Tom Brady named SI's Sportsman of the year

[yeat182]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/magazine/specials/sportsman/2005/12/02/brady/index.html

[getupkid53]

I saw that, some of the writers on SI.com made a really great argument for warrick dunn. I have tons of respect for him. He was the best argument I read out of everyone's nomination for any sport.

[mikeford]

warrick dunn does a ton of charity work... really standup dude.

[Katie Schmitz]

I would've chosen someone else; but that's just me.

[LeftWideOpen]

I think he's been the face of the athletic world for the past year. I woulda gone with either him or Lebron, but Brady was due. The guy was the QB for a team that won 3 Super Bowls in 4 years.

[justinevans]

Tom Brady should not be the sportsman of the year.

off the field he is just another cocky jackass. so his team won?

[yeat182]

off the field he is just another cocky jackass. so his team won?

how would you know?

[aminorthreat55]

Tom Brady should not be the sportsman of the year.

off the field he is just another cocky jackass. so his team won?
Didn't he say he was tired of everyone praising him and that he's just another guy who downloads internet porn?

[justinevans]

how would you know?

just by listening and reading the things he's said. wasn't he the one bitching about foreignors or something.

[yeat182]

just by listening and reading the things he's said. wasn't he the one bitching about foreignors or something.

you're joking right?

[justinevans]

you're joking right?

why should he be sportsman of the year?

[yeat182]

why should he be sportsman of the year?

why shouldn't he?

[Jesse2]

let's hear from someone outside of the boston area on why he should be sportsman of the year.

[Drew Beringer]

Didn't he say he was tired of everyone praising him and that he's just another guy who downloads internet porn?

Yeah, I think so.

[justinevans]

why shouldn't he?

Because he hasn't done anything more than win something with his team. and he played what 3 games in 2005 for them to account for?

they are 7-5 right now.

[yeat182]

Because he hasn't done anything more than win something with his team. and he played what 3 games in 2005 for them to account for?

they are 7-5 right now.

they'd be 0-11 without him this year, he's the only reason they are going to make the playoffs. and he's played 15 games so far this year, 3 playoff games and the 12 games this season, so they have plenty to account for. just read the article, peter king gives you the reasons why they voted for him.

[justinevans]

they'd be 0-11 without him this year, he's the only reason they are going to make the playoffs. and he's played 15 games so far this year, 3 playoff games and the 12 games this season, so they have plenty to account for. just read the article, peter king gives you the reasons why they voted for him.

this is why

Miami 5-7
Buffalo 5-7
Jets 2-10.

Someone has to win. 5 of there 7 wins: Oakland, Buffalo, Miami, New Orleans, New York Jets.

[Vanity__Dearest]

this isn't about his sports numbers. it's more about charity and the way he handles himself...yeat, you may be a pats fan, and i don't mind them...but this has nothing to do with how he handles himself on a field.

[hockey0001]

just by listening and reading the things he's said. wasn't he the one bitching about foreignors or something.

Im pretty sure that wasnt him.

[btbam > you]

this isn't about his sports numbers. it's more about charity and the way he handles himself...yeat, you may be a pats fan, and i don't mind them...but this has nothing to do with how he handles himself on a field.



exactly.

[commatosa]

all they talk about are things he's done in previous years. Isn't it called Sportsman of the Year? Or are they just selecting a random year...cause he hasn't been that great this year....definitely not the best sportsman of this year....definitely not. A little overrated if you ask me.

[Doug]

it's really annoying how much people hate the patriots on this board, only 3 of their 7 victories so far have been against their division.. so that really can't be much of an argument. you somehow forgot to mention that the pats beat the steelers and the falcons, and their losses are to the colts, panthers, broncos, chargers and chiefs, all playoff contenders. they're 7-5 cause of brady.

i realize that sportsman of the year is for off the field behavior. not really sure if he deserves this, i think he does a decent amount of charity work.

[aminorthreat55]

this isn't about his sports numbers. it's more about charity and the way he handles himself...yeat, you may be a pats fan, and i don't mind them...but this has nothing to do with how he handles himself on a field.
Exactly. This is sportsman of the year, not athlete of the year. There's a difference.

[getupkid53]

They didn't mention anything on SI.com about his off field contributions. Just that he was a good on the field leader dedicated to winning. I think Tom Brady displays an excellent air of sportsmanship, as far as football goes. He has a great work ethic, is always positive, congratulatory, and the essence of the tough man. I'm assuming they are giving it to him for his on field conduct.

[Doug]

i'd agree that his on the field sportsmanship would do it

[yeat182]

this is why

Miami 5-7
Buffalo 5-7
Jets 2-10.

Someone has to win. 5 of there 7 wins: Oakland, Buffalo, Miami, New Orleans, New York Jets.

you can't leave out pittsburg and atlanta.

[yeat182]

this isn't about his sports numbers. it's more about charity and the way he handles himself...yeat, you may be a pats fan, and i don't mind them...but this has nothing to do with how he handles himself on a field.

i'm just going by what Peter King wrote in the article as his reasons for voting for him, and why he won.

[hockey0001]

it's really annoying how much people hate the patriots on this board, only 3 of their 7 victories so far have been against their division.. so that really can't be much of an argument. you somehow forgot to mention that the pats beat the steelers and the falcons, and their losses are to the colts, panthers, broncos, chargers and chiefs, all playoff contenders. they're 7-5 cause of brady.

i realize that sportsman of the year is for off the field behavior. not really sure if he deserves this, i think he does a decent amount of charity work.

It's not just this board where people hate the Patriots, its pretty much every message board that talks football has a large portion that hates the Patriots.

