironically liking a band, do you mean you listen to them because its amsuing to hear a medley of characteristics of bad music? if thats what you mean, i personally consider that a product of mockery, which is sort of different from liking the artist even though you like listening to it. its kind of like the laughing at someone vs. laughing with someone, where you dont think they're intentionally funny but you perceive an indirect sense of comedic relief from their actions, and this is fabricated from your perception of their actions, not by the intent of the actions by themselves.

but i could well be way off base with what you're trying to say, maybe its a sense of enjoyment i just dont have for music.

i want you to draw the line between really liking a band and making fun of a band then, if it's so clear. i don't think it is. being conscious that something is bad can give you the same joy that liking something that's good does.

[c_rob2700]

that the horrible band is good

[kearn1tm]

whatever. i do not like bad things. i would think this was a pretty obvious mindset for people to have.

This is one of the most pretentious things I've seen on this site.

[theguy77]

This is one of the most pretentious things I've seen on this site.

what, not liking things that are unappealing?

edit: oh, that statement was based on the meaning i associated with the word "bad", which was explained the page before, and that meaning is subjective on my end. i wasnt trying to say that everything i like is universally and objectively good.

[Jumpoff]

This is one of the most pretentious things I've seen on this site.

first time that I remember seeing someone use the word pretentious correctly on ap. :highfive:

[theguy77]

i want you to draw the line between really liking a band and making fun of a band then, if it's so clear. i don't think it is. being conscious that something is bad can give you the same joy that liking something that's good does.

i guess thats true. my point is that the joy of mockery doesnt come from actually liking the music, but im really only splitting hairs, i mean theres really not that big a difference between liking the music and liking to listen to the music, haha.

[x togepi x]

i guess thats true. my point is that the joy of mockery doesnt come from actually liking the music, but im really only splitting hairs, i mean theres really not that big a difference between liking the music and liking to listen to the music, haha.

i'm not seeing the difference here. if you like listening to a band because you're making fun of them, you still like listening to the band.

[Nerdy91]

They're just beginners

[ThisIsNotDan]

Moreover, I love a few bands that are rather awful. There's nothing wrong with enjoying music you find to be "bad." I'd suggest it makes you more aware and able to properly look at music in a pragmatic light. I love those fucking Fall Out Boy buffoons, but I the music they make is godawful.

I don't buy that. if the music they made was so awful, you wouldn't listen to it, no? if you say "yeah there isn't much long lasting value or deep meaning to their music, but I like to listen to them", that would be more plausible, but I don't really think that if the music sucked you would voluntarily listen to it, know what I'm sayin?

[kearn1tm]

I don't buy that. if the music they made was so awful, you wouldn't listen to it, no? if you say "yeah there isn't much long lasting value or deep meaning to their music, but I like to listen to them", that would be more plausible, but I don't really think that if the music sucked you would voluntarily listen to it, know what I'm sayin?

I know what you're saying, but I do not subscribe to the logic that enjoying something means you must find it to be of quality.

[MADSTA]

I love it when people say that bands like Tokio Hotel have great lyrics.
Ready Set Go? Poetic genius.

[ThisIsNotDan]

I know what you're saying, but I do not subscribe to the logic that enjoying something means you must find it to be of quality.

fair enough

[Paulb-182]

the worst defense of a terrible band ever thats probably already been mentioned is when girls just talk about how 'hot' they are

[Nevuk]

I know what you're saying, but I do not subscribe to the logic that enjoying something means you must find it to be of quality.
Yeah, you can still enjoy horrible blow.

[DogSizedBird]

"you're just jealous"

"i'd like to see if you can come up with anything better"

any band or person that uses the word "hater" or "haters" or "hatin'" deserves to be fucking shot.

[x togepi x]

"you're just jealous"

"i'd like to see if you can come up with anything better"


hear these all the time. always annoying.

[CellarGhosts]

"you're just jealous"

"i'd like to see if you can come up with anything better"

any band or person that uses the word "hater" or "haters" or "hatin'" deserves to be fucking shot.
Those really are the worst.

