The Obama Deception

[Foxholes]

Ladies and gentlemen! Our first Obama conspiracy documentary!

6223232123104914517&ei=EEa7SdqfFoHo-AHzuqHPAQ&q=the+obama+deception
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6223232123104914517 &ei=EEa7SdqfFoHo-AHzuqHPAQ&q=the+obama+deception

[airik625]

Interesting. I'm gonna have to watch this tomorrow.

[Rawrr]

Watched about two minutes of this earlier, could determine the whole thing was not worth watching.

[Juturna25]

south park conspiracy betterrrr

[chokeychicken]

would rather suck my own dick

[COTA]

Wrong forum.

[softcoeur]

mehhhhhh.

[WarpSpeedChewy]

Ohhhh scary music. It must be true.

[eliselovesmusic]

America in January: YAY FOR CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

America in March: YAY FOR FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN AND CONSPIRACY THEORIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!

[shit stroll]

Interesting. I'm gonna have to watch this tomorrow.
:hitself:

[The Database]

would rather suck my own dick
this.

[The Database]

I bet Joe Pags endorsed this video.

[Domenic182]

I bet Joe Pags endorsed this video.
baby killer

[The Database]

baby killer
don't ask me, ask God.

[loveisdead]

Where is modlife?

[alice+interiors]

How many coincidences does it take to make a conspiracy? Seems that everyone ducks under a mask of patriotism whenever that word is thrown around.

[wesgemm08]

Lol.. first two interviews KRS-One and Jesse Ventura on a bus with Willie Nelson. A+ comedy. Best so far this year, though I haven't seen 'I Love You, Man' yet.

[Esrb99]

is it cool to hate on Obama now? Missed the memo...

[ThisIsNotDan]

I was at an Obama fashion show...

[DaveZeroZero]

Every big thing has to have a conspiracy theory.

This one is silly.

EDIT: haha, burger king

[3eb23]

i saw the trailer awhile back and it didn't look that great. however i'll give it a shot. alex jones may have some far-fetched theories, but he also usually makes some damn good points and he can be an eye-opener. thanks for posting.

[Praetor]

I was at an Obama fashion show...
Trapped in an oil painting

[IAmNietzche]

Like always Jones makes a few good points but he seems to always work the NWO into his documentaries and it's getting kind of tired. Still worth watching though.

[J.C.]

Watched a little. If anybody's that interested in being made stupider as a result of having viewed this documentary, I'd recommend reading about a dozen of DaveZeroZero's posts instead. It gets the job done just as effectively and is much less time consuming.

[DaveZeroZero]

Watched a little. If anybody's that interested in being made stupider as a result of having viewed this documentary, I'd recommend reading about a dozen of DaveZeroZero's posts instead. It gets the job done just as effectively and is much less time consuming.
Thanks.

[J.C.]

Like always Jones makes a few good points but he seems to always work the NWO into his documentaries and it's getting kind of tired.

Yup.

7tLyIFiJBAM

Needs moar of that nWo. I'd even settle for some Wolfpac at this juncture.

Thanks.

<3

[The Personist]

This is absolutely insipid.

[batmannj]

Yup.

7tLyIFiJBAM

Needs moar of that nWo. I'd even settle for some Wolfpac at this juncture.



<3
LOL gotta love the nWo theme.

[3eb23]

good movie so far. much less "conspiracy"-like than previous films.

[more heart]

Waste of time, will not watch.

[x togepi x]

oh look a president doesn't follow his campaign promises to a T, surely this means he's the puppet of a giant shadow government.

[BlinkxExists21]

the burger king speech was a little weird.

[Until The Bombs]

Joe Rogen, Jesse Venture, KRS-1....very credible. Of course none really seems to be addressing Obama directly. Seems like someone just pieced together a bunch of videos and added a scary voiceover.

[lauren<3s music]

people are so fucking stupid, it really astounds me. for anyone who even gives this a second thought, go sit in on a congressional hearing and see how the government really works and open an god damn book

[Rodeo]

kinda funny how nearly 99% of the people on here bitching about this movie aren't even the voting age yet. Not agreeing or disagreeing with the movie or it's contents... just a funny observation.

[Machu505]

kinda funny how nearly 99% of the people on here bitching about this movie aren't even the voting age yet. Not agreeing or disagreeing with the movie or it's contents... just a funny observation.

Nowhere near 99%.

[Rodeo]

Nowhere near 99%.


Says the 14 year old.

[Machu505]

Says the 14 year old.

Says the guy who makes up percentages.

[Rodeo]

Says the guy who makes up percentages.


hahhaha... you really wanted me to take the time and go through all the posts and get the absolute right number? hahah... grow the fuck up, man.

[Machu505]

hahhaha... you really wanted me to take the time and go through all the posts and get the absolute right number? hahah... grow the fuck up, man.

You didn't have to go through every post to figure out that most of the people bitching about the movie were of voting age.

[J.C.]

Says the 14 year old.

Says this 22 year old.

[Rodeo]

I will guarantee this though... not one of you has watched the whole thing... have you?

[Broken Parachute]

Says the guy who makes up percentages.Hahahahaha.

Says this 22 year old.And this 18 year old.

[SlappedActor]

The overwhelming majority of posters in this thread are above voting age, at this point in time. Yes, I checked.

[Machu505]

I will guarantee this though... not one of you has watched the whole thing... have you?

I haven't yet. I'll watch it tomorrow. I made it through Zeitgeist, I'll make it through this.

[lauren<3s music]

Says the 14 year old.
that 14 year old is smarter than you are in terms of politics, so perhaps you should consider who you're talking shit to before you recite george bush era math.

[J.C.]

got'em

[Rodeo]

that 14 year old is smarter than you are in terms of politics, so perhaps you should consider who you're talking shit too before you recite george bush era math.


you know my views on politics after saying that i'm not agreeing or disagreeing? Wow... Miss Cleo, can I have your autograph? Say something with your accent!


Let it be known: I VOTED FOR OBAMA.

[darkpelican]

Tldw

[lauren<3s music]

you know my views on politics after saying that i'm not agreeing or disagreeing? Wow... Miss Cleo, can I have your autograph? Say something with your accent!


Let it be known: I VOTED FOR OBAMA.
i don't care who you voted for, you make up numbers and you make stupid comments about one of the smartest posters here. venture into the general thread once or twice before you start on someone for being young. just because you're not old enough to vote, doesn't mean you're not old enough to be involved. plenty of people over 18 vote and don't know there head from there ass, so consider that next time.

and if it makes you feel better, imagine i said it with a jamaican accent

[x togepi x]

i didn't know al qaeda was an arm of the US intelligence agency

[x togepi x]

I will guarantee this though... not one of you has watched the whole thing... have you?

I just finished it. He makes vague points but they don't prove what he wants them to prove.

ex: one part he talks about how someone who's high up in the federal reserve was picked by obama to be high in the treasury. sounds scary unless you think "wait, that person is probably really qualified for the position he's in."

he also blames bush era policies, like the building of fema detention centers, on obama.

i'm not an obama fan really (or anyone in the US government) but this documentary plays on people's ignorance of specific organizations like the bilderberg group to show a conspiracy. i'm just not seeing it.

[Rodeo]

i don't care who you voted for, you make up numbers and you make stupid comments about one of the smartest posters here. venture into the general thread once or twice before you start on someone for being young. just because you're not old enough to vote, doesn't mean you're not old enough to be involved. plenty of people over 18 vote and don't know there head from there ass, so consider that next time.

and if it makes you feel better, imagine i said it with a jamaican accent


My comment was about young people talking in this thread. The FIRST person to say something was 14. Pure irony. I wasn't being condescending. I was merely pointing out the irony of the statement.

[Hojonny]

i don't care who you voted for, you make up numbers and you make stupid comments about one of the smartest posters here. venture into the general thread once or twice before you start on someone for being young. just because you're not old enough to vote, doesn't mean you're not old enough to be involved. plenty of people over 18 vote and don't know there head from there ass, so consider that next time.

and if it makes you feel better, imagine i said it with a jamaican accent

you spelled "their" wrong

[Rodeo]

I just finished it. He makes vague points but they don't prove what he wants them to prove.

ex: one part he talks about how someone who's high up in the federal reserve was picked by obama to be high in the treasury. sounds scary unless you think "wait, that person is probably really qualified for the position he's in."

he also blames bush era policies, like the building of fema detention centers, on obama.

i'm not an obama fan really (or anyone in the US government) but this documentary plays on people's ignorance of specific organizations like the bilderberg group to show a conspiracy. i'm just not seeing it.


Well, would you look at that! A highly intelligent post! Kudos, sir.

[lauren<3s music]

My comment was about young people talking in this thread. The FIRST person to say something was 14. Pure irony. I wasn't being condescending. I was merely pointing out the irony of the statement.

mhm

you spelled "their" wrong

sure did. thanks captain grammar.

[Hojonny]

sure did. thanks captain grammar.

No problem!

[Rodeo]

mhm



sure did. thanks captain grammar.



You're pretty much the most condescending person on this site when talking about politics. If someone doesn't line-up with what you say, you attack. You attacked me and I was being neutral! You're the reason the politics forum is a hate-filled shithole.