[Doug]

true, we're the yankees of football these days

[yeat182]

true, we're the yankees of football these days

except we don't buy a team of all stars every year.

[mikeford]

true, we're the yankees of football these days

oof.:shake:

[Doug]

yeah, i mean, we're not, but that's how we're perceived

[mat1419]

Its a good choice...there aren't many better role models or people in sports. Especially ones that have accomplished what he has. At least it's not Lance Armstrong again.

[justinevans]

you can't leave out pittsburg and atlanta.

when they beat pitt they had a full team...they beat a vickless atlanta.

[Doug]

harrison and light both got hurt early in that game

[Doug]

like michael vick really helps that team win

[tpen892004]

i cant stand brady and manning

go vick

[justinevans]

like michael vick really helps that team win

look at their record with michael vick, look at their record w/o michael vick.

i hate michael vick, he is not a good quarterback, but he intimidates opposing defenses and he gets it done.

[justinevans]

i cant stand brady and manning

go vick

FUCK MICHAEL VICK!

[Doug]

i know, i was mostly joking, i just think he sucks, if he played running back, it would be a different story

[yeat182]

when they beat pitt they had a full team...they beat a vickless atlanta.

and KC, Denver, Indy, etc. beat a pats team with no Harrison, no Light, no Dillion, no Faulk, no Seymour, no Givens, no Brown, no Gay, etc. etc. etc...

[Drew Beringer]

Ron Artest should have been Sportsman Of The Year.

[Doug]

Ron Artest should have been Sportsman Of The Year.

fully backed

[justinevans]

and KC, Denver, Indy, etc. beat a pats team with no Harrison, no Light, no Dillion, no Faulk, no Seymour, no Givens, no Brown, no Gay, etc. etc. etc...

seymour missed denver and indy
dillon missed denver and kc
givens missed kc
troy brown missed denver
Gay missed KC
harrison missed them all except carolina
Faulk has been out since Pitt

if you want to talk about injuries, look @ the Eagles.

mcnabb, owens (being placed in time out), the entire offensive line except for jon runyan, jerome mcdougle was shot, akers missed much of the year, buckhalter has missed the entire season, grasmanis, sheppard, dirk johnson, j.r. reid

[justinevans]

Ron Artest should have been Sportsman Of The Year.

and michael irvin.

[mat1419]

seymour missed denver and indy
dillon missed denver and kc
givens missed kc
troy brown missed denver
Gay missed KC
harrison missed them all except carolina
Faulk has been out since Pitt

if you want to talk about injuries, look @ the Eagles.

mcnabb, owens (being placed in time out), the entire offensive line except for jon runyan, jerome mcdougle was shot, akers missed much of the year, buckhalter has missed the entire season, grasmanis, sheppard, dirk johnson, j.r. reid
i know full well how badly the Eagles injuries had destroyed the team...but the Pats are a shadow of last year. Their secondary was never really improved and for most of the season they've been using practice squad players to fill at least 1 of the 4 spots. The used their back up full back as starting running back in one game due to injuries. The whole team has been cut and paste and I think if they can get into the playoffs and get healthy, it's a credit to the coach and the quarterback more than any other year.

[hockey0001]

i know full well how badly the Eagles injuries had destroyed the team...but the Pats are a shadow of last year. Their secondary was never really improved and for most of the season they've been using practice squad players to fill at least 1 of the 4 spots. The used their back up full back as starting running back in one game due to injuries. The whole team has been cut and paste and I think if they can get into the playoffs and get healthy, it's a credit to the coach and the quarterback more than any other year.

they have also started 7 different safeties

[YouMadeTheScene]

Doesn't matter this should've gone to Roger Federrer. He dominated his entire sport for a whole year rivaling what John McEnroe did. I'm not a tennis fan but you can't dispute what he did. But a tennis star wouldn't sell magazines.

[LeftWideOpen]

i know full well how badly the Eagles injuries had destroyed the team...but the Pats are a shadow of last year. Their secondary was never really improved and for most of the season they've been using practice squad players to fill at least 1 of the 4 spots. The used their back up full back as starting running back in one game due to injuries. The whole team has been cut and paste and I think if they can get into the playoffs and get healthy, it's a credit to the coach and the quarterback more than any other year.

agreed. Those who are against the Pats are trying to use this season's team to discredit what they've done the last 4 years. They already won 3 super bowls in 4 years. That's a dynasty and that can't ever be taken away from them - regardless of this season's outcome.

[hockey0001]

agreed. Those who are against the Pats are trying to use this season's team to discredit what they've done the last 4 years. They already won 3 super bowls in 4 years. That's a dynasty and that can't ever be taken away from them - regardless of this season's outcome.

And the Pats are gonna be division champs again this year even with all the injuries they've had. Granted they play in a terrible division but its still an accomplishment.

[Doug]

seymour missed denver and indy
dillon missed denver and kc
givens missed kc
troy brown missed denver
Gay missed KC
harrison missed them all except carolina
Faulk has been out since Pitt

if you want to talk about injuries, look @ the Eagles.

mcnabb, owens (being placed in time out), the entire offensive line except for jon runyan, jerome mcdougle was shot, akers missed much of the year, buckhalter has missed the entire season, grasmanis, sheppard, dirk johnson, j.r. reid


yeah, the eagles had a lot of injuries, and they suck this year, the pats are still making the playoffs with all those injuries

[justinevans]

yeah, the eagles had a lot of injuries, and they suck this year, the pats are still making the playoffs with all those injuries

The pats still have their quarterback and top wrs and their d-line.