[Charles777]

"They had the coolest shirts at the show"

[kearn1tm]

I still maintain that one can like something they deem "bad." I enjoyed that Northbrook album, for instance.

OH SNAP!

[oddwithoutend]

I love the way people think that merely because something is an "opinion," it magically can't be wrong.

Of course it can.

If you're of the opinion that that the earth is flat - you're wrong. It's no different to thinking that Tokio Hotel is any good.

Wrong.

[oddwithoutend]

I still maintain that one can like something they deem "bad."

Of course. I thought by now everyone on this forum had adopted this opinion.

[x togepi x]

I still maintain that one can like something they deem "bad." I enjoyed that Northbrook album, for instance.

OH SNAP!

haha i wonder what you'd say about my band's ep.

[WhoSaidThat?]

"you're just jealous"

"i'd like to see if you can come up with anything better"

any band or person that uses the word "hater" or "haters" or "hatin'" deserves to be fucking shot.
This was gonna be mine. I really don't get the whole "you don't make music, you can't talk shit!" excuse. I mean, you think Roger Ebert ever made movies?

[WhoSaidThat?]

I still maintain that one can like something they deem "bad." I enjoyed that Northbrook album, for instance.

OH SNAP!
Holy fuck.

[murrich]

"I like being pissed on"

[nlo13]

"They're sooo unique."

or

"I'd like to see you do any better."

Those two are extremely annoying.

[kearn1tm]

haha i wonder what you'd say about my band's ep.

Does it sound like music made for 16 year olds by 19 year olds who love just discovered Kid A after spending the last three years listening to nothing but The Devil and God and now think it's the pinnacle of music achievement?

If your band's EP sounds like it was crafted from that mindset, I'll promise to use it to get some scene boy ass.

[theguy77]

Does it sound like music made for 16 year olds by 19 year olds who love just discovered Kid A after spending the last three years listening to nothing but The Devil and God and now think it's the pinnacle of music achievement?

If your band's EP sounds like it was crafted from that mindset, I'll promise to use it to get some scene boy ass.

HAHAHAHA hmmm who does that sound like

[theguy77]

I still maintain that one can like something they deem "bad." I enjoyed that Northbrook album, for instance.

OH SNAP!

hahaha oh i didnt see this reference, yet i still knew you were referring to me. now thats just sad. hahaha

[theguy77]

"I like being pissed on"

/people who still listen to r. kelly

20k posts and i still havent learned how to multiquote. alriiiiight.

[PunkDrums182]

"They're sooo unique."

or

"I'd like to see you do any better."

Those two are extremely annoying.
or THEN WHY ARE THEY SO FAMOUS?!

[theguy77]

or THEN WHY ARE THEY SO FAMOUS?!

this is the one i hear most often in real life and not ironically the one that's most likely to make me retort in pretentious asshole fashion.

[deanster321]

It can be annoying when people say "Oh, they're just fun", as if playing certain kinds of music makes you totally exempt from criticism.

[s.t.e.v.e.n.]

You can absolutely "like" music or anything that you think is objectively bad.

This happens to me with movies as well. If you Samuel L. Jackson is in a movie swearing I'm going to like it. I would never argue that he makes great films though. Seems pretty simple.

[Burn That Shit]

Absolutepunk.net gave them a good review. (many apologies if this has already been said.)

[believeinlovex]

"They're really sweet to their fans"

Sucky defense. EXAMPLE: Jonas Brothers?

[funployee]

"I listen to everything"

"I only like 2 or 3 songs" (the only damn ones they know)

[Losing Streak]

I have to admit I've used the "nice guys" and "they're fun" defense on occasion.

[Losing Streak]

"I listen to everything"


That always makes me cringe. It basically means: "I really don't like music enough to take the time to actually find the music that I really enjoy the most." Or, "Music doesn't mean that much to me so I just listen to the radio."

[Robototron]

I have to admit I've used the "nice guys" and "they're fun" defense on occasion.