[lauren<3s music]

No problem!

you did miss the too vs to though earlier. gotta work on that :stickout:

You're pretty much the most condescending person on this site when talking about politics. If someone doesn't line-up with what you say, you attack. You attacked me and I was being neutral! You're the reason the politics forum is a hate-filled shithole.

perhaps, but i generally people make it too easy to attack them because most people make stupid points. shockingly enough there are a few users i disagree with and yet i respect them. i "attacked" you because you were going after someone who is a great contributor because of his age and it irked me; attack is a stretch. and if you think the politics forum is a hate filled shithole, you must not have a lot of real world experience - we pretty much hold hands and sing kumbayh comparatively speaking.

[INhopewefail]

Conspiracy theories already!?!? He hasn't even been in office for 2 months yet!

[Hojonny]

You're pretty much the most condescending person on this site when talking about politics. If someone doesn't line-up with what you say, you attack. You attacked me and I was being neutral! You're the reason the politics forum is a hate-filled shithole.

I don't know the history enough to totally agree with you about the most condescending thing ever, but I would agree that she is over condescending.

I corrected her grammar just to see what kind of reaction she gave. A post as pointless as mine doesn't really deserve a response, but we got hate. So there you go.

[Rodeo]

perhaps, but i generally people make it too easy to attack them because most people make stupid points.


Talk about a 'bushism'..... even when YOU attack someone, YOU blame someone else. How convenient.

[WarpSpeedChewy]

:popcorn:

[lauren<3s music]

Talk about a 'bushism'..... even when YOU attack someone, YOU blame someone else. How convenient.

stupidity = deserving not convenient. but it's not a big deal. i'm a matt fan and i don't like it when people go after him.
:popcorn:

pass the salt please

[Machu505]

I will admit that Lauren is awful with a keyboard.

[TEAMRAMROD]

I hate being in this hate-filled shithole.

[Rodeo]

stupidity = deserving not convenient.


You are so fucking full of yourself! Give your ego a break!



but it's not a big deal. i'm a matt fan and i don't like it when people go after him.


Are you his mom? I think he can fight his own battles. We're done now.

[EastCoastLights]

what exactly makes joe rogan a credible source for this video?

[lauren<3s music]

I will admit that Lauren is awful with a keyboard.
it is very sad, but very true. especially when i've been working all day it just comes out generally quickly and with no punctuation. but im still worse on the blackberry.

[loveisdead]

I don't see how people are saying Lauren is the reason the politics forum is a "hate filled shithole." She stopped posting there for a decent amount of time, just recently started getting back into posting and has not been attacking people hardly are all.

Sean is really the only one that will consistently attack people.

[Rodeo]

I don't see how people are saying Lauren is the reason the politics forum is a "hate filled shithole." She stopped posting there for a decent amount of time, just recently started getting back into posting and has not been attacking people hardly are all.

Sean is really the only one that will consistently attack people.



Well, I wouldn't know what it is like now, but she's the reason I quit going in there though. I DO know that.

[lauren<3s music]

You are so fucking full of yourself! Give your ego a break!






Are you his mom? I think he can fight his own battles. We're done now.
dude you really don't know me at all.

there wasn't a fight, nor a battle, just simply commenting.

[lauren<3s music]

I don't see how people are saying Lauren is the reason the politics forum is a "hate filled shithole." She stopped posting there for a decent amount of time, just recently started getting back into posting and has not been attacking people hardly are all.

Sean is really the only one that will consistently attack people.
hahahaha aw damnit SHHH i have a bitchy reputation to uphold apparently. color it part of the evil lobbyist in me....

[Rodeo]

dude you really don't know me at all.


What a revelation! Now you know what it is like to be on the other side.

[loveisdead]

hahahaha aw damnit SHHH i have a bitchy reputation to uphold apparently. color it part of the evil lobbyist in me....
I mean sure, you can get bitchy, but that's sort of part of talking about politics. Especially considering the amount of idiots that venture into that forum.

[lauren<3s music]

What a revelation! Now you know what it is like to be on the other side.
i do? seriously, i don't remember you posting at all nor do i care. maybe i'm condescending but i do this shit for a living so when i see people making stupid points its pretty irritating. example, this "video"

[Rawrr]

Better documentary:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1412442687111533561

[Rodeo]

i do? seriously, i don't remember you posting at all nor do i care. maybe i'm condescending but i do this shit for a living so when i see people making stupid points its pretty irritating. example, this "video"


I can understand that. Great you do it for a living. Congrats. Does that give your OPINION more authority over someone who has a different opinion? (goes back to that 'full-of-yourself' thing).

[loveisdead]

I can understand that. Great you do it for a living. Congrats. Does that give your OPINION more authority over someone who has a different opinion? (goes back to that 'full-of-yourself' thing).
I don't get it. I assume that you're a conservative. Fine. There are plenty of conservatives that are regulars in the politics forum. They've gotten and given out their fair share of shit.

[x togepi x]

Better documentary:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1412442687111533561

FUCK YES.

i do hope i'm not the only person who sat through that. my roommate's watching it as we speak. i hear large bouts of laughter coming from his room periodically.

[Rawrr]

FUCK YES.

i do hope i'm not the only person who sat through that. my roommate's watching it as we speak. i hear large bouts of laughter coming from his room periodically.
I'm kind of angry they're remaking it duder, I mean, won't be nearly as good as the original. Kind of like how they remade Last House On The Left, probably cut out 3/4 of that fuqqed up rape scene.

[Rodeo]

i sat through the doc. too.

[x togepi x]

I'm kind of angry they're remaking it duder, I mean, won't be nearly as good as the original. Kind of like how they remade Last House On The Left, probably cut out 3/4 of that fuqqed up rape scene.

i'm really pissed off about that.

what's worse is, i feel like I Spit On Your Grave/Last House On the Left, as remakes, are simply another form of torture porn taken to its most logical extent: obvious rape, instead of the terrifying quasi-feminist exploitation films the originals were.

[Rawrr]

of the terrifying quasi-feminist exploitation films the originals were.
This and the fact that I feel these films only really work best in the sort of 1970's explotation style that they were shot in.

[Rodeo]

I don't get it. I assume that you're a conservative. Fine. There are plenty of conservatives that are regulars in the politics forum. They've gotten and given out their fair share of shit.


I'm a hybrid between libertarian and anarchist.

[loveisdead]

I'm a hybrid between libertarian and anarchist.
Bill O'Reilly? My point is that people who don't agree with the majority still post there on a very regular basis, so I don't see why whatever interaction you had with Lauren would stop you from posting there. If you have something intelligent or thought provoking that belongs there, then go ahead and do so.

[Machu505]

Bill O'Reilly? My point is that people who don't agree with the majority still post there on a very regular basis, so I don't see why whatever interaction you had with Lauren would stop you from posting there. If you have something intelligent or thought provoking that belongs there, then go ahead and do so.

I lol'd.

[loveisdead]

I lol'd.
I do what I can.

[The Personist]

This thread got intense.

Also sat through the second documentary: amazing!

[secretemily]

I gave up after the burger king analogy.

[samsara]

Will not watch. I dont need another reason to doubt.

[x togepi x]

I gave up after the burger king analogy.

it was so hard for me to keep going after that.

[GuitarR0cker1]

kinda funny how nearly 99% of the people on here bitching about this movie aren't even the voting age yet. Not agreeing or disagreeing with the movie or it's contents... just a funny observation.
So people under the age of 18 aren't allowed to complain, protest and voice their opinion because they can't vote? Interesting...

[Rodeo]

So people under the age of 18 aren't allowed to complain, protest and voice their opinion because they can't vote? Interesting...


you're a piece of shit. stop reading into my posts and putting thing there that aren't there.

[shit stroll]

hahahaha rodeo bringing teh pwn.

[3eb23]

I just finished it. He makes vague points but they don't prove what he wants them to prove.

ex: one part he talks about how someone who's high up in the federal reserve was picked by obama to be high in the treasury. sounds scary unless you think "wait, that person is probably really qualified for the position he's in."

he also blames bush era policies, like the building of fema detention centers, on obama.

i'm not an obama fan really (or anyone in the US government) but this documentary plays on people's ignorance of specific organizations like the bilderberg group to show a conspiracy. i'm just not seeing it.

i thought the same thing when that part came up (i was like well he seems qualified), but i think his point was federal reserve= private bank. u.s. treasury= government. the guy working for the federal reserve and looking out for their interests is likely to do nothing but look after the interests of the fed reserve and carry out its agenda once he's in his new government (supposed to look out for the people of america) position.

Your 2nd point here i don't completely get...he did not blame obama for the bush era policies. he said obama is still carrying out some of bush's policies, but he didn't say the existence of these policies are obama's fault. how could they be? he didn't come up with them. but the agenda set by those with power during the bush era (most likely well before this in reality) is still in motion and he's helping carry it out. those with power don't come up with plans for the world and abandon them just because there's a new president (or burger king manager thanks krs one) in office.

btw there was some talk about future fema camps for us citizens in the early nineties, so that's not even a bush era thing conspiracy... well it's a 1st bush era thing.

it is definitely a probability that is alex is playing on people's ignorance of these subjects to advance his view, but at the same time, alex has always encouraged and continues to encourage people to do their own research and look into his statements to see if they have any truth. he does not have time in a two hour documentary to dissect the bilderberg group and what it means, when he's already addressed it in numerous films, so i don't blame him for not getting too into that here. at least it seems like to me that alex doesn't want people to be ignorant. to me i think he's genuinely after the truth and he's presenting some stuff to at least get people thinking.

