[Zeran]

Originally Posted by birdman

They voted for it didn't they? Are you saying that the Democrats, holy masters of integrity and protectors of the everyman, vote for bills they don't agree with for political purposes?

can you fuck off?

[tkamB]

Originally Posted by birdman

They voted for it didn't they? Are you saying that the Democrats, holy masters of integrity and protectors of the everyman, vote for bills they don't agree with for political purposes?

Compromise: Noun, An agreement or a settlement of a dispute that is reached by each side making concessions. I thought I'd help you out.

[birdman]

Originally Posted by FScott

He's a politician, he must compromise if it means responsive government; you have this we'll have that. To be fair most of the compromises Obama made have been pretty half ass, but thats a promise made by divided government. And your right, the stimulus could have been far more effective in its implementation.

I know most everyone on this forum fucking hates me. But FScott sparked a light bulb in my head.

We all want the same thing here, equal rights, good paying jobs, opportunity, education etc... all that good stuff. Democrats think you get those things by taking path A, and Republicans think you get those things by taking path B.

To all the liberals that hate me here, for all of your supposed open-mindedness, you fail to see why someone would think that taking path B is the best option. At the end of the day, all of these politicians are the same. There isn't an aggressive enough voting base to get any real change, so we end up with the same guy over and over. If Gore had been elected in 2000 and McCain in 2008, we would be in the exact same spot we are now plus or minus a few insignificant details.

There are not enough Jon Huntsmans or Bill Clintons, people who are reasonable and level headed. All we get is fighting against two sides of the same coin. There are issues like gay marriage, education and abortion that I stand with Democrats on, and I stand with Republicans on lower taxes, states rights, and small government.

The reason I get into so many arguments on this board is because I see all of this vitriolic hatred towards the Republicans, and unabashed admiration for the Democrats. I am trying to point out that ALL of them are scummy and the less the have to do with my life the better.

So calm down with the name calling, it makes you sound stupid.

Thanks FScott.

[birdman]

Originally Posted by Zeran

can you fuck off?

Another "open minded" liberal who can't handle someone not agreeing with them.

[Zeran]

you were trolling.

[David87]

People here don't have unabashed admiration for the Democrats. That is something that exists only in your own head. You mistake our disgust with the often vile policies and stances of the Republican party as some sort of love for the Democrats. I don't love most Democratic politicians...a politician is a politician, regardless of political party. What the Democratic platform is supposed to be is what I generally believe in...not the politicians who often pervert that platform, or flat out abandon it in some cases, for political gain.

This idea that we love Democrats is an idea that you've made up about us...kind of like the GOP saying Obama wants to raise "your" taxes.

[jawstheme]

Originally Posted by FScott

He's a politician, he must compromise if it means responsive government; you have this we'll have that. To be fair most of the compromises Obama made have been pretty half ass, but thats a promise made by divided government. And your right, the stimulus could have been far more effective in its implementation.

This is true, but it is also not what voters thought when we were getting Obama. We thought that at least on some issues he was going to fight. Letting the Bush tax extensions expire was one of those issues.
I'm too critical of Obama because I am one of the idiots that voted for the hope and change. If I could remove myself from that he has done an ok/regular american politician job. But I expected more.

[tkamB]

I find it funny that conservatives have now suddenly began praising Clinton since he was more liberal, at least in his policy, and nearly as polarizing.

[J.C.]

Originally Posted by birdman

To all the liberals that hate me here, for all of your supposed open-mindedness, you fail to see why someone would think that taking path B is the best option.

This has nothing to do with conservative vs. liberal ideology, this has to do with you being impervious to reason. I tolerated you for a very long time and it wasn't the fact that you're conservative that led to me blocking you, it was that you don't process logic. You've spent countless time on this forum arguing about a perceived unwillingness of Obama to compromise in order to be effective as a governor. You're now chastising Obama for having compromised on a Bush tax cut extension right after suffering substantial losses in the midterms. The issue isn't that you're conservative, it's that you're unreasonable.