Yeah, I use "they're fun" all the time, but it's not really like a "they're good because they're fun" type thing. Take The Teenagers for example (first band that came into my head, and I always end up defending them because everybody hates them). They're a shitty band. They can barely play their instruments, their lyrics are hilariously awful. They even wrote a song about a girl who posted a comment on their Myspace ("Nicole"). Do I like them because they're a talented band who I actually think are worthy of praise? No, I like them because they're catchy as hell, but that doesn't make them good.

I've also said "I listen to everything" before, but usually just to people who I think don't know much about music/don't listen to much of it to avoid having to explain what the hell the music I listen to actually is. To more knowledgeable people I'll just say what I've been listening to lately (Dubstep and top 40 rap jams, FYI).

[nlo13]

or THEN WHY ARE THEY SO FAMOUS?!

YES. This is definitely the worst one. There are limitless responses to this, most of which make look like an elitist asshole :-/ The one I hear this one the most about is Lil' Wayne

[Robototron]

Lil' Wayne is good for other reasons, though, so that's a stupid argument.

[SickOfStars]

I mean, you might sound a bit condescending sometimes, but if you bring up the way that large companies pay to have bands put in spots where they'll get maximum repeated exposure, then you're just pointing out the structure of the music industry. The most famous bands aren't necessarily the best bands. You're not saying that every famous band is the worst, but in the particular case of a band you don't think is good, the argument is still sound.

I still think it all comes down to opinions and assholes, but the above is probably the best leg you could have to stand on in the case of the "then why are they so famous?!" card being drawn.

[WhitestKidUKnow]

I mean, you might sound a bit condescending sometimes, but if you bring up the way that large companies pay to have bands put in spots where they'll get maximum repeated exposure, then you're just pointing out the structure of the music industry. The most famous bands aren't necessarily the best bands. You're not saying that every famous band is the worst, but in the particular case of a band you don't think is good, the argument is still sound.

I still think it all comes down to opinions and assholes, but the above is probably the best leg you could have to stand on in the case of the "then why are they so famous?!" card being drawn.

nice zombies avatar.

[Five-Star]

That always makes me cringe. It basically means: "I really don't like music enough to take the time to actually find the music that I really enjoy the most." Or, "Music doesn't mean that much to me so I just listen to the radio."

Bingo. Hate when people say I listen to everything. Then I say so what do you like. They say uuuuuuuuhhh.

[Robototron]

nice zombies avatar.

+1

The Zombies are like my favorite summer band.

[x togepi x]

I mean, you might sound a bit condescending sometimes, but if you bring up the way that large companies pay to have bands put in spots where they'll get maximum repeated exposure, then you're just pointing out the structure of the music industry. The most famous bands aren't necessarily the best bands. You're not saying that every famous band is the worst, but in the particular case of a band you don't think is good, the argument is still sound.

I still think it all comes down to opinions and assholes, but the above is probably the best leg you could have to stand on in the case of the "then why are they so famous?!" card being drawn.

that has never worked, ever.

also they're fun isn't really a defense. it's more like i know i'm listening to something shitty but i like it just like i think volcano burritos with no meat and extra beans rule.

[SickOfStars]

nice zombies avatar.

+1

The Zombies are like my favorite summer band.

Yeah they're pretty great

that has never worked, ever.

well it's not your/my/whoever else 's fault that everyone is retarded and the second you bring up how music, as a business, is actually structured they holds their ears and go "lalalalalalalala!"

I hate to be douchey, but if they won't listen to some sort of sound logical argument, especially if you're just trying to justify that you can not like a band without them saying "but everyone else thinks they're good," then there's not really any point to discussing anything with them in the first place.

[Losing Streak]

Bingo. Hate when people say I listen to everything. Then I say so what do you like. They say uuuuuuuuhhh.