[oldwirehands]

I watched maybe a half hour of this. I fell asleep. From what I remember, it made some good points and some vague ones. I pretty much hate Alex Jones though. He'll look anywhere for support. Like David Icke who really believes the world is ran by a shape-shifting reptilian race........

[x togepi x]

i thought the same thing when that part came up (i was like well he seems qualified), but i think his point was federal reserve= private bank. u.s. treasury= government. the guy working for the federal reserve and looking out for their interests is likely to do nothing but look after the interests of the fed reserve and carry out its agenda once he's in his new government (supposed to look out for the people of america) position.

I realize that the FR isn't in the Federal Government, but that doesn't prove anything. All Jones does in this point is say OOH THIS GUY WORKED IN THE FED, NOW HE'S WORKING IN THE TREASURY SCARY, but he doesn't show how this guy is working for Fed and protecting their agenda instead of the government's. Merely pointing out that certain people were a part of certain private organizations is not enough to prove that these private organizations are part of a giant conspiracy that controls the world.

Your 2nd point here i don't completely get...he did not blame obama for the bush era policies. he said obama is still carrying out some of bush's policies, but he didn't say the existence of these policies are obama's fault. how could they be? he didn't come up with them. but the agenda set by those with power during the bush era (most likely well before this in reality) is still in motion and he's helping carry it out. those with power don't come up with plans for the world and abandon them just because there's a new president (or burger king manager thanks krs one) in office.

btw there was some talk about future fema camps for us citizens in the early nineties, so that's not even a bush era thing conspiracy... well it's a 1st bush era thing.

He blamed Obama for continuing them. The problem here is that you cannot seriously expect Obama to overturn every single bad thing Bush did in the first 100 days of office when he has other things to be doing. But it's important to note: for a few minutes in this point, Jones harped on the fact that Obama promised to close gitmo, but then continued doing rendition on enemy combatants. Yeah, that happened up until last week when Obama announced no more enemy combatants, no more rendition. These things take time to resolve, you couldn't expect the government to just magically change overnight. it's especially hard to overturn them considering the secrecy of the past administration and the fact that the republicans would stone wall that.

nor do I hold the same Obama=messiah opinion that many people basically did. I thought he'd carry on certain Bush-era policies because he isn't really liberal. It's basically expected of him based on his position in the political spectrum. That doesn't mean, however, that he's a puppet of some shadow government.

it is definitely a probability that is alex is playing on people's ignorance of these subjects to advance his view, but at the same time, alex has always encouraged and continues to encourage people to do their own research and look into his statements to see if they have any truth. he does not have time in a two hour documentary to dissect the bilderberg group and what it means, when he's already addressed it in numerous films, so i don't blame him for not getting too into that here. at least it seems like to me that alex doesn't want people to be ignorant. to me i think he's genuinely after the truth and he's presenting some stuff to at least get people thinking.

I've watched plenty of Alex Jones documentaries because I sample a lot of the things he says that sound hilarious for my band, he always just goes OOH BILDERBERG GROUP SCARY, but doesn't give us any real information about them. All he can prove is that they're powerful and secretative. You can think they're powerful and secrative and not think they are out to rule the world. If Jones were the awesome journalist/documentary film maker that he acts like he is, his films would make stronger arguments than ones that appeal to ignorance. The idea that "we don't know what they're doing, so it must be ruling the world" is ridiculous.

i mean i believe banks/corporations have way too much power, but they're not a shadow government that is going to make a new world government. I mean, for one, most insanely capitalist people like globalization because it takes power away from specific governments and puts them back in the hands of corporations and secondly, a giant fascist world government is fairly impossible the way the world is right now. I'm not saying it can't happen, but i think there are insanely many factors like nationalism that would prevent it from occuring.

i also think it's funny that Alex Jones goes on and on about human rights when he's highly conservative and hates gay people, but that's just me.

[EyesOfMadness]

Alex Jones is a retard.

I'll still watch this though, for lols

[3eb23]

I watched maybe a half hour of this. I fell asleep. From what I remember, it made some good points and some vague ones. I pretty much hate Alex Jones though. He'll look anywhere for support. Like David Icke who really believes the world is ran by a shape-shifting reptilian race........

i can understand hate towards alex jones. along with all the info he gives to the public, he gives a lot of disinfo. on his radio show, while he has many useful things to say, he tends to run with things and draw some outrageous conclusions, while also seeming to make up stuff as he goes to help further his point. his personality and certain things he says can discredit those people who are truly knowledgable on the subjects and because of this, people don't take certain conspiracies seriously and write them off even when they are presented by a credible source. this is a shame really. however, i find comfort in the fact that alex's views spark a longing for truth and tend to encourage people to research.

as far as Alex looking to David Icke for support, it makes since. it's kind of the same situation how it discredits him because of some of icke's views, but alex should look to figures who will help get his point across. he wants to get his views to the masses and icke has a huge following, so that helps. David Icke is an incredibly intelligent man and no matter what his views on reptilians and greys and all that stuff, he has a stronger grasp on history and government than most people.

[zeropunk16]

It's about damn time.

[3eb23]

I realize that the FR isn't in the Federal Government, but that doesn't prove anything. All Jones does in this point is say OOH THIS GUY WORKED IN THE FED, NOW HE'S WORKING IN THE TREASURY SCARY, but he doesn't show how this guy is working for Fed and protecting their agenda instead of the government's. Merely pointing out that certain people were a part of certain private organizations is not enough to prove that these private organizations are part of a giant conspiracy that controls the world.



He blamed Obama for continuing them. The problem here is that you cannot seriously expect Obama to overturn every single bad thing Bush did in the first 100 days of office when he has other things to be doing. But it's important to note: for a few minutes in this point, Jones harped on the fact that Obama promised to close gitmo, but then continued doing rendition on enemy combatants. Yeah, that happened up until last week when Obama announced no more enemy combatants, no more rendition. These things take time to resolve, you couldn't expect the government to just magically change overnight. it's especially hard to overturn them considering the secrecy of the past administration and the fact that the republicans would stone wall that.

nor do I hold the same Obama=messiah opinion that many people basically did. I thought he'd carry on certain Bush-era policies because he isn't really liberal. It's basically expected of him based on his position in the political spectrum. That doesn't mean, however, that he's a puppet of some shadow government.



I've watched plenty of Alex Jones documentaries because I sample a lot of the things he says that sound hilarious for my band, he always just goes OOH BILDERBERG GROUP SCARY, but doesn't give us any real information about them. All he can prove is that they're powerful and secretative. You can think they're powerful and secrative and not think they are out to rule the world. If Jones were the awesome journalist/documentary film maker that he acts like he is, his films would make stronger arguments than ones that appeal to ignorance. The idea that "we don't know what they're doing, so it must be ruling the world" is ridiculous.

i mean i believe banks/corporations have way too much power, but they're not a shadow government that is going to make a new world government. I mean, for one, most insanely capitalist people like globalization because it takes power away from specific governments and puts them back in the hands of corporations and secondly, a giant fascist world government is fairly impossible the way the world is right now. I'm not saying it can't happen, but i think there are insanely many factors like nationalism that would prevent it from occuring.

i also think it's funny that Alex Jones goes on and on about human rights when he's highly conservative and hates gay people, but that's just me.

how is he supposed to show that this guy is protecting the interests of the fed reserve? he hasn't been in his new position long. time will only tell. however, since we were told about this connection beforehand we can see for ourselves if what he assumes will happen will truly unfold. nothing wrong with that. it is an assumption based on what he feels is a sketchy transition.

and of course all he can prove is that bilderbergers are powerful and secretive. it's because they are so powerful and secretive that he can't know exactly what they are planning. he makes assumptions, which is all you can do. the assumption that "we don't know what they're doing, so it must be ruling the world" is not ridiculous at all. the secretive activity means that the people are getting no say. how is that good? we are not disclosed the information, which is a slap in the face to America. they aren't having meetings with major players in the world just to chat about what they did on the weekend. they are doing something big and important that affects all of us without letting anyone know about it. to assume that people with such huge positions and influence are not trying to plan out the world the way they see fit is absurd.

for the record, i don't accept the information in these documentaries as 100% fact. the real fact is we don't really know what's going on. look, we could sit down and dissect every part of every alex jones documentary and find a lot of holes and wrong information. but we could do that with the news every single day. this is all just information. it would be ignorant of anyone to accept all that he says as truth, yet people do this with most news they hear. i believe the good that comes out of these films though is that they encourage people to seek truth and knowledge and not accept everything they hear. people have to form conclusions on their own and figure out what they believe is the truth in the end.

[GuitarR0cker1]

you're a piece of shit. stop reading into my posts and putting thing there that aren't there.
Oh this guy is edgy, he called me a piece of shit. Really though if you do think there is nothing wrong with people under the age of 18 posting about politics, why the hell did you post that? It seems like a waste of time to me.

[Rodeo]

Oh this guy is edgy, he called me a piece of shit. Really though if you do think there is nothing wrong with people under the age of 18 posting about politics, why the hell did you post that? It seems like a waste of time to me.

Seems like a waste of time to give this late pass a response, but I'm doing that too.