[FScott]

Originally Posted by jawstheme

This is true, but it is also not what voters thought when we were getting Obama. We thought that at least on some issues he was going to fight. Letting the Bush tax extensions expire was one of those issues.
I'm too critical of Obama because I am one of the idiots that voted for the hope and change. If I could remove myself from that he has done a ok/regular job. He just hasn't been bad. But I expected more.

I am disappointed too, however if you look at it from an economic stand point it does make sense to keep taxes low until growth starts to pick up (which we have been seeing steadily). Don't forget when Obama came into office he had two wars, massive bank failure, a housing bust, a downed auto industry and a 1.8 trillion deficit to deal with. I'm surprised (especially if you compare our situation with the Japanese malaise) that our economy is doing half as good as what it is. I really wanted Obama to save the day but the reality of American politics woke me up.

[Zeran]

Originally Posted by tkamB

I find it funny that conservatives have now suddenly began praising Clinton since he was more liberal, at least in his policy, and nearly as polarizing.

i'm skeptical of that chart. i think clinton was more conservative than obama, atleast in the policies he enacted. fiscally, he reformed welfare in a right-wing manner, de-regulated wall street, the whole "big government is over" deal, etc. clinton did raise taxes but he had the benefit of a democratic congress and a non-completely-insane republican party.

Originally Posted by FScott

I am disappointed too, however if you look at it from an economic stand point it does make sense to keep taxes low until growth starts to pick up (which we have been seeing steadily). Don't forget when Obama came into office he had two wars, massive bank failure, a housing bust, a downed auto industry and a 1.8 trillion deficit to deal with. I'm surprised (especially if you compare our situation with the Japanese malaise) that our economy is doing half as good as what it is. I really wanted Obama to save the day but the reality of American politics woke me up.

obama inherited a lot of shit, true. i like how conservatives act like he's just been spending trillions of dollars because he felt like it. obama's first budget was smaller than bush's last one.

[David87]

Not to mention most of the spending that has gone on under Obama are not Obama-enacted policies...just continuances of policies that preceded him...

[birdman]

Originally Posted by J.C.

This has nothing to do with conservative vs. liberal ideology, this has to do with you being impervious to reason. I tolerated you for a very long time and it wasn't the fact that you're conservative that led to me blocking you, it was that you don't process logic. You've spent countless time on this forum arguing about a perceived unwillingness of Obama to compromise in order to be effective as a governor. You're now chastising Obama for having compromised on a Bush tax cut extension right after suffering substantial losses in the midterms. The issue isn't that you're conservative, it's that you're unreasonable.

Well, first of all it appears as though you didn't block me.

Second, I get attacked by 15 people on this board every day and I still come back. I am part of a very small minority on this board, which makes it difficult to be reasonable when everyone is calling you a moron and shit. I hope you understand that.

It seems that I can't post a simple opinion or perspective without getting BOMBARDED. You try that and tell how long it takes you to lose your train of thought.

At the end of the day, we all have different outlooks on things. I don't think it is reasonable for me to get attacked all the time for my opinions.

None of us know everything, or anything for that matter. Let's try to remember that.

[jawstheme]

Originally Posted by FScott

I am disappointed too, however if you look at it from an economic stand point it does make sense to keep taxes low until growth starts to pick up (which we have been seeing steadily). Don't forget when Obama came into office he had two wars, massive bank failure, a housing bust, a downed auto industry and a 1.8 trillion deficit to deal with. I'm surprised (especially if you compare our situation with the Japanese malaise) that our economy is doing half as good as what it is. I really wanted Obama to save the day but the reality of American politics woke me up.

Haha, well I don't think any of the things you mentioned were handled particularly well. Some better than others. I have a lot of work to do or I'd give some substantive arguments, so I'll just say the cop-out "agree to disagree."

[FScott]

Originally Posted by jawstheme

Haha, well I don't think any of the things you mentioned were handled particularly well. Some better than others. I have a lot of work to do or I'd give some substantive arguments, so I'll just say the cop-out "agree to disagree."

I didn't say he handled them well, I said he had to deal with them