[Doug]

i think i meant to say that the eagles had worse injuries in my post but i forgot to

[yeat182]

seymour missed denver and indy
dillon missed denver and kc
givens missed kc
troy brown missed denver
Gay missed KC
harrison missed them all except carolina
Faulk has been out since Pitt

if you want to talk about injuries, look @ the Eagles.

mcnabb, owens (being placed in time out), the entire offensive line except for jon runyan, jerome mcdougle was shot, akers missed much of the year, buckhalter has missed the entire season, grasmanis, sheppard, dirk johnson, j.r. reid

those aren't correct.

[yeat182]

The pats still have their quarterback and top wrs and their d-line.

they haven't had their WR's or D-line all year. they were down to starting tim dwight and andre davis the other week. not to mention the fact that their starting running back, back up running back, back up back up running back were all hurt and they had to sign two guys of the street to come and start 2 games for them. plus their starting left tackle and center are gone for the year and the left side of the line is made up of rookies.

[yeat182]

also, this award isn't to the athlete with the best stats, or who is the best at his sport or who is the most successfull, its to the athelte that best epitomizes the best that sports has to offer.

[justinevans]

they haven't had their WR's or D-line all year. they were down to starting tim dwight and andre davis the other week. not to mention the fact that their starting running back, back up running back, back up back up running back were all hurt and they had to sign two guys of the street to come and start 2 games for them. plus their starting left tackle and center are gone for the year and the left side of the line is made up of rookies.

their d-line has not missed many games.

[Doug]

dude, the eagles don't have their two best players, we still have brady, let it go

[yeat182]

their d-line has not missed many games.

seymour missed 4 games

[hockey0001]

dude, the eagles don't have their two best players, we still have brady, let it go

We lost arguably our 3rd best in Harrison. Then combine that with all the other injuries we've had to our DB's, RB's, O-line, Givens, Graham.

[Doug]

but brady + belichick are the ones who have won us three championships.

[yeat182]

but brady + belichick are the ones who have won us three championships.
and vinatieri.

[Doug]

yeah

[hockey0001]

and vinatieri.

and the defense

[Doug]

that would fall under belichick

[hockey0001]

that would fall under belichick

Then technically wouldnt Brady also?

[still_life]

NE's troubles this year are there own fault for having such a poor off-season. They dumped Ty Law, they dumped Troy Brown only to bring him back later, they brought in trash, they drafted poorly, and they never got their LB corps younger, and they never improved their secondary. Who really thought Gay/Starks/Poole/Samuels/Harrison/Wilson/Scott was a legit secondary?

Tom Brady should not be sportsman of the year. Shouldn't that go to someone that's not too much of a pussy to not even shake hands with the other team after a loss?

[hockey0001]

NE's troubles this year are there own fault for having such a poor off-season. They dumped Ty Law, they dumped Troy Brown only to bring him back later, they brought in trash, they drafted poorly, and they never got their LB corps younger, and they never improved their secondary. Who really thought Gay/Starks/Poole/Samuels/Harrison/Wilson/Scott was a legit secondary?

Tom Brady should not be sportsman of the year. Shouldn't that go to someone that's not too much of a pussy to not even shake hands with the other team after a loss?

Are you seriously bringing up the hand-shaking debate?

The secondary would be better if Harrison had not got hurt. Maybe not a lot better, but still an improvement. I think the secondary play has been poor do to the lack of pass rush the D-line has generated. Up until last week they were being given very conservative play calls. They were more aggressive and performed better against the Jets ( I know, the jets suck, but i need some reason to believe the D is improving).

[Doug]

brady would not fall under belichick, drew bledsoe wasn't taking the 2001 patriots anywhere

[still_life]

The handshake debate stands, because it's a sign of poor sportsmanship, which is what he won an award for. He pouts and cries when his team is losing, and then he rips a coach like Marty who never really said anything wrong. He's cocky and spoiled.

The secondary would be better with Harrison, but I still don't see them being better than 20th in the league in pass defense. Look at the first game of the year, Moss made Harrison look silly. The secondary really wasn't that good before he went down. They don't have the talent. And if you want to bring up how they were able to do it last year, that's simple: Romeo Crennel's defense, and Mangini only having to work with the secondary rather than the whole defense like he does now.

[hockey0001]

brady would not fall under belichick, drew bledsoe wasn't taking the 2001 patriots anywhere

So the fact that Bellichick left Brady as the starter once Bledsoe was healthy has nothing to do with him. Or how bout the rumors about Brady looking better than Bledsoe in training camp and Bellichick was looking for an excuse to make him starter?

[still_life]

Who was the QB that led his team to 10 pts on the road in the AFCC in 2001? Bledsoe. Brady wasn't doing anything that day. And I'm sure Bledsoe could have did what Brady did in the SB against the Rams that year.

[Doug]

ok he took a chance on him. yes, belichick started him, doesn't take away from the fact that with any other quarterback under helm, it's questionable if they had won the three championships. belichick is a defensive minded coach.

[Doug]

you're right, drew bledsoe is the best quarterback in the league.

[hockey0001]

The handshake debate stands, because it's a sign of poor sportsmanship, which is what he won an award for. He pouts and cries when his team is losing, and then he rips a coach like Marty who never really said anything wrong. He's cocky and spoiled.

The secondary would be better with Harrison, but I still don't see them being better than 20th in the league in pass defense. Look at the first game of the year, Moss made Harrison look silly. The secondary really wasn't that good before he went down. They don't have the talent. And if you want to bring up how they were able to do it last year, that's simple: Romeo Crennel's defense, and Mangini only having to work with the secondary rather than the whole defense like he does now.

Im not gonna get into the hand-shaking debate because it has been pretty much beaten to death.