[x togepi x]

how is he supposed to show that this guy is protecting the interests of the fed reserve? he hasn't been in his new position long. time will only tell. however, since we were told about this connection beforehand we can see for ourselves if what he assumes will happen will truly unfold. nothing wrong with that. it is an assumption based on what he feels is a sketchy transition.

this isn't a sketchy transition at all unless you start off with the assumption that it's sketchy. That's the problem, he already starts with the conclusion of conspiracy and twists basic facts around to fit within it. Just because someone worked in the fed doesn't mean they're going to use the treasury to destroy our economy.

example: say I had an executive position at apple, but I quit for an executive position at microsoft. That doesn't mean that I'm a puppet of apple that's going to dominate microsoft or make them crash. it just means i know a lot about the computer industry so i'm qualified.

and of course all he can prove is that bilderbergers are powerful and secretive. it's because they are so powerful and secretive that he can't know exactly what they are planning. he makes assumptions, which is all you can do

this is circular logic: they're too secret for us to know what they're doing, he makes assumptions, you make assumptions therefore his assumptions are as valid as yours. That isn't a logical argument, and even if we take it on face, it doesn't prove anything. at best, all we can prove is we don't know what's going on there. should we know? sure.

the assumption that "we don't know what they're doing, so it must be ruling the world" is not ridiculous at all.

it's ridiculous because secrecy =/= nefarious plans. the general manager of the st. louis cardinals is known for his secrecy in negotiating for free agents/trades, but he's not out to destroy baseball as a whole. KFC is secretative about their recipe for chicken, but that doesn't mean they're out to destroy the fastfood industry.

Once again, the only way you can jump to this assumption that they're out to rule the world from their secrecy is if you start out from that assumption.

the secretive activity means that the people are getting no say. how is that good? we are not disclosed the information, which is a slap in the face to America.

i never said it was good, rather that the fact that it's secret doesn't prove that there's a conspiracy that means obama isn't the head of our government but is actually a puppet.

they aren't having meetings with major players in the world just to chat about what they did on the weekend. they are doing something big and important that affects all of us without letting anyone know about it. to assume that people with such huge positions and influence are not trying to plan out the world the way they see fit is absurd.

This assumes that everyone in the meetings are on the same page, which may not be the case. We can't just assume all these powerful people agree on 'how to plan out the world the way they see fit". it could very well be the case that there's a lot of internal debate and no policy even gets formed. you're equating secrecy with effectiveness here. That doesn't work out. Nobody is claiming they have no influence on the government, I just think it's a big jump to say they're a shadow government that is trying to dominate the world.

besides, with secrecy, i can go the other route and say the bildenburg group is actually a bunch of really nice and powerful people who are trying to save the world but it has to remain a secret because bad people will stop them if they knew. can i prove that? no, but you can't prove your claim either. that's my entire point. it's intellectually dishonest to make a documentary slamming obama as a puppet when you can't prove said claims.

for the record, i don't accept the information in these documentaries as 100% fact. the real fact is we don't really know what's going on. look, we could sit down and dissect every part of every alex jones documentary and find a lot of holes and wrong information. but we could do that with the news every single day. this is all just information. it would be ignorant of anyone to accept all that he says as truth, yet people do this with most news they hear. i believe the good that comes out of these films though is that they encourage people to seek truth and knowledge and not accept everything they hear. people have to form conclusions on their own and figure out what they believe is the truth in the end.

I don't need a shitty documentary that plays into people's ignorance to know any of the things you just said.

[GuitarR0cker1]

Seems like a waste of time to give this late pass a response, but I'm doing that too.
Oh man I just got br00tally owned by this post. It wasn't as if you couldn't just given me a real response, instead of coming up with this.

[Rodeo]

Oh man I just got br00tally owned by this post. It wasn't as if you couldn't just given me a real response, instead of coming up with this.

A 'real' response to your own sarcastic rhetorical statement? Hmmm...

[3eb23]

this isn't a sketchy transition at all unless you start off with the assumption that it's sketchy. That's the problem, he already starts with the conclusion of conspiracy and twists basic facts around to fit within it. Just because someone worked in the fed doesn't mean they're going to use the treasury to destroy our economy.

example: say I had an executive position at apple, but I quit for an executive position at microsoft. That doesn't mean that I'm a puppet of apple that's going to dominate microsoft or make them crash. it just means i know a lot about the computer industry so i'm qualified.



this is circular logic: they're too secret for us to know what they're doing, he makes assumptions, you make assumptions therefore his assumptions are as valid as yours. That isn't a logical argument, and even if we take it on face, it doesn't prove anything. at best, all we can prove is we don't know what's going on there. should we know? sure.



it's ridiculous because secrecy =/= nefarious plans. the general manager of the st. louis cardinals is known for his secrecy in negotiating for free agents/trades, but he's not out to destroy baseball as a whole. KFC is secretative about their recipe for chicken, but that doesn't mean they're out to destroy the fastfood industry.

Once again, the only way you can jump to this assumption that they're out to rule the world from their secrecy is if you start out from that assumption.



i never said it was good, rather that the fact that it's secret doesn't prove that there's a conspiracy that means obama isn't the head of our government but is actually a puppet.



This assumes that everyone in the meetings are on the same page, which may not be the case. We can't just assume all these powerful people agree on 'how to plan out the world the way they see fit". it could very well be the case that there's a lot of internal debate and no policy even gets formed. you're equating secrecy with effectiveness here. That doesn't work out. Nobody is claiming they have no influence on the government, I just think it's a big jump to say they're a shadow government that is trying to dominate the world.

besides, with secrecy, i can go the other route and say the bildenburg group is actually a bunch of really nice and powerful people who are trying to save the world but it has to remain a secret because bad people will stop them if they knew. can i prove that? no, but you can't prove your claim either. that's my entire point. it's intellectually dishonest to make a documentary slamming obama as a puppet when you can't prove said claims.



I don't need a shitty documentary that plays into people's ignorance to know any of the things you just said.

Of course he started with the assumption that it's sketchy that’s his whole point for putting it in the film. There’s nothing wrong with that he is trying to show you his beliefs and conclusions in his movie.

Apple is not a private bank that issues currency to microsoft, so that example is irrelevant.

And yes it is an assumption. i said it was. this is his assumption for what this means and it is mine. if we can't assume anything then what are we allowed to do? Just sit there and form no opinion whatsoever and say oh well I don’t know what’s going on and I’m not going to make any attempt to? If you say we can only assume what is set in stone as fact, then I’m afraid we can’t assume much about anything.

The baseball and kfc analogies are weak. they don’t work here

I assume they are all working together. this is what i believe. You don’t think so. That’s fine. I’m sure a lot of policy doesn’t get formed at each meeting and they have a lot of internal debate. But I definitely think the point of the meetings is to form policy. That’s what’s wrong. Forming policy in secret like this is wrong.

Obama is a puppet. that is my view. i also believe the president would have been a puppet even if it weren’t obama.

I don't care if you need a shitty documentary. but tons of people need shitty documentaries to even hear another side to anything. it's a quick way to introduce alternative forms of looking at situations. films are easy and spark thoughts quickly. it's not like most people these days get introduced to things like the bilderberg group because they happen to be in a bookstore and decide to pick up a copy of behold a pale horse because the cover looked cool. if it weren't for shitty documentaries a lot of people wouldn't even look into these topics because they have historically stayed out of mainstream media.

Btw I have no clue how to split up these quotes i know this looks ridiculous. If someone could teach me that would be awesome.

[Praetor]

Of course he started with the assumption that it's sketchy that’s his whole point for putting it in the film. There’s nothing wrong with that he is trying to show you his beliefs and conclusions in his movie.

Apple is not a private bank that issues currency to microsoft, so that example is irrelevant.

And yes it is an assumption. i said it was. this is his assumption for what this means and it is mine. if we can't assume anything then what are we allowed to do? Just sit there and form no opinion whatsoever and say oh well I don’t know what’s going on and I’m not going to make any attempt to? If you say we can only assume what is set in stone as fact, then I’m afraid we can’t assume much about anything.

The baseball and kfc analogies are weak. they don’t work here

I assume they are all working together. this is what i believe. You don’t think so. That’s fine. I’m sure a lot of policy doesn’t get formed at each meeting and they have a lot of internal debate. But I definitely think the point of the meetings is to form policy. That’s what’s wrong. Forming policy in secret like this is wrong.

Obama is a puppet. that is my view. i also believe the president would have been a puppet even if it weren’t obama.

I don't care if you need a shitty documentary. but tons of people need shitty documentaries to even hear another side to anything. it's a quick way to introduce alternative forms of looking at situations. films are easy and spark thoughts quickly. it's not like most people these days get introduced to things like the bilderberg group because they happen to be in a bookstore and decide to pick up a copy of behold a pale horse because the cover looked cool. if it weren't for shitty documentaries a lot of people wouldn't even look into these topics because they have historically stayed out of mainstream media.

Btw I have no clue how to split up these quotes i know this looks ridiculous. If someone could teach me that would be awesome.
Like this:

text blah blah blah

more text blah blah blah

[Burn That Shit]

This thread:
"Blah blah blah this video sucks blah blah blah"
"Did you even watch the video, or consider what was presented?"
"No!!! Shut up dummy!"

[nitrovengeance]

this shit is true. it has nothing to do with obama. this shit has been going on for 60+ years. the only goal is to keep the public complacent and distracted. they are all friendly behind the scenes. freedom is a joke.

[nitrovengeance]

watch this entire thing if you want to give an opinion on it.

[drewziph]

this shit is true. it has nothing to do with obama. this shit has been going on for 60+ years. the only goal is to keep the public complacent and distracted. they are all friendly behind the scenes. freedom is a joke.
lol.

