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03:18 PM on 11/20/12
#1
Gaugzilla
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Yes. The fact that listeners constantly compare every hip hop album that comes out to classics like Illmatic. Thus causing artists to strive to make "classic" albums which they ultimately fail at.

I don't think there's a whole lot of rappers out there releasing albums right now that actually strive to make something cohesive. In the end, a lot of them come out with a string of singles like 2 Chainz, Rick Ross, and Big Sean that knows their audience just wants a few songs.
03:20 PM on 11/20/12
#2
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I have no idea what you're saying.
Agreed.
03:20 PM on 11/20/12
#3
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well and just making a handful of big hits instead of a cohesive or challenging album (this goes for all genres) is easier and much more lucrative.
Also true.
03:23 PM on 11/20/12
#4
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I read that Pitchfork article, and I completely agree. I can't understand why people listen to Kendrick's album and instantly call it a classic. More than half of these people will put this album out of their personal rotation in 6 months and possibly never return to it.

Certainly there is a difference between a personal classic and a generally acclaimed "classic" record. For example, a personal classic of mine will be Saves The Day's "Stay What You Are". While this record is considered a classic within the means of music listeners who seek out the emo/punk scene, for the majority of people, it's not. I'd say something like The College Dropout is on it's way to be a worldwide "classic". Has lasting value, tracks are still played by people all over the world to this very day.

I guess you really also have to consider the fact that our generation is far more saturated with music than the generations before us, which makes it harder to push through everything we personally enjoy and find the albums that are considered gems by society as a whole.
I think they listen to it and call it a classic because it has a lot of elements of other classic albums like some wordplay, flow and lyrics similar to a Nas or Common, storytelling like, again, Nas or Kanye West and social commentary.

It's probably out of line to automatically deem it a classic, but you can't also say that and make the sweeping statement that everyone is going to put it on the shelf in a year or so. It has all the makings of something really. Time will tell.
03:29 PM on 11/20/12
#5
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I mean, as the article points out, even meek mill did it. Im arguing more about listeners calling things classics. Its tough to dissect the artists true motives and stuff

True, but I don't necessarily consider the artist's motives when I like something. Chris Cornell jumbled a bunch of words together and made "Black Hole Sun" - that doesn't make me like it any less.

Originally Posted by Stephin_DC;115617532[B
]To me a classic is a record that completely shifts the musical climate of the time. Even if the record wasn't necessarily the first album to sound like that, it for some reason (in lots of occasions it is an individual song) was the first to garner wide spread attention and shift the majority of peoples musical taste in that direction (Eg Enema, Dookie, Nevermind).[/b]

I disagree that a classic album has to make a landmark statement. Kanye West's "808s and Heartbreak" ushered in the R&B that we hear today from The Weeknd, Frank Ocean and Miguel, but it's a very flawed album that proved R&B could be dark. MBDTF was a classic, in my opinion, and really didn't change much about hip-hop.
03:37 PM on 11/20/12
#6
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My main point for bringing the artist into it stemmed from the article touching on Meek. Ive followed the dude from his bootlegged franklin mills mall mixtapes. Dreams and nightmares is a good album but it isnt a Meek album. Thats not the rapper he was before he got famous and its not the rapper he was on dreamchasers 2. He tried to do something different, thats obvious, and the writer speculates that he was trying to make what he thought was a classic. Obviously no one can know for sure, but the idea of hip hop artists trying to make classics by changing their sound is scary

It all comes down to everyone trying to compare every hip hop album/artist to the classics. No one compares the new Menzingers album to the Clash or to Zeppelin. Hip hop is too young but also too diverse to be doing that, which is why i dont get down with classics talk
Ah ok. I get what you're saying. Yea, I felt like that album was out of Meek's wheelhouse. But I blame that on Maybach Music. I'm one of those people that think they ruin everything.
03:57 PM on 11/20/12
#7
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That article (great read by the way) reminds me of this blog post. And if any album this year has been on the receiving end of the sort of hero-posturing critical acclaim that Nosnitsky writes of here, it's Channel ORANGE.
Great read. I agree with very, very little of it.
04:10 PM on 11/20/12
#8
Gaugzilla
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Yeah, no doubt that some people genuinely adore everything on that album. But for me, it misses as much as it hits and I would like to hear a more focused and concise record from Ocean. I hope his career doesn't, as that person says, plateau in pursuit of more of the same.
Yea, well we obviously don't see eye-to-eye on that either. And I don't think there's any way that he's plateauing this early anyways. He killed it on "Nostalgia" and he did a great job on "Channel Orange." The writer wanted to make a grand prediction and she did. Complete misstep on "Pyramids." Yes, the subject's been done, but the way it was framed and produced was what made it great.
04:31 PM on 11/20/12
#9
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Defined as what? Days? Weeks? Months?

Where can you say "classic" in describing it?

Yeah, I like "Pyramids" a lot. But I think her point was the same as the one made in that pitchfork article, or at least a very similar one: that calling something a classic after a week and tossing a 9.5 on an album that. quite frankly, is very far from perfect, is a damaging practice. It's easy to see how an artist's growth could get stunted in pursuit of what they have been told is masterful.

I feel like "classic" can replace the word "amazing" in this Louis CK sketch:

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