Rick Warren chosen to lead Inaugural Prayer (Second thread)

[Nevuk]

Here's a pretty nice compilation of the ridiculous stuff he's said (with links to the sources):
http://www.americablog.com/2008/12/obama-picks-homophobe-pro-prop.html

I'd say to people should try and be civil, but I'll honestly probably not stick very well to that.
Edited for choice quotes :
“But to me it is kind of a charade in that people say ‘We believe abortions should be safe and rare,’” he added.

“Don’t tell me it should be rare. That’s like saying on the Holocaust

Rick Warren: But the issue to me is, I’m not opposed to that as much as I’m opposed to the redefinition of a 5,000-year definition of marriage. I’m opposed to having a brother and sister be together and call that marriage. I’m opposed to an older guy marrying a child and calling that a marriage. I’m opposed to one guy having multiple wives and calling that marriage.

[captainhampton]

now let's all be civil here.......fuck Rick Warren.

[Skadrist]

I refreshed it and the thread disappeared figured this had happened.

[LastPlaceRocks]

now let's all be civil here.......fuck Rick Warren.
Given the above quotes, I'm pretty sure Rick Warren would not like that.

[r_r_repeat]

The problem I see with choosing Rick Warren is that he sends the wrong message to the homosexual community, and while this could easily be seen as Obama "turning his back on the gay community," but perhaps by embracing the other side of the aisle, he will get more done for homosexual rights than anybody could have even guessed.

Then again, he could just be pandering.

[captainhampton]

Given the above quotes, I'm pretty sure Rick Warren would not like that.

haha touche

[Nevuk]

Aren't most homophobic people aroused by homoerotic imagery though? Rick Warren very well might like it.

[r_r_repeat]

Aren't most homophobic people aroused by homoerotic imagery though? Rick Warren very well might like it.

Maybe he's a closet homo like Ted Haggard.

[x togepi x]

see here's the problem with civility on this issue: it's "straight" people telling "gay" people how to act when they've been doing that for 200 years. post-partisanship waters down progressive politics and only serves to prop up the mainstream which is homophobic, racist, sexist, classist, etc. acting as if we can act without idelogy is ridiculous, as the "no ideology"/post-partisan conception of politics is an ideology in of itself, ie: a centrist one. which is just as extremist as any other one.

seeing as there is no one way to be gay straight bi or whatever, there is no way one should react to such an issue. putting one in a box like civility is oppressive in nature. it is telling someone like me "i am here for you, as long as you act the way i want you to" which is basically like saying "I am here for you but you need to act straight". It's offensive to be patronizing to one minority group by sitting and lecturing them on how they should act from a position of privilege. Unless you, yourself are part of that minority group, you do not know, no matter how many experiences you listen to from that group, what it's like to be them, so you do not know how a proper reaction should be. and considering the fact that these groups are not monolithic, there is no proper response that fits for everyone.

my anger at this is as justified as someone feeling okay with it is as justified as someone like melissa ethridge saying we should love rick warren. they are all valid responses and should be respected as such. not denigrated by people who expect "maturity" or whatever. I speak as one person, and forcing me to represent my community with my words is just as homophobic as saying i shouldn't get to be married for reasons I outlined in this article that i posted that nobody read:http://mmcisaac.faculty.asu.edu/emc598ge/Unpacking.html

[Nevuk]

Hey now, Ted Haggard prayed the gay away.
/joking.
But that kind of treatment is exactly what Togepi was talking about in the other thread.

[LastPlaceRocks]

Aren't most homophobic people aroused by homoerotic imagery though? Rick Warren very well might like it.
That's not a subject that I know anything about.

Anyways going back to what I said in the first thread, I like the move by Obama because it gets his message of creating a dialogue between two sides across better than anything else.

[r_r_repeat]

Hey now, Ted Haggard prayed the gay away.
/joking.
But that kind of treatment is exactly what Togepi was talking about in the other thread.

Yes, I agree that treatment is disgusting and cruel. It reminds me of the movie Saved! where they send him off to that gay camp to be "cured." Absolutely sickening.

Has anybody seen Milk? There was a kid in there who was going to commit suicide because his parents were going to send him to one of those camps. And he couldn't run away because he was in a wheelchair. It was really sad.