[nitrovengeance]

lol.

hey genius did you even watch the video?

[x togepi x]

Of course he started with the assumption that it's sketchy that’s his whole point for putting it in the film. There’s nothing wrong with that he is trying to show you his beliefs and conclusions in his movie.

awesome! more circular logic. my point is: these things only look nefarious when you start out at the position that they're nefarious.

Apple is not a private bank that issues currency to microsoft, so that example is irrelevant.

It's called an analogy. Obviously they're not "the same" but I was just proving that it is possible to work at one place and get a job at a second without being a puppet of the first.

And yes it is an assumption. i said it was. this is his assumption for what this means and it is mine. if we can't assume anything then what are we allowed to do? Just sit there and form no opinion whatsoever and say oh well I don’t know what’s going on and I’m not going to make any attempt to? If you say we can only assume what is set in stone as fact, then I’m afraid we can’t assume much about anything.

You can assume all you want, but if you're going to make a documentary claiming that there's a shadow government trying to create a fascist world government and our president is the puppet of it, you need to have some better have some kind of argument to back it up. The problem with going just based on assumptions is you can assume anything about anything.

The baseball and kfc analogies are weak. they don’t work here

I like how you hold me to strict standards of logic when it comes to my analogies, but you're willing to let Jones rant and rave that Obama is the figurehead of a shadow government. hahaha

but seriously, let's drop the analogy and go with the point behind it: just because something is secret doesn't mean it's nefarious.

I assume they are all working together. this is what i believe. You don’t think so. That’s fine. I’m sure a lot of policy doesn’t get formed at each meeting and they have a lot of internal debate. But I definitely think the point of the meetings is to form policy. That’s what’s wrong. Forming policy in secret like this is wrong.

But you have absolutely, positively no evidence or reasoning to back this up other than an opinion. That is not what documentaries are about. You need to be able to prove your assertions, not just make them.

otherwise, what's to stop me from making a documentary claiming Obama is going to cure every disease ever? I don't have proof, but hey, that's just my opinion man.

Obama is a puppet. that is my view. i also believe the president would have been a puppet even if it weren’t obama.

but you have no logical reason for thinking this.

I don't care if you need a shitty documentary. but tons of people need shitty documentaries to even hear another side to anything.

there are plenty of other, anti-authoritarian perspectives that are based on evidence. This perspective is just OMG CONSPIRACY LOOK SCARY TALKING AND MUSIC. nothing gets proved.

it's a quick way to introduce alternative forms of looking at situations. films are easy and spark thoughts quickly. it's not like most people these days get introduced to things like the bilderberg group because they happen to be in a bookstore and decide to pick up a copy of behold a pale horse because the cover looked cool. if it weren't for shitty documentaries a lot of people wouldn't even look into these topics because they have historically stayed out of mainstream media.

documentaries are awesome when they provide some sort of information about the subjects they cover, but this one doesn't. it plays into the ignorance of people to make things look scary. there are plenty of fucked up things really happening in the world by organizations that aren't secretive, but let's ignore this because OOH SHADOW GOVERNMENT. SCARY SCARY SCARY

[Burn That Shit]

Things that scare the shit out of you to make you believe things:
Zeitgeist
Loose Change
This Movie
Fox News

Things that are great:
Space Jam

[TEAMRAMROD]

Space Jam really is great.

[Justin_stacy]

Space Jam really is great.

I heard it was based on true events...

[TEAMRAMROD]

I heard it was based on true events...

No way. :jawdrop:

[nitrovengeance]

people need to stop joking and poking fun at things that they don't even want to consider. the thing is, all of the legislation addressed here is real. it then moves to theorize what it all means. the bottom line is, the federal reserve is a privately owned back, not answerable to congress or anyone else for that matter. there is extreme conflict of interest within the administration, and all of the shadyness portrayed in the film about the stimulus is real. the trillions of dollars that disappeared from the fed is real. the buying up of banks by the fed is real. you need to watch this film, sit and research on the side while doing so, and form your own opinion about the danger. checks and balances must be instated within the financial system to ensure that these levels of corruption do not occur if they are not already occuring. the whole idea of the constitution is prevention. prevention of opression, and the preservation of a free society. keep your eyes and ears and (when neccessary) mouths open. regardless of the attacks on the documentary and its theories, the danger is real and right in front of all of your faces.

[nitrovengeance]

Things that scare the shit out of you to make you believe things:
Zeitgeist
Loose Change
This Movie
Fox News

Things that are great:
Space Jam


read what the billboards say, go and play, go and play, forget about the movement.

[zion the lion]

people need to stop joking and poking fun at things that they don't even want to consider. the thing is, all of the legislation addressed here is real. it then moves to theorize what it all means. the bottom line is, the federal reserve is a privately owned back, not answerable to congress or anyone else for that matter. there is extreme conflict of interest within the administration, and all of the shadyness portrayed in the film about the stimulus is real. the trillions of dollars that disappeared from the fed is real. the buying up of banks by the fed is real. you need to watch this film, sit and research on the side while doing so, and form your own opinion about the danger. checks and balances must be instated within the financial system to ensure that these levels of corruption do not occur if they are not already occuring. the whole idea of the constitution is prevention. prevention of opression, and the preservation of a free society. keep your eyes and ears and (when neccessary) mouths open. regardless of the attacks on the documentary and its theories, the danger is real and right in front of all of your faces.

And we have our conspiracy theorist!!!! Ok listen if youre going to complain about how we're ignoring the constitution now you might as well complain about how the 4th amendment right was taken away with the patriot act and how the government let racial profiling slide eventhough it is illegal. Both of which took away our basic freedom of privacy. I dont really care about money, I live below the poverty line but those who actually believe in all of that shit need to realize that its not going.

[Burn That Shit]

read what the billboards say, go and play, go and play, forget about the movement.

What? Haha.

[nitrovengeance]

And we have our conspiracy theorist!!!! Ok listen if youre going to complain about how we're ignoring the constitution now you might as well complain about how the 4th amendment right was taken away with the patriot act and how the government let racial profiling slide eventhough it is illegal. Both of which took away our basic freedom of privacy. I dont really care about money, I live below the poverty line but those who actually believe in all of that shit need to realize that its not going.

I am. I am not a conspiracy theorist as a matter of fact i thought loose change was bullshit. but i've been noticing things by doing my own research in the past few years. my point was, that fact vs theory is pretty clear in the documentary, and fact was the scariest part. by what you said, i can tell you haven't watched it, so... shut up or watch and discuss.

[nitrovengeance]

What? Haha.

why don't you go look it up there chief, if you don't know that lyric you don't deserve to listen to music, let alone post on a punk site. but lets not get off topic.

[Burn That Shit]

Yeah I don't deserve to listen to music nor post here because I don't recognize some obscure lyrics. I google'd them and that didn't even return anything.

[nitrovengeance]

Yeah I don't deserve to listen to music nor post here because I don't recognize some obscure lyrics. I google'd them and that didn't even return anything.


damn, "freedom" by rage against the machine is pretty obscure.

it's come and play, ya ween

[Justin_stacy]

No way. :jawdrop:

hell by todays standards we can probably call it a documentary.;-)

[TEAMRAMROD]

I'm on board.

[zion the lion]

I am. I am not a conspiracy theorist as a matter of fact i thought loose change was bullshit. but i've been noticing things by doing my own research in the past few years. my point was, that fact vs theory is pretty clear in the documentary, and fact was the scariest part. by what you said, i can tell you haven't watched it, so... shut up or watch and discuss.

I got 3 minutes into it before I realized its bullshit. I was actually replying to what you were saying about our constitution and about the banks. But lol at the description.

[Justin_stacy]

History according to Looney Toons....beautiful.


Sad that's its not that far off from the truth.

[TEAMRAMROD]

I'd buy the t-shirt.

[nitrovengeance]

so in all this debate has anyone even mentioned the federal reserve?

its just like any comments section, 90 percent saying "derr this is probably bs" who don't even watch and just flame other ppl for talking about it, 9 percent idiots who buy eveything as fact, and i'd say 1 percent who actually try and research to make an informed decision.


weiners.

[TEAMRAMROD]

Total wieners.

[nitrovengeance]

I got 3 minutes into it before I realized its bullshit. I was actually replying to what you were saying about our constitution and about the banks. But lol at the description.

to be honest i thought the exact same at 3 minutes. humor me. i dare you.

separate their theories from the legislation they describe, and decide for yourself. i personally don't believe their entire theory, but i recognize the danger posed by this string of legislation. watch.

otherwise even talking about it is a waste of time

[zion the lion]

to be honest i thought the exact same at 3 minutes. humor me. i dare you.

separate their theories from the legislation they describe, and decide for yourself. i personally don't believe their entire theory, but i recognize the danger posed by this string of legislation. watch.

otherwise even talking about it is a waste of time

My computer wont even let it load past the 4th minute, so maybe tomorrow.

[Justin_stacy]

Hey man we're trying to have a serious talk about Looney Toon's and you keep butting in....

[TEAMRAMROD]

For real.

[zion the lion]

Hey man we're trying to have a serious talk about Looney Toon's and you keep butting in....

Me? Sorry

[nitrovengeance]

just because this is you guys' daily lives to sit on this forum and heckle people doesn't mean you have to be a douche when someone wants to have a legitimate discussion about the topic.

and zion, i really went into it as a harsh skeptic, but from hoover's speech onward, i was intrigued into watching the whole thing.