Haha, yea that answer says it all. Usually I say something like "come on, they're has to be something you don't like..." and usually they'll think of something and say it, "well, I don't really like disco", "that one song bugs me" or something like that. The thing is, if music isn't that important to you, you're not going to bother realizing you don't "like everything" unless someone asked you to name something. Nobody "likes everything", but not everyone pays enough attention to music to recognize that.

[DejaNew]

"But they're Australian"

[Five-Star]

Haha, yea that answer says it all. Usually I say something like "come on, they're has to be something you don't like..." and usually they'll think of something and say it, "well, I don't really like disco", "that one song bugs me" or something like that. The thing is, if music isn't that important to you, you're not going to bother realizing you don't "like everything" unless someone asked you to name something. Nobody "likes everything", but not everyone pays enough attention to music to recognize that.

Yea, I realized a lot of people just aren't into music like that. Those are the ones that say I like everything but dont have any music at all, just listen to what they here on the radio or tv.

[x togepi x]

Yeah they're pretty great



well it's not your/my/whoever else 's fault that everyone is retarded and the second you bring up how music, as a business, is actually structured they holds their ears and go "lalalalalalalala!"

I hate to be douchey, but if they won't listen to some sort of sound logical argument, especially if you're just trying to justify that you can not like a band without them saying "but everyone else thinks they're good," then there's not really any point to discussing anything with them in the first place.

well you're ignoring the fact that most people don't like discussing music, they like to appear that they are discussing it. of course, this applies to basically anything.

[SickOfStars]

well you're ignoring the fact that most people don't like discussing music, they like to appear that they are discussing it. of course, this applies to basically anything.

*sigh* I suppose you really have me there

[HometownHero]

+1

The Zombies are like my favorite summer band.
"They're great summer music"

[stereokiller]

He was so much better when he was fatter.

[Pawan1993]

"I'm not a fan but the kids like it."

[AlexEnglish]

"I like being pissed on"

i actually laughed from this.

[Jefferson Rank]

"Some people LIKE country." (about Nickelback)

[DePeachMode]

"But they were in TWILIGHT. Why don't you understand?"
"But they're unique and innovative. Uh, well, they were. 20 years ago. Uh, yeah"
"Come on, All Time Low isn't THAT bad."

etc.

[Charles777]

He was so much better when he was fatter.

Patrick Stump?

[Robototron]

"They're great summer music"

They're good for other reasons, I just happen to enjoy them most in the summer, as I do most pop music.

[PunksNotDead!]

"But they were in TWILIGHT. Why don't you understand?"
"But they're unique and innovative. Uh, well, they were. 20 years ago. Uh, yeah"
"Come on, All Time Low isn't THAT bad."

etc.
this

"i have connections with the band"
that doesnt make the music suck less

[DePeachMode]

They're good for other reasons, I just happen to enjoy them most in the summer, as I do most pop music.

I tend to like certain bands a lot more during certain seasons too. Broken Social Scene's s/t takes on a whole new meaning when you're driving down a sunny road by the ocean.

[stereokiller]

Patrick Stump?

Bemis. haha. i think i read it in his blogpost somewhere(that some people were saying it).

[Hagysaurus Rex]

"They were so much better before Pete Wentz told everyone about them"

[Hagysaurus Rex]

"you're just jealous"

"i'd like to see if you can come up with anything better"

any band or person that uses the word "hater" or "haters" or "hatin'" deserves to be fucking shot.

QUIT DRANKIN THE HATORADE!!!!

:wave:

[tyramail]

i have used the "they are so nice" one, but not necessarily defending a band's music. like with attack attack!, they are some of the nicest guys i've met. i actually do like the band, but i know that there are bands that outshine them and that the majority of users on here dislike them. they get a lot of shit, so i think it's sad to see such nice people get bashed so hard.

[Charles777]

Bemis. haha. i think i read it in his blogpost somewhere(that some people were saying it).

I hear people saying that Patrick Stump is better fat all the time

[stereokiller]

I hear people saying that Patrick Stump is better fat all the time

epic lol. you must have great self-control for not punching them in the face.
:strong:

[Burn That Shit]

but travis barker is their drummer