I agree that the secondary would not be much higher than 20th or so without Harrison. But 20 is much better than 31. Last year they did it also because they were getting a better pass rush. The recievers had less time to exploit the secondary and the QB had to throw before he wanted to or on the move. The linebackers were also better last year, Bruschi was Brushci and we had Ted Johnson, not monty beisel and chad brown.

[hockey0001]

Who was the QB that led his team to 10 pts on the road in the AFCC in 2001? Bledsoe. Brady wasn't doing anything that day. And I'm sure Bledsoe could have did what Brady did in the SB against the Rams that year.

Bledsoe would have included an int returned for a TD in the superbowl though.

[AshesAshes]

He wont be 9-0 in the playoffs after this season.

[Doug]

yeah, he's so bad

[still_life]

Bledsoe would have included an int returned for a TD in the superbowl though.

Not if he dinked and dunked like the 01 Patriots did all year. They needed very little from the QB position in that game. Steelers had a better defense than the Rams that year and Bledsoe didn't mess up against them.

[afk999]

He wont be 9-0 in the playoffs after this season.
he wouldnt even be in the playoffs this year is the rest of his division wasnt so terrible

[hockey0001]

ok he took a chance on him. yes, belichick started him, doesn't take away from the fact that with any other quarterback under helm, it's questionable if they had won the three championships. belichick is a defensive minded coach.

The first superbowl had less to do with Brady and more to do with Weis/Bellichick. The 2nd and 3rd ones Brady deserves more credit for, especially the Carolina game.

[still_life]

he wouldnt even be in the playoffs this year is the rest of his division wasnt so terrible

Definitely. 8-8 could win a division title.

[still_life]

Carolina is still the only playoff game I think Brady deserves a ton of credit for out of all nine.

[Doug]

i'll agree with you there, but you know, apparently drew bledsoe is the best player that's every played the game, so if bledsoe had still been on the pats, they'd probly be like 86-0 or something.

[Doug]

Carolina is still the only playoff game I think Brady deserves a ton of credit for out of all nine.

you're so right, i mean, if tommy maddox was the qb for the pats, they'd probly still have two superbowl victories.

[hockey0001]

Not if he dinked and dunked like the 01 Patriots did all year. They needed very little from the QB position in that game. Steelers had a better defense than the Rams that year and Bledsoe didn't mess up against them.

Bledsoe would have eventually screwed up, he would have tried to force something. He almost did against the Steelers, he was half-way down being sacked and threw the ball blindly into the middle-field. He really only had 1 or 2 good series in the game.

[Doug]

don't try logic on still_life, he's putting drew bledsoe up against tom brady, which obviously defies all logic

[hockey0001]

He wont be 9-0 in the playoffs after this season.

You're right, it will be 13-0...




seriously thougj, I'm hoping for a little bit of luck and that the record becomes 10-1. I hoping for a miracle and then it becomes 13-0. But unfortunately it will more than likely be 9-1.

[hockey0001]

i'll agree with you there, but you know, apparently drew bledsoe is the best player that's every played the game, so if bledsoe had still been on the pats, they'd probly be like 86-0 or something.

Not only that, we'd win every game 77-0.

[Doug]

i'm hoping for that same miracle and when brady and belichick are involved, anything can happen. sames guys who won a superbowl with fred coleman as the 2nd wide receiver.

[still_life]

don't try logic on still_life, he's putting drew bledsoe up against tom brady, which obviously defies all logic

This n00b is a moron. Do you have a single good argument on anything? It's all mindless garbage. At least show some effort.

The Tom Brady of 2001 was nothing more than a screen pass QB. Drew Bledsoe could do his job easily that year.

[mikeford]

The Snow Game

You All Forget Bradys Retarded Drive To Get The Pats In Field Goal Range

I Hate This Board Sometimes, Fuck.

[Doug]

yeah, maybe even higher, drew bledsoe is god, so he could probly stop time and score like infinity points.

[hockey0001]

don't try logic on still_life, he's putting drew bledsoe up against tom brady, which obviously defies all logic

No he just hates all things Pats related. He doesnt hate Brady, he only hates when people proclaim him as the best qb.

[Doug]

then why was drew bledsoe 1-3 in the first four games he started in 2001?

[still_life]

No dude, I do hate Brady, but I still think he's one of the top QBs in the league, just not #1.

The snow game? You mean when Brady was saved by the refs, when Troy Brown returned a punt for 37 yards, Brady barely moved the team, went incomplete pass on 1st down, incomplete pass on 2nd down, 1 yard run on 3rd down, to set up an impossible 46 yard FG in the snow, only to have Vinatieri nail it? That game?

[Doug]

No he just hates all things Pats related. He doesnt hate Brady, he only hates when people proclaim him as the best qb.

yeah, it's probly ben roethlisberger... oh wait.

[hockey0001]

Carolina is still the only playoff game I think Brady deserves a ton of credit for out of all nine.

What about the second AFCC against Pitt? Superbowl against the Eagles? Raiders game?

[hockey0001]

Definitely. 8-8 could win a division title.

Pats are lucky to be in the AFC east this year.

[mikeford]

No dude, I do hate Brady, but I still think he's one of the top QBs in the league, just not #1.

The snow game? You mean when Brady was saved by the refs, when Troy Brown returned a punt for 37 yards, Brady barely moved the team, went incomplete pass on 1st down, incomplete pass on 2nd down, 1 yard run on 3rd down, to set up an impossible 46 yard FG in the snow, only to have Vinatieri nail it? That game?

YEAH HOW ABOUT THE GAME TYING DRIVE IDIOT. YOU KNOW, WHERE HE RAN THE FUCKING TYING TD IN HIMSELF? YOU REMEMBER THAT?


youre seriously blinded by hatred. drew bledsoe can barely complete a pass in a clear day, let alone a blinding blizzard.