[TEAMRAMROD]

Daily lives? Really? You don't know the half of it.

[nitrovengeance]

i dont doubt it. enjoy your complacence. while it lasts

[zion the lion]

just because this is you guys' daily lives to sit on this forum and heckle people doesn't mean you have to be a douche when someone wants to have a legitimate discussion about the topic.

and zion, i really went into it as a harsh skeptic, but from hoover's speech onward, i was intrigued into watching the whole thing.

2 hours is almost too long though. When does it get real good?

[nitrovengeance]

2 hours is almost too long though. When does it get real good?

it's tough to say it had its ups and downs. hoover makes a speech about the federal reserve and it gets good there for a while. it has another up toward the end once it goes back to talking about the banks.

[TEAMRAMROD]

i dont doubt it. enjoy your complacence. while it lasts

Where did you gather that I was complacent with anything?

[Burn That Shit]

http://www.soleredemption.com/pics/2006/04/MikeSpaceJam.jpg

[nitrovengeance]

Where did you gather that I was complacent with anything?

i gathered when you decided you'd rather sit there being a douche than have a debate on the subject of the post. don't really want to hear your bs rationalizations.

and burn, i'm glad you ignored the bit about rage, wouldn't want to stain the cred you're trying to establish with your shape of punk to come album cover

[TEAMRAMROD]

http://www.soleredemption.com/pics/2006/04/MikeSpaceJam.jpg

Make that into a shirt and I'll buy the first one. Or two.

[Burn That Shit]

How am I trying to establish cred with a band that's not even underground hahahaha, dudes had videos playing on MTV and Fuse. You're fucking retarded. They've had songs in Tony Hawk games, am I going to establish cred with the 14-16 year old xbox crowd?

[TEAMRAMROD]

i gathered when you decided you'd rather sit there being a douche than have a debate on the subject of the post. don't really want to hear your bs rationalizations.


I haven't rationalized anything because there's been nothing to be rationalized.

[nitrovengeance]

How am I trying to establish cred with a band that's not even underground hahahaha, dudes had videos playing on MTV and Fuse. You're fucking retarded.

yeah 10 fucking years ago. claiming refused is like claiming botch, both bands are good, but you can always tell (when people talk about music) when someone is saying something just for cred, and i deal with that bullshit constantly.

and you aren't neccessarily, i just think you're kindof a tool at this point so i was being a dick.


sssssssoooooooooo go listen to some rage and practice up on those obscure lyrics
or maybe watch the doc this thread is about, then maybe you'd say something that wasn't just a complete waste of time. doubtful, though

[nitrovengeance]

I haven't rationalized anything because there's been nothing to be rationalized.

derr i meant rationalizing sitting on here being a tool and heckling those who wish to have a legitimate discussion.

so i'm glad you have no desire to rationalize that.

[Burn That Shit]

Rage aren't punk enough for me. You have to be homeless for at least 6 months or I won't listen to your band. House rule.

[TEAMRAMROD]

derr i meant rationalizing sitting on here being a tool and heckling those who wish to have a legitimate discussion.

so i'm glad you have no desire to rationalize that.

I've yet to heckle in this thread. Maybe check for facts before making an accusation?

[nitrovengeance]

Rage aren't punk enough for me. You have to be homeless for at least 6 months or I won't listen to your band. House rule.
maybe you're just not punk enough for them. pretty surprising that you'd be so into refused considering their political ideology. you'd think you'd want to maybe try and talk about some facts or legislation detailed in this doc instead of just wasting everyone's time being a donald duck posting dick. capitalism is indeed organized crime.

[nitrovengeance]

I've yet to heckle in this thread. Maybe check for facts before making an accusation?
lets get caught up on semantics! i suppose i should have said wasting everyone's time with bs posts that are irrelevant

[Burn That Shit]

I'll watch the video tommorow and then we can have our intellectual masturbation cycle. Until then, you get Donald Duck.

[TEAMRAMROD]

lets get caught up on semantics! i suppose i should have said wasting everyone's time with bs posts that are irrelevant

Those are two different statements, so yes.

[Duexy]

And this 18 year old.


as well as this 20 year old

[Duexy]

you're a piece of shit. .


because he's 14, right?

[x togepi x]

people need to stop joking and poking fun at things that they don't even want to consider. the thing is, all of the legislation addressed here is real. it then moves to theorize what it all means. the bottom line is, the federal reserve is a privately owned back, not answerable to congress or anyone else for that matter. there is extreme conflict of interest within the administration, and all of the shadyness portrayed in the film about the stimulus is real. the trillions of dollars that disappeared from the fed is real. the buying up of banks by the fed is real. you need to watch this film, sit and research on the side while doing so, and form your own opinion about the danger. checks and balances must be instated within the financial system to ensure that these levels of corruption do not occur if they are not already occuring. the whole idea of the constitution is prevention. prevention of opression, and the preservation of a free society. keep your eyes and ears and (when neccessary) mouths open. regardless of the attacks on the documentary and its theories, the danger is real and right in front of all of your faces.

the problems with the fed, which are really real and obviously verifiable in the real world are not analogous to what Jones speaks of: the conspiracy of a bunch of shadow groups trying to set up a world government with Obama as a puppet. By equating the two, people like Jones are only making it that much harder to get public support for reforming our financial system.

[nitrovengeance]

the problems with the fed, which are really real and obviously verifiable in the real world are not analogous to what Jones speaks of: the conspiracy of a bunch of shadow groups trying to set up a world government with Obama as a puppet. By equating the two, people like Jones are only making it that much harder to get public support for reforming our financial system.

I would tend to agree partially, but I wouldn't say the federal reserve doesn't have misplaced power over us policy. If he wants to refer to the bilderberg group as a shadow government, that's fine, but they do meet in secret, and discuss world policy. which is technically not legal. the potential is there for abuse, and the fed has almost unlimited power since the stimulus bill was signed. if the fed succeeds in buying up all these smaller banks and establishing a world bank that all countries associated would pay tax to, it is a slippery slope to world government and new world order, whether it will be as oppressive as the doc would suggest or not.

[nitrovengeance]

"After Wilson was out of office, the New York Federal Reserve Bank got absolute control, just like they tried to do while I was President of the United Stats and didn't have a chance to do. Now they've got control again, and somebody's got to wake up to the fact that the control of the finances of the country must be in the hands of the people and the Congress of the United States, and the President, if he wants to exercise that control."

-President Harry Truman

A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the Nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men * * *. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world.

-Woodrow Wilson

"That in pursuance of that plan they devised a plan for the formation of so-called citizens’ and other leagues to educate the public in their way of thinking, and that the final outcome of the campaign they started was that they secured the Federal reserve act, now in incubation. That that plan was drafted in Wall Street for Wall Street greed by Paul M. Warburg in about 1902 and placed in cold storage till just before the panic of 1907; but even then its real purpose was disclosed only to those in the secret.
"I shall show that all along, from 1906 to the present time, the Money Trust forces have adroitly managed the campaign for the building up of this Federal Reserve act and putting it into operation, and it will appear that the President selected for the Federal Reserve Board members who have been schooled in the Money Trust system and that a majority of them are pupils of that system."

-Minnesota Republican Congressman Charles August Lindbergh

"It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."

-Henry Ford

If they controlled things that long ago, according to US PRESIDENTS, what makes you think they dont have vastly more influence now?

[x togepi x]

I would tend to agree partially, but I wouldn't say the federal reserve doesn't have misplaced power over us policy. If he wants to refer to the bilderberg group as a shadow government, that's fine, but they do meet in secret, and discuss world policy. which is technically not legal. the potential is there for abuse, and the fed has almost unlimited power since the stimulus bill was signed. if the fed succeeds in buying up all these smaller banks and establishing a world bank that all countries associated would pay tax to, it is a slippery slope to world government and new world order, whether it will be as oppressive as the doc would suggest or not.

I never claimed the fed doesn't have misplaced power over US policy. I said it wasn't part of a worldwide shadow government conspiracy. There's a huge difference.

[nitrovengeance]

I never claimed the fed doesn't have misplaced power over US policy. I said it wasn't part of a worldwide shadow government conspiracy. There's a huge difference.

what makes you think they wouldnt expand over the past 80 years to attempting to control world economics? this world bank proposal is real. look into it. regardless of whether they call it a world government, if formerly soverign nations are paying taxes to a world bank, thats what it fuckin is.


read the quotes i posted

[princesschad]

lolobama

[nitrovengeance]

"After Wilson was out of office, the New York Federal Reserve Bank got absolute control, just like they tried to do while I was President of the United Stats and didn't have a chance to do. Now they've got control again, and somebody's got to wake up to the fact that the control of the finances of the country must be in the hands of the people and the Congress of the United States, and the President, if he wants to exercise that control."

-President Harry Truman

A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the Nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men * * *. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world.

-Woodrow Wilson

"That in pursuance of that plan they devised a plan for the formation of so-called citizens’ and other leagues to educate the public in their way of thinking, and that the final outcome of the campaign they started was that they secured the Federal reserve act, now in incubation. That that plan was drafted in Wall Street for Wall Street greed by Paul M. Warburg in about 1902 and placed in cold storage till just before the panic of 1907; but even then its real purpose was disclosed only to those in the secret.
"I shall show that all along, from 1906 to the present time, the Money Trust forces have adroitly managed the campaign for the building up of this Federal Reserve act and putting it into operation, and it will appear that the President selected for the Federal Reserve Board members who have been schooled in the Money Trust system and that a majority of them are pupils of that system."