[x togepi x]

Maybe he's a closet homo like Ted Haggard.

are you seriously claiming to not be homophobic when you're poking fun at the concept of the closet which is an extremely oppressive reality to many homosexuals?

[r_r_repeat]

are you seriously claiming to not be homophobic when you're poking fun at the concept of the closet which is an extremely oppressive reality to many homosexuals?

OH MY GOD. Seriously?! I'm poking fun at the HYPOCRISY of a man who stood against homosexuality for so many years and GOT CAUGHT WITH A MALE PROSTITUTE.

Jesus CHRIST.

[x togepi x]

OH MY GOD. Seriously?! I'm poking fun at the HYPOCRISY of a man who stood against homosexuality for so many years and GOT CAUGHT WITH A MALE PROSTITUTE.

Jesus CHRIST.

dropping the name of our lord. that's not very civil.

especially since you used the term "homo" which is a slur against homosexuals. can you not see how someone would think you were taking the concept of the closet lightly?

[r_r_repeat]

dropping the name of our lord. that's not very civil.

especially since you used the term "homo" which is a slur against homosexuals. can you not see how someone would think you were taking the concept of the closet lightly?

I simply used it as a shortening of the word homosexual. It was not meant to offend, and for that (and that ALONE) I am sorry.

[MixedwithBlood]

now let's all be civil here.......fuck Rick Warren.

this made me laugh for a solid 7 minutes

[x togepi x]

I simply used it as a shortening of the word homosexual. It was not meant to offend, and for that (and that ALONE) I am sorry.

i think it's funny that you'll apologize for the thing you did that was least offensive.

[r_r_repeat]

i think it's funny that you'll apologize for the thing you did that was least offensive.

I think it's funny that I'm trying to be civil and even that doesn't appease you. You can't be happy.

[Nevuk]

Let's do the circular process of arguing about tolerating tolerance

[x togepi x]

I think it's funny that I'm trying to be civil and even that doesn't appease you. You can't be happy.

Did you actually read the post i made re: civility?

If you apologized for saying things like "you should be grateful for me", and telling me that i'm hurting the homosexual community (as if i was trying to speak for it) then I'd have no problem with you, but what you did there is probably the most offensive thing that has ever been said to me.

[x togepi x]

Let's do the circular process of arguing about tolerating tolerance

i only tolerate class war, pbr and cats.

[captainhampton]

i only tolerate class war, pbr and cats.

see, now I'm a dog person. I'll take man's best friend over some smug cat any day.

[Nevuk]

Dogs are too easily satisfied for me. But can we all agree on PBR?

[LastPlaceRocks]

Dogs are too easily satisfied for me. But can we all agree on PBR?
Not a chance.

[captainhampton]

Dogs are too easily satisfied for me. But can we all agree on PBR?

hey I already agreed with you once tonight. now that is some real progress and change. isn't that enough?

[Nevuk]

hey I already agreed with you once tonight. now that is some real progress and change. isn't that enough?
I guess, I guess. Sadly, deep down I'm really the type of person who wants everyone to get along and negotiates between people really well.

[Adeniz19]

rick warren is a douche. i'll agree with that.

[r_r_repeat]

Did you actually read the post i made re: civility?

If you apologized for saying things like "you should be grateful for me", and telling me that i'm hurting the homosexual community (as if i was trying to speak for it) then I'd have no problem with you, but what you did there is probably the most offensive thing that has ever been said to me.

I never said you were trying to speak for the whole of the gay community, but when outsiders see people like you arguing in the fashion that you were, they sit there and think, "Yep, there go those angry gays again, wanting us all to accept their disgusting lifestyle." But if you sit down and reason civilly, you have a chance to change their minds, thus making progress. I NEVER said you speak for all homosexuals.

And I didn't mean "Be grateful, bow down to me, murrr I'm so amazing" but what you said was something to the effect of "you don't mean anything you do for the gay community, you just do it to feel better about yourself." I'm just saying, the gay rights movement affects me in no way, because I am straight, it'd at least be nice if you wouldn't attack me when I tell you how I stood up for YOUR cause. I could easily let it slide, because it doesn't affect me in the least, but I actually give a fuck about other people (NOT saying you don't, so let's avoid that argument before it starts) so I participate in causes that don't affect me.