[Doug]

What about the second AFCC against Pitt? Superbowl against the Eagles? Raiders game?

nah, joey harrington could have won those for the pats.

[hockey0001]

No dude, I do hate Brady, but I still think he's one of the top QBs in the league, just not #1.

The snow game? You mean when Brady was saved by the refs, when Troy Brown returned a punt for 37 yards, Brady barely moved the team, went incomplete pass on 1st down, incomplete pass on 2nd down, 1 yard run on 3rd down, to set up an impossible 46 yard FG in the snow, only to have Vinatieri nail it? That game?


Alright then you hate brady. And do you like have a sheet right next you with a drive chart and recap of every NFL game? You always have specifics from whatever game anyone brings up

[still_life]

then why was drew bledsoe 1-3 in the first four games he started in 2001?

For starters, it was 0-2. I don't know why they gave up 23 pts to the Bengals, and I know they had no running game. They only lost those two games by 6 and 7 pts, so it's not like they were ever blown out there. The real blowout of the season came in Brady's second start at Miami.

[still_life]

What about the second AFCC against Pitt? Superbowl against the Eagles? Raiders game?

I think he was a product of the Pitt 04 win rather than the main reason. He hit 2 nice passes, and that was it. Come on, they forced 4 turnovers, scored a dagger TD on an INT, and never really allowed the Steelers to run all over them when it mattered. And Brady's 2nd TD was flukey as hell, Willie Williams trips on the ground and misses the tackle because of it.

Eagles SB? You mean when he fumbled in the redzone? That was another major screen pass performance, and another huge defensive day, as the defense forced 4 turnovers.

Already talked about the Snow Bowl, where all he did was dink and dunk all damn day long. He completed an impressive 19/22 on the last 3 drives to get back into the game, but he was basically dumping the ball off all game long. 312 yards on 50 some attempts? Weak. Vinatieri's kicks are and should be the plays people remember most, aside from the extremely controversial fumble/tuck.

[Doug]

you're right it was 0-2, it doesn't matter how big the loss was, bledsoe lost those games, and the year before with belichick coaching and bledsoe at qb, the pats were 5-11, with a very very similar team.

[still_life]

Alright then you hate brady. And do you like have a sheet right next you with a drive chart and recap of every NFL game? You always have specifics from whatever game anyone brings up

Pretty much.

[Doug]

He completed an impressive 19/22 on the last 3 drives to get back into the game.

He completed an impressive 19/22 on the last 3 drives to get back into the game.

He completed an impressive 19/22 on the last 3 drives to get back into the game.

He completed an impressive 19/22 on the last 3 drives to get back into the game.

that's all you needed to say

[mikeford]

are you retarded?

do you expect him to seriously throw for MORE than 300 yards in the blizzard?

like... are you serious?

did you expect Jesus to ride down on a cloud and block the field goal too?

like what the fuck.

[still_life]

I'll give a QB credit when he's not checking down just about every single pass play and getting YAC from his receivers.

[Doug]

he was 19 for 22 for a stretch barely being able to see 15 feet in front of you. i was there, i would know. were you expecting 50 yard passes in a blizzard? even 15 yard passes?

[Doug]

dude, you throw short passes in blizzards.

[mikeford]

I'll give a QB credit when he just throws bombs like peyton manning '04

basically...

[still_life]

Then why give all the credit to a QB for short passes that have a very small chance of being picked or made into big plays? Give the credit to who deserves it: Vinatieri, the defense for holding Oakland to 13, and the receivers getting YAC.

Peyton Manning didn't have to throw bombs often in 04, because he can throw the medium range passes so well, and he puts the ball on the money. Why even bring up his 04 season?

[mikeford]

dude youre seriously the most illogical person i've ever dealt with on the internet and thats saying a lot.

quarterback is about GAME MANAGEMENT.

brady makes the least mistakes of any quarterback i've ever seen.

end of story.

[still_life]

So you're saying Brady's a game manager that plays safe and tries not to make mistakes? ha

I'd love to see a stat for "least mistakes". I'm sure Brady wouldn't be first.

[Doug]

how is brady not a game manager?

[mikeford]

So you're saying Brady's a game manager that plays safe and tries not to make mistakes? ha

I'd love to see a stat for "least mistakes". I'm sure Brady wouldn't be first.

nah, i bet drew bledsoe would be first since he's youre god.

[still_life]

how is brady not a game manager?

I didn't say that. Typically a "game manager" is a title a fan wouldn't want to hear for their QB. If you're content with it, that's fine.

I don't even like Drew Bledsoe, you really bring the weakest posts ever on this forum.

[Doug]

why wouldn't a fan want a game manager who makes little mistakes and wins games as their quarterback?

[mikeford]

I didn't say that. Typically a "game manager" is a title a fan wouldn't want to hear for their QB. If you're content with it, that's fine.

I don't even like Drew Bledsoe, you really bring the weakest posts ever on this forum.

i prefer to refer to Brady as "three time superbowl champion" for his title... but whatever.

[still_life]

why wouldn't a fan want a game manager who makes little mistakes and wins games as their quarterback?

Oh my it's a trainwreck. "Game managers" do not win games. For starters, teams win games. If you have a bad defense, which NE does this year, you need more than a game manager. You need someone that can make big plays, push the ball down the field, and score many points. That's not Tom Brady. He needs that 1-6th ranked scoring defense to really be effective. He plays very well with a lead.

[still_life]

i prefer to refer to Brady as "three time superbowl champion" for his title... but whatever.

Larry Izzo's a three time SB champion too right? Like that says something. Team game.

[mikeford]

Larry Izzo's a three time SB champion too right? Like that says something. Team game.

it says a lot, actually... larry izzo is sick at what he does, thats why he makes the probowl every year for special teams dude.