-Minnesota Republican Congressman Charles August Lindbergh

"It is well that the people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."

-Henry Ford

If they controlled things that long ago, according to US PRESIDENTS, what makes you think they dont have vastly more influence now?

[blindrider529]

sure did. thanks captain grammar.

I think you mean "Captain Spelling" or "Captain Correct Homonym Usage"


:-D

[rickmo]

Joe Rogen, Jesse Venture, KRS-1....very credible. Of course none really seems to be addressing Obama directly. Seems like someone just pieced together a bunch of videos and added a scary voiceover.


its not an atack on Obama as an individual moreso showing hes a figurehead just like every president since JFK, how does he just pull this stuff out of the air??

it covers a lot of relevant material

[rickmo]

Oh this guy is edgy, he called me a piece of shit. Really though if you do think there is nothing wrong with people under the age of 18 posting about politics, why the hell did you post that? It seems like a waste of time to me.


Its just that they take things at face-value, they take mostly from whats on TV and from their parents, we all did at one point

[lfdfforever]

fun fun

[lfdfforever]

3 months of mandatory basic training? fuck that.

[Duexy]

3 months of mandatory basic training? fuck that.


are you referring to the marine corps?

[lfdfforever]

are you referring to the marine corps? no. Rahm Emanuel said it's for civilians. ages 18-25. it's in the video, just skip to 1hour and 29 minutes in.

(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/27/obamas-chief-of-staff-rah_n_138240.html)

[zion the lion]

no. Rahm Emanuel said it's for civilians. ages 18-25. it's in the video, just skip to 1hour and 29 minutes in.

(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/27/obamas-chief-of-staff-rah_n_138240.html)

They do that in Israel, and in plenty of other countries, I dont see the problem with it.

[lfdfforever]

They do that in Israel, and in plenty of other countries, I dont see the problem with it. i'm not going to do it

[zion the lion]

i'm not going to do it

What makes you think that it will even happen? In the off chance that they actually do this, its going to be a while before its taken into effect, so you have plenty of time to move to another country until you pass the age limit. But still I think its a good idea.

[MyNameIsRoss]

Alex Jones is very........misguided.

That Bilderberg Group shit freaks me out though.

[physcosick]

I think misguided isn't the right word to use... perhaps extreme? He certainly has good intentions but his emotion kind of scares people away and forces people to assume stereotypes.

[3eb23]

http://www.infowars.com/house-passes-mandatory-national-service-bill/

[physcosick]

good god... I'm gonna have to read that bill at some point.

[lfdfforever]

http://www.infowars.com/house-passes-mandatory-national-service-bill/ oh fuck

[x togepi x]

there is no way that bill will pass the senate, and even then, so fucking what? all that bill does is determine whether the fucking program can be actually be successfully made (which it can't for about a million reasons). you guys should care more about whether the PATRIOT act will be renewed than this shit.

besides, if you read a real news source that isn't bullshit (sorry wacko infowars), you'd see all these bills really do is give more funding and incentives to things like Americorps. One of my best friends volunteers in Americorps and she told me it is a shitty experience solely because the organization is so underfunded that in many situations, it becomes functionally useless (though many situations are the opposite, it just depends on where your team is sent). That is a good thing.

and it's a good thing for government incentives like financial aid to get people to volunteer.

This is not a bill that makes a government army like that crazy asshole Alex Jones is.

Seriously guys, if you want to get all riled up about government control and issues of power awesome! but let's so it about something that's real, like major corporations and their roles in globalization or neoliberalism's power over the developing world. There's too much fucked up stuff actually happening to waste our time with asinine conspiracy theories.

[physcosick]

That is a good thing.Yeah because spending more money is exactly the type of thing they need to be doing right now...


and it's a good thing for government incentives like financial aid to get people to volunteer. Your wrong two fold here:
1. The government should never be allowed to force someone to do anything like "volunteer"
2. The thing about modern day volunteering and community service is your ability to better yourself. One of the reasons why I got money to finish high school and got into college was for my service at the local Boys and Girls Clubs and soup kitchens, etc. It was a great thing to put on applications for summer jobs, too. What I did isn't special and it's not restricted to the upper middle class. Anyone has the opportunity to volunteer for whatever. There is a very significant benefit to those who do. Some choose not to and that's fine but those who do can bring in some benefit beyond any psychological positivity. You can tell young people "hey, you should volunteer because its good for applications and it'll help you with blahblahblah" this is fine... but to say everyone has to volunteer, diminishes incentive for people to do it. "Oh you volunteered for 6 months when you were 18? So did the other 20,000 kids that just applied..." People should volunteer but they should do it because it's a good thing for them to do and those who do it should get benefited over those who choose not to... getting a regular, good night sleep helps most people's productivity during the day... do you want to make it mandatory that everyone gets 7-10 hours of sleep a day? What else?


This is not a bill that makes a government army like that crazy asshole Alex Jones is.It doesn't matter if it makes a civilian army or not. The fact that it gives the power to the government to allow mandatory service to american citizens is rediculous. I don't care if the bill requires me to get up from my desk right now and walk into the other room and walk back to my desk, they can not and should never be allowed to tell me to do anything unless I'm trampling over someone else's rights.

There's too much fucked up stuff actually happening to waste our time with asinine conspiracy theories.How's this a conspiracy theory? The bill exists and it was passed and they are going to try do this. Yeah there is a lot of messed up stuff going on but eventually you have to stop saying "oh whatever, this bill doesn't do this or that it only gives the government more power blahblahblah" and start getting mad and start doing something. But if your going to do something, do it because you're a free thinking individual and you have some common sense, don't do it because some guy is making you.

[x togepi x]

Yeah because spending more money is exactly the type of thing they need to be doing right now...

Well considering the fact that these organizations save money over all while getting people to work that's fairly crucial to survival in the areas they're in, I'd say spending money is exactly what we need. Do you have any idea what Americorps does?

Example: one major thing they do is disaster relief. A lot of people are up north right now sand bagging and dealing with the floods on the Missouri River. They'll also be cleaning up the aftermath. Do you know how much that would cost if we hired private firms to do that work? Tons more. This work has to be done. We can't just leave the flooded areas as disaster areas.

Properly funded government volunteer programs like Americorps save us money, give job training to their volunteers so that when they decide to stop volunteering, they can get a career in many different fields. I'm pretty sure people like that are actually great for our economy. but what do i know, i don't buy into stupid conspiracy theories.

Your wrong two fold here:
1. The government should never be allowed to force someone to do anything like "volunteer"

I'm not wrong at all since the bill itself doesn't force anyone to do anything. Seriously. read them. they just properly fund Americorps/other programs like it and up incentives for joining them.

The cool thing about these programs is they don't force you to do anything really. You can quit at any time. The only penalty for quitting is that you don't get all your school money or whatever else incentive for joining.

2. The thing about modern day volunteering and community service is your ability to better yourself. One of the reasons why I got money to finish high school and got into college was for my service at the local Boys and Girls Clubs and soup kitchens, etc. It was a great thing to put on applications for summer jobs, too. What I did isn't special and it's not restricted to the upper middle class. Anyone has the opportunity to volunteer for whatever. There is a very significant benefit to those who do. Some choose not to and that's fine but those who do can bring in some benefit beyond any psychological positivity

while this is cool and all, i highly doubt you put in as many hours as a normal Americorp volunteer does. it's a different kind of volunteer work and they do a lot more.

. You can tell young people "hey, you should volunteer because its good for applications and it'll help you with blahblahblah" this is fine... but to say everyone has to volunteer, diminishes incentive for people to do it. "Oh you volunteered for 6 months when you were 18? So did the other 20,000 kids that just applied..." People should volunteer but they should do it because it's a good thing for them to do and those who do it should get benefited over those who choose not to...

Not really, since the ratio of people that do volunteer in relation to those who don't is so small, besides the benefits from volunteering aren't just the fact that it looks good on an application. they get job training which makes them have more job skills. they also get a ton of financial aid for college. even if your scenario was logical, which its clearly not in the real world, those who volunteer are still going to get benefitted over people that don't. I mean, I get grants to go to college and I didn't volunteer that much. The friend I referred to earlier is going to get double the grants I do when she goes back to school. That seems like a pretty big benefit.

getting a regular, good night sleep helps most people's productivity during the day... do you want to make it mandatory that everyone gets 7-10 hours of sleep a day? What else?

irrelevant, since this bill doesn't make anyone do anything.

It doesn't matter if it makes a civilian army or not

actually it does since that's the claim of the conspiracy theorists.

The fact that it gives the power to the government to allow mandatory service to american citizens is rediculous. I don't care if the bill requires me to get up from my desk right now and walk into the other room and walk back to my desk, they can not and should never be allowed to tell me to do anything unless I'm trampling over someone else's rights.

once again, this bill doesn't give the power to allow for mandatory service. all the dumbass inforwar source says is that the bills investigate whether mandatory service is possible (even if said investigation were to occur, we'd realize it's not really), but the actual bills themselves as shown in articles by people who aren't crazy don't talk about mandatory service at all. they merely properly fund our current volunteer programs so that they're more useful, as well as give people more incentives to join them.

that is completely different than the government telling us we have to volunteer. if the bill actually said what you guys say it does, i'd be the first person critcizing it (hence my post saying we should condemn things like how the government is probably going to reauthorize the PATRIOT act). Most of the threads I've started in the politics forum have been about government abuse of powers. But that isn't what we're talking about.

