Originally Posted by ctmk

I do come off as one dont I?

edit: accidentally the question mark

Why don't you just leave the kid alone? You are proving to be more intolerant than the most hardcore Bible thumper. I'm guessing you aren't that old because that's no way to go through life or treat people.

Originally Posted by ctmk

I honestly don't think people are dumb if they believe in god.But it is illogical, which is the basis of faith right? The choice to believe in something without evidence? My argument was never about whether or not god exists, but about the reasoning that stems from a belief in god which I find troubling.

Right, cause when you compared believing in God to believing in a flying spaghetti monster, you definitely weren't trying to be condescending...

Originally Posted by Holly HoX!

Why don't you just leave the kid alone? You are proving to be more intolerant than the most hardcore Bible thumper. I'm guessing you aren't that old because that's no way to go through life or treat people.

Im not intolerant, he can have his beliefs and I really don't care what they are. I've said before I don't think believers are dumb. Just because I have an argumentative tone, which may come across as dickish, and may say things in ways that could be put more lightly and eloquently (which I take full responsibility for) doesn't mean I'm a troll. I was enjoying the conversation, I found it stimulating. I don't know exactly where it went off the rails but its not like I was harassing the guy, he quoted me first and I responded in kind.

Originally Posted by deadjean

Right, cause when you compared believing in God to believing in a flying spaghetti monster, you definitely weren't trying to be condescending...

I didn't compare belief in God to a flying spaghetti monster, if you look at the comments I was responding to: "..if you choose to believe it, it makes sense".
Ill put it more gently as I should have the first time. It is putting the cart before the horse. It is having a belief and then doing the logical work to support it rather than having a logical base that leads to a conclusion.

Originally Posted by ctmk

I didn't compare belief in God to a flying spaghetti monster, if you look at the comments I was responding to: "..if you choose to believe it, it makes sense".
Ill put it more gently as I should have the first time. It is putting the cart before the horse. It is having a belief and then doing the logical work to support it rather than having a logical base that leads to a conclusion.

Alright. Fair enough. Let me try to make myself more clear. My original argument, was not to prove or disprove the existence of God. So in no way was my argument supposed to prove, or support the proof of Gods existence. I was merely trying to explain what Christians actually believe when it comes to the problem of pain. SO... Understanding where i'm coming from now, I go back to my original point, which is that if God wants to give humans choice, or free will, he HAS to allow them to screw up. Does that make sense? It doesn't mean that he enjoys or is happy about murder or rape or any of the other horrible things that happen. he is sad about it just like we are. But If he eliminates pain and evil, he eliminates choice. That is why Christians believe that God will judge all people at the end. God does not ignore evil. He is only waiting to judge.