[Doug]

i'm retiring from this thread because you aren't being logical. if the pats have a bad defense, and brady's "just" a game manager, how do they have a winning record? why aren't they 0-12?

[still_life]

Two people from Boston and they don't see any logic, go figure.

Larry Izzo made the Pro Bowl one time didn't he?

The Patriots are 7-5, because they have 5 wins against horrible teams that they should beat no matter what. They also beat a Vick-less Falcons team. The Steeler win came when they were still considered a legit SB threat. They haven't been able to compete with the good teams this year. In the wins, the defense makes big plays and stops, the running game has shown up sometimes, and the passing game usually showed up. But that's all against the 2-10 and 4-8 teams.

[mikeford]

Two people from Boston and they don't see any logic, go figure.

Larry Izzo made the Pro Bowl one time didn't he?

The Patriots are 7-5, because they have 5 wins against horrible teams that they should beat no matter what. They also beat a Vick-less Falcons team. The Steeler win came when they were still considered a legit SB threat. They haven't been able to compete with the good teams this year. In the wins, the defense makes big plays and stops, the running game has shown up sometimes, and the passing game usually showed up. But that's all against the 2-10 and 4-8 teams.
Izzo is a three time probowler, but thanks for playing.

and the record of the opponents didnt matter in discussing the colts, so why does it matter in talking about the patriots?

no one, at least not me, said the patriots were good.

the pats ARENT a good team this year and are basically being dragged kicking and screaming to wins by brady.

end of story.


wasnt this a thread about OFF THE FIELD character of players?

drop it.

[still_life]

The Colts have beat 4 teams with a winning record. NE has beat two, and with the way those two are playing, they'll be on their way to having 0 wins against quality teams. Of course you could eliminate the Steelers from the Colts in that case, giving them 3 wins. But they now have 3 games in a row against 8-9 win teams that they could win. NE has TB and that's it. I don't see your point. You asked why NE has a winning record, and I'm telling you it's from beating the bad teams.

More than Brady is dragging them to the playoffs, yet NE fans want to do nothing more than praise him. Funny how a certain turnover or defensive stop was usually the biggest play in every win this year.

[mikeford]

The Colts have beat 4 teams with a winning record. NE has beat two, and with the way those two are playing, they'll be on their way to having 0 wins against quality teams. Of course you could eliminate the Steelers from the Colts in that case, giving them 3 wins. But they now have 3 games in a row against 8-9 win teams that they could win. NE has TB and that's it. I don't see your point. You asked why NE has a winning record, and I'm telling you it's from beating the bad teams.

More than Brady is dragging them to the playoffs, yet NE fans want to do nothing more than praise him. Funny how a certain turnover or defensive stop was usually the biggest play in every win this year.

i didnt ask why they have a winning record, dude.


if the colts can beat the seahawks and chargers ill stop slagging them for being soft.

till then...........

[mikeford]

http://www.b9board.com/images/smiles/073.gif

[still_life]

i didnt ask why they have a winning record, dude.


if the colts can beat the seahawks and chargers ill stop slagging them for being soft.

till then...........

Sure, only until another excuse comes out.

And if Indy beats Jacksonville, they'll be 13-0 and clinch the #1 seed. They may not play SD and Seattle with their starters.

[mikeford]

Sure, only until another excuse comes out.

And if Indy beats Jacksonville, they'll be 13-0 and clinch the #1 seed. They may not play SD and Seattle with their starters.

well if they cop out on trying to go perfect they are the biggest bunch of girls ever.

[still_life]

And if Edge tears his ACL on a damp, chilly Seattle field, who's going to get the blame for having him in there? Dungy. I think the Colts should go balls out to beat the Chargers to knock them out of the playoffs. SD is not a team you'd want to see in the playoffs, because they have too many playmakers. Then I'd start pulling guys after the first series or two in the last games. I wouldn't do what Andy Reid did last year.

[hockey0001]

i didnt ask why they have a winning record, dude.


if the colts can beat the seahawks and chargers ill stop slagging them for being soft.

till then...........

So why doesnt beating the Jaguars, Bengals, and Steelers count? Bengals are better than the seahawks and at least as good at the chargers, if not better. I hate the colts as much as the next person, but face it dude, theyre rediculous

[Doug]

did you just say that bengals > seahawks bengals =/< chargers therefore chargers > seahakws?

i think that was my head exploding.

[mikeford]

plz go back and read i already explained this.

[yeat182]

The handshake debate stands, because it's a sign of poor sportsmanship, which is what he won an award for. He pouts and cries when his team is losing, and then he rips a coach like Marty who never really said anything wrong. He's cocky and spoiled.

The secondary would be better with Harrison, but I still don't see them being better than 20th in the league in pass defense. Look at the first game of the year, Moss made Harrison look silly. The secondary really wasn't that good before he went down. They don't have the talent. And if you want to bring up how they were able to do it last year, that's simple: Romeo Crennel's defense, and Mangini only having to work with the secondary rather than the whole defense like he does now.

it was the same secondary that allowed them to dominate the colts/steelers and eventually the eagles in the playoffs.

[yeat182]

Not if he dinked and dunked like the 01 Patriots did all year. They needed very little from the QB position in that game. Steelers had a better defense than the Rams that year and Bledsoe didn't mess up against them.

the steelers suck. get over it.

[yeat182]

This n00b is a moron. Do you have a single good argument on anything? It's all mindless garbage. At least show some effort.