How's this a conspiracy theory? The bill exists and it was passed and they are going to try do this. Yeah there is a lot of messed up stuff going on but eventually you have to stop saying "oh whatever, this bill doesn't do this or that it only gives the government more power blahblahblah" and start getting mad and start doing something. But if your going to do something, do it because you're a free thinking individual and you have some common sense, don't do it because some guy is making you.

This is conspiracy theory because the bill doesn't fucking say what you guys say it does. It doesn't give the government more power at all. That is the problem with your stupid fucking conspiracies. You guys start off with an unverfiable claim: that Obama is the a puppet for some nefarious regime, and then twist things happening in the real world to fit that claim, like these bills. The problem is when you twist the things happening in reality, you get situations like this where you claim bills do things that they simply don't do.

The problem with you guys being idiots is that you make real activists who are actually fighting government power look bad. Why is it that we haven't been able to get rid of the PATRIOT act? Not enough public outrage about it. Why haven't we seen enough outrage? Because people like you have made people like me look like crazy conspiracy theorists when we talk about things that government can actually do. You guys play right into the hands of those who would subjugate us.

Even if there was a great threat of our country turning into a fascist state, nobody would stop it because people like you make the people who would convince us to stop fascism look like crazy people.

[Nevuk]

Seriously guys, if you want to get all riled up about government control and issues of power awesome! but let's so it about something that's real, like major corporations and their roles in globalization or neoliberalism's power over the developing world. There's too much fucked up stuff actually happening to waste our time with asinine conspiracy theories.
Yes. These conspiracy groups puzzle me greatly, because they frequently contribute to the problems they are pointing out by distracting people from real things.
(loose change - why does it matter if Bush blew up the twin towers? Nothing will change, it's entirely unprovable)

[x togepi x]

Yes. These conspiracy groups puzzle me greatly, because they frequently contribute to the problems they are pointing out by distracting people from real things.
(loose change - why does it matter if Bush blew up the twin towers? Nothing will change, it's entirely unprovable)

it pisses me off because one can make really great arguments, founded in reality, about how major corporations have way too much power (among other things) but because of assholes like alex jones, those claims get ignored by most people as conspiracy theory.

people buying into this really are examples of useful idiots. i actually read somewhere, on another conspiracy theory website* that Alex Jones is a government agent meant to keep us from finding the REAL TRUTH haha.

*my roommate and i think these things are hilarious.

[FormerClarity]

I just commend you people for taking the time to write such arguments online.

[lfdfforever]

I just commend you people for taking the time to write such arguments online.big waste of time

[FormerClarity]

Mhmm.


/Sarcasm

[lfdfforever]

Sarcasm is a big waste of time to, when online.

[touchofgrey04]

i watched the documentary and found it pretty interesting to entertain the idea that there might be [some] truth to [some of] it. its worth watching if you keep in mind that there is some middle ground between a delusional conspiracy theorist and a harbinger of absolute truth. those of you who habitually dismiss ideas off the bat without lending an ear first, all because they dont adhere to your political ideation, are fools. its pretty unwise to form an opinion that way. i dont care how smart you think you are, nobody is so informed that they get to distinguish unconditional fact from fiction, especially in this country. generally, if someone actually does some research and learns a few things, they might be worth listening to. you shouldnt always piss off at the idea that the government might just be tossing around some bullshit and you werent told about it. i think that at this point, if someones a bit paranoid over a new president, they might be onto something. its important to question even the most beloved people. thats how you avoid getting teabagged for another 4-8 years.

in my opinion, this documentary gets a little inaccurate at points. however, it is true that the president does play a less powerful role in government than most people realize, and that he does have to answer to faces that might not necessarily show up on magazine covers and news programs. its not uncommon for a third party to have the federal government by the balls once in a while. the title "the obama deception" is actually a bit deceptive itself, as the documentary as a whole is not specifically about obama, although the cliche cheapshots are all in full form here, from the spooky phantom of the opera music to the glowing demon eyes photoshopped on a politicians face. but all in all, it was entertaining and had some fun things to think about. i enjoyed it.

[lfdfforever]

waiting for x togepi x to respond with about 6 paragraphs

[saysmydoctor]

Are you mad that you can't compose six paragraphs of intelligent rebuttal?

[saysmydoctor]

I don't see how people are saying Lauren is the reason the politics forum is a "hate filled shithole." She stopped posting there for a decent amount of time, just recently started getting back into posting and has not been attacking people hardly are all.

Sean is really the only one that will consistently attack people.
Hey.

[loveisdead]

Hey.
It's true haha.

[Mitch]

Wait, people here don't like Lauren now?

[saysmydoctor]

It's true haha.
I've gotten better.

[Sventhegreat]

http://www.infowars.com/house-passes-mandatory-national-service-bill/

What the fuck?

[loveisdead]

I've gotten better.
It isn't election season and Shady has been absent. You'll come around.

[xshady121]

It isn't election season and Shady has been absent. You'll come around.

No I haven't? I've been here every day.

There just hasn't been much to talk about.

[Adeniz19]

i didnt realize lauren had such a bad rep outside of this forum haha

[loveisdead]

No I haven't? I've been here every day.

There just hasn't been much to talk about.
You haven't been posting in here. Hence you and Sean not fighting.

[loveisdead]

i didnt realize lauren had such a bad rep outside of this forum haha
Same here. I have no idea why.

[xshady121]

You haven't been posting in here. Hence you and Sean not fighting.

That's because I've been banned from the General politics thread, and I really have no interest in the other topics in the politics forum. I've been lurking around the sports forum, things are alot more calm there. It's even made me realize JC is a funny person, definitly one of my favorite posters here.

[xshady121]

i didnt realize lauren had such a bad rep outside of this forum haha

Yeah, she does. She comes off as arrogant. That's why many people don't like her..

Like George Bush.

[loveisdead]

That's because I've been banned from the General politics thread, and I really have no interest in the other topics in the politics forum. I've been lurking around the sports forum, things are alot more calm there. It's even made me realize JC is a funny person, definitly one of my favorite posters here.
Didn't know you got banned from there. Yeah, JC is a really good guy.

[xshady121]

Didn't know you got banned from there. Yeah, JC is a really good guy.

Yeah, neither did I. It came at a time where I hadn't posted there in like a week, so it's not like I did anything too out of the ordinary.

Whatever though.

[zion the lion]

That's because I've been banned from the General politics thread, and I really have no interest in the other topics in the politics forum. I've been lurking around the sports forum, things are alot more calm there. It's even made me realize JC is a funny person, definitly one of my favorite posters here.

Time out...you can get banned from certain threads? or you just decided not to go in there anymore.

[xshady121]

Time out...you can get banned from certain threads? or you just decided not to go in there anymore.

Yes, you can. a big error message shows up when you go to view it.

It beats the alternative though.

[lfdfforever]

Are you mad that you can't compose six paragraphs of intelligent rebuttal? not exactly

[saysmydoctor]

not exactly
Then what is the problem with him typing out six paragraphs? Your ignorant remarks in here hardly call for an intelligent response.

[lfdfforever]

Then what is the problem with him typing out six paragraphs? Your ignorant remarks in here hardly call for an intelligent response. it just seems like a big waste of time

[x togepi x]

waiting for x togepi x to respond with about 6 paragraphs

so wait, you watching stupid fucking documentaries by hack job artists like alex jones is a good use of time, but responding to people like you spouting complete bullshit is a waste of time?

i'm sorry that you can't be bothered to read more than one line in response to conspiracy theory. it just really pisses me off that people like you piss all over people who take large portions of their life to volunteer for things like Americorps, which Alex Jones makes out to be some Hitler Youth-esque program for Obama.

[lfdfforever]

so wait, you watching stupid fucking documentaries by hack job artists like alex jones is a good use of time, but responding to people like you spouting complete bullshit is a waste of time?

i'm sorry that you can't be bothered to read more than one line in response to conspiracy theory. it just really pisses me off that people like you piss all over people who take large portions of their life to volunteer for things like Americorps, which Alex Jones makes out to be some Hitler Youth-esque program for Obama. i'll believe him before i believe in some random dude off ap.net, but alex to me gets to riled up for his own good sometimes.

[saysmydoctor]

If you can't counter the facts, when in doubt, counter the source. Great argumentation tactic.

[lfdfforever]

If you can't counter the facts, when in doubt, counter the source. Great argumentation tactic. this isn't a argument silly goose

[J.C.]

laurened'em

[loveisdead]

I miss the term Krugman'd

[x togepi x]

i'll believe him before i believe in some random dude off ap.net, but alex to me gets to riled up for his own good sometimes.

but I have just as much, if not more credibility than Alex Jones.

What do i need for you to believe me, videos of me on youtube yelling at people through a bullhorn?
badly done documentaries with scary music?
a pathetic excuse for a website?

[lfdfforever]

but I have just as much, if not more credibility than Alex Jones.

What do i need for you to believe me, videos of me on youtube yelling at people through a bullhorn?
badly done documentaries with scary music?
a pathetic excuse for a website? that would help hahaha

[saysmydoctor]

that would help hahaha
DON'T FEED THE TROLL.
x