The Tom Brady of 2001 was nothing more than a screen pass QB. Drew Bledsoe could do his job easily that year.

tom brady of 01 is roethlisberger of 04, and if you knew anything about football or the patriots you'd know that drew bledsoe can not run a west coast style of offense, his game is the vertical passing game, if you ask him to make quick decisions he throws it to the wrong team or gets sacked.

[yeat182]

Oh my it's a trainwreck. "Game managers" do not win games. For starters, teams win games. If you have a bad defense, which NE does this year, you need more than a game manager. You need someone that can make big plays, push the ball down the field, and score many points. That's not Tom Brady. He needs that 1-6th ranked scoring defense to really be effective. He plays very well with a lead.

roethlisberger is a game manager.

[yeat182]

Two people from Boston and they don't see any logic, go figure.

Larry Izzo made the Pro Bowl one time didn't he?

The Patriots are 7-5, because they have 5 wins against horrible teams that they should beat no matter what. They also beat a Vick-less Falcons team. The Steeler win came when they were still considered a legit SB threat. They haven't been able to compete with the good teams this year. In the wins, the defense makes big plays and stops, the running game has shown up sometimes, and the passing game usually showed up. But that's all against the 2-10 and 4-8 teams.

he's made it more than once, in fact he's made it 3 times.

[yeat182]

And if Edge tears his ACL on a damp, chilly Seattle field, who's going to get the blame for having him in there? Dungy. I think the Colts should go balls out to beat the Chargers to knock them out of the playoffs. SD is not a team you'd want to see in the playoffs, because they have too many playmakers. Then I'd start pulling guys after the first series or two in the last games. I wouldn't do what Andy Reid did last year.

why are you even talking about the colts, this thread is about Brady winning the Sportsman of the year, if you want to wash the colts balls, make a new thread.

[still_life]

it was the same secondary that allowed them to dominate the colts/steelers and eventually the eagles in the playoffs.

Then why are Patsies bitching about their secondary this year? That's the team's fault for leaving such a weak unit out there. They could have kept Ty Law, but chose not to. Don't praise these players for what they did last year, and then bash them for how they play this year. It's all a system, they need Crennel's defensive magic to make up for their lack of talent.

the steelers suck. get over it.

So what's that say about NE, if they can't even beat a single good team this year? They suck just as much then.

tom brady of 01 is roethlisberger of 04

No, Roethlisberger threw the ball vertically all year, and he didn't have to get 4 turnovers from his defense in the playoffs.

roethlisberger is a game manager.

Only after he makes big plays in the passing game to get a lead and then let the running game take over. Of course that formula hasn't worked recently.

[yeat182]

Then why are Patsies bitching about their secondary this year? That's the team's fault for leaving such a weak unit out there. They could have kept Ty Law, but chose not to. Don't praise these players for what they did last year, and then bash them for how they play this year. It's all a system, they need Crennel's defensive magic to make up for their lack of talent.


because only 2 of those players are playing this year.


So what's that say about NE, if they can't even beat a single good team this year? They suck just as much then.

they beat atlanta



No, Roethlisberger threw the ball vertically all year, and he didn't have to get 4 turnovers from his defense in the playoffs.

roethlisberger threw the ball about 15 times a game. they didn't trust him to throw it 40 times like last week. the defense and the running game is what allowed them to win and had he gotten 4 turnovers from his defense he may have won.



Only after he makes big plays in the passing game to get a lead and then let the running game take over. Of course that formula hasn't worked recently.

see above.
[

[still_life]

NE's secondary, with or without Harrison, is not that good. It's the team's fault, not just injuries. They put crap out there.

Atlanta's on their way out of the playoff race, and they beat them without Vick. They're a different team with Vick there.

Roethlisberger averaged over 20 pass attempts. When you're near the top of the league in yards per attempt, you can run the ball, and you can play defense, you don't need to throw it 40 times every week. Most teams would love not having to throw it even 30 times. Take a look at win loss records when teams throw the ball 25 times or less. It correlates to success.

[cuetheflames]

boooo.

[yeat182]

NE's secondary, with or without Harrison, is not that good. It's the team's fault, not just injuries. They put crap out there.

samuels, gay, wilson, and harrison and troy brown were good enough to win the superbowl. samuels, wilson , 7 different strong safties, and 5 different CB's are a different story.

Atlanta's on their way out of the playoff race, and they beat them without Vick. They're a different team with Vick there.

and the colts beat the pats without harrison, light, faulk, gay, scott, scott, pass, seymour...



Roethlisberger averaged over 20 pass attempts. When you're near the top of the league in yards per attempt, you can run the ball, and you can play defense, you don't need to throw it 40 times every week. Most teams would love not having to throw it even 30 times. Take a look at win loss records when teams throw the ball 25 times or less. It correlates to success.

he managed the game. he wasn't asked to do anything more than manage the game and let the defense and running game take care of the rest.

[Drew Beringer]

So many whiny Patriot fans.

[cuetheflames]

So many whiny Patriot fans.

im fucking sick of them if you ask me.

the patriots that is.

[still_life]

samuels, gay, wilson, and harrison and troy brown were good enough to win the superbowl. samuels, wilson , 7 different strong safties, and 5 different CB's are a different story.

Romeo Crennel. Simple as that. Belichick is a weak coach without him and Weis. He was run out of Cleveland, and he's often looked confused this year.

and the colts beat the pats without harrison, light, faulk, gay, scott, scott, pass, seymour...

So what?

he managed the game. he wasn't asked to do anything more than manage the game and let the defense and running game take care of the rest.

Is that why he had 5 game winning drives in the 4th quarter/OT, led the league in passer rating in the 4th quarter last year, led the league in completion percentage in close games, and had the highest percentage of passing yardage in the first half for a team last year?

[yeat182]

Romeo Crennel. Simple as that. Belichick is a weak coach without him and Weis. He was run out of Cleveland, and he's often looked confused this year.

you are an idiot. crenel coached with belechick in cleveland.



So what?

so you can't use injuries to prove your point then ignore them when someone else brings them up.



Is that why he had 5 game winning drives in the 4th quarter/OT, led the league in passer rating in the 4th quarter last year, led the league in completion percentage in close games, and had the highest percentage of passing yardage in the first half for a team last year?

acutally, it is the reason he led the league in completion percentage and rating, because he hardly threw the ball.

[still_life]

Why can't you even spell Crennel and Belichick? Doesn't Crennel have more Super Bowl rings than Belichick too? The guy knows defense very well. Cleveland's not ranked that bad in points allowed this year.

so you can't use injuries to prove your point then ignore them when someone else brings them up.

Michael Vick is a bigger injury than any of the guys you named, plus it was the one game he missed all year. I don't like the guy, but there's no doubt they often win when he's there, and they run the ball better.

acutally, it is the reason he led the league in completion percentage and rating, because he hardly threw the ball.

He didn't lead in either, just near the top. Attempts didn't matter, he threw the ball down the field. He had the third highest YPA ever for a rookie. He wasn't dinking and dunking all year like a scared young QB normally would.

[Caleb Cattivera]

Why can't you even spell Crennel and Belichick? Doesn't Crennel have more Super Bowl rings than Belichick too? The guy knows defense very well. Cleveland's not ranked that bad in points allowed this year.



Michael Vick is a bigger injury than any of the guys you named, plus it was the one game he missed all year. I don't like the guy, but there's no doubt they often win when he's there, and they run the ball better.



He didn't lead in either, just near the top. Attempts didn't matter, he threw the ball down the field. He had the third highest YPA ever for a rookie. He wasn't dinking and dunking all year like a scared young QB normally would.

yeat...you've been pwned. give up. your arguments against still_life are useless. he's the king of the nfl threads.

[yeat182]

Why can't you even spell Crennel and Belichick? Doesn't Crennel have more Super Bowl rings than Belichick too? The guy knows defense very well. Cleveland's not ranked that bad in points allowed this year.

forget my spelling error. you still can't admit you are mistaken about crennel and belichick.



Michael Vick is a bigger injury than any of the guys you named, plus it was the one game he missed all year. I don't like the guy, but there's no doubt they often win when he's there, and they run the ball better.

he may be bigger than any one of those injuries, but not all of them. and they throw the ball better when he's not in the game.



He didn't lead in either, just near the top. Attempts didn't matter, he threw the ball down the field. He had the third highest YPA ever for a rookie. He wasn't dinking and dunking all year like a scared young QB normally would.

you said he led in both in the 4th quarter/close games, that was what i was responding to. he didn't dink and dunk because they ran the ball 70% of the time. the only time he threw was on the third and long and other long yardage situations so the stats are skewed.

i love how you make a point that is completly disproven and then you can't forumulate a legitimate response so you find some minor error (ie. spelling) and try to make yourself look better. good job.

[mikeford]

apparently this dude either has a vendetta against brady, or the west coast offense, or both.

what do you think the west coast offense is, if not dinking and dunking?

and for the record, brady has a good medium range game to troy brown, and the 2 tight ends.

[yeat182]

apparently this dude either has a vendetta against brady, or the west coast offense, or both.

what do you think the west coast offense is, if not dinking and dunking?

and for the record, brady has a good medium range game to troy brown, and the 2 tight ends.

brady has a better vertical game than roethlisberger too. as of a week or two ago he led the league with passes over 20 yards.

[still_life]

forget my spelling error. you still can't admit you are mistaken about crennel and belichick.

Mistaken about what? That Belichick's defense isn't much without Crennel? That's definitely true.

may be bigger than any one of those injuries, but not all of them. and they throw the ball better when he's not in the game.

It doesn't matter if they throw it better, Michael Vick is by far the most important player to his team. He can run and throw, while Schaub just throws. Those big running plays continue drives. And they needed a big rushing game that day to keep their defense off the field.

you said he led in both in the 4th quarter/close games, that was what i was responding to. he didn't dink and dunk because they ran the ball 70% of the time. the only time he threw was on the third and long and other long yardage situations so the stats are skewed.

i love how you make a point that is completly disproven and then you can't forumulate a legitimate response so you find some minor error (ie. spelling) and try to make yourself look better. good job.

They ran the ball about 61% of the time, because they often had the lead. Find me a team that had almost 60% of their total passing yardage in the first half, and almost 60% of their rushing yardage in the second half. NE is the next closest, because oh yeah, they were 14-2. Teams that win a lot run the ball in the second half with a lead. And he had his most yardage on 1st down throws last year. YPA on 2nd down: 8.50 YPA on 3rd down: 8.51 YPA. Not misleading at all, he was good at throwing the ball down the field.

apparently this dude either has a vendetta against brady, or the west coast offense, or both.

what do you think the west coast offense is, if not dinking and dunking?

and for the record, brady has a good medium range game to troy brown, and the 2 tight ends.

I don't like the WCO, but you'll also find that no team will say they're running the WCO, but an advanced version of it.

brady has a better vertical game than roethlisberger too. as of a week or two ago he led the league with passes over 20 yards.

Not before Ben's first injury this year, when he was like 4/4 on balls thrown 30+ yards. They haven't been able to go deep well since. And that's a pretty misleading stat. Pass plays of 20 yards are not the same as passes thrown over 20 yards in the air. Roethlisberger is 9/24. Brady's 14/56 on those throws this year. Carson Palmer is 16/37. Trent Green is 15/29. Those are just two examples of people completing more deep passes and with less attempts than Brady this year.