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12:02 PM on 05/30/13 
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David87
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Would you prefer that less-educated, less- skilled workers just sit around and collect government checks? Do you think someone with low skill set should receive six figures just because it would make you feel good? Can you point me in the direction of a civilized society where everyone has masters degrees and makes six figures? No? Right, there will always be low-skilled workers who make less money than high-skilled workers. In Texas they work, and in California they do not.

My argument wasn't that they should just not work instead. My argument was that Texas is not some beacon on a hill to behold. Their unemployment number looks good because they're hiring a bunch of cheap labor, and not providing them with benefits like health insurance. That's not something you should be proclaiming as "better" than California simply because the unemployment number is lower. You would think that since their employment figures are so much better, that would mean more people with access to health care and the like...but instead, a quarter of Texas's population lacks health insurance.
12:03 PM on 05/30/13 
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Jake Gyllenhaal
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If that were the case that salary would be worth nothing.

Then what was all that American Dream bullshit I was force-fed in grade school?
12:27 PM on 05/30/13 
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birdman
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My argument wasn't that they should just not work instead. My argument was that Texas is not some beacon on a hill to behold. Their unemployment number looks good because they're hiring a bunch of cheap labor, and not providing them with benefits like health insurance. That's not something you should be proclaiming as "better" than California simply because the unemployment number is lower. You would think that since their employment figures are so much better, that would mean more people with access to health care and the like...but instead, a quarter of Texas's population lacks health insurance.

They are hiring cheap labor because there are jobs in Texas to be filled. It is better than California because what you are left with is more people earning an income (and paying taxes into the system), regardless of benefits. The fact of the matter is that health care provided for by the state is paid for by the tax payers. When you put the overwhelming majority of the tax burden at the top, those people leave to places like Texas. The less taxpayers there are in California, the less money there is for the state to provide healthcare to citizens.

Along with that, the more states that are competing for businesses the way Texas is, the more the market power shifts to the employee instead of the employer. This increases wages and benefits for the talented workers as companies try to attract them.

Meanwhile, California is a complete mess. Even if their education system was top notch (it's not), those educated graduates are going to move to another state because that's where the jobs are.
12:28 PM on 05/30/13 
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birdman
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Then what was all that American Dream bullshit I was force-fed in grade school?

It's still there.

"The American Dream is still alive, it's the dreamers that have died." - I forgot who said that.
12:44 PM on 05/30/13 
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IceAge/HeatWave
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It's still there.

"The American Dream is still alive, it's the dreamers that have died." - I forgot who said that.

so do you subscribe to the idea that it is the American citizen's fault that they aren't as socially/economically mobile as other States? several countries around the world working with more progressive economic models show higher rates of opportunity for moving from one economic class to the next, as well as more opportunity to accomplish a greater "jump" from where you were born to where you wind up. i'd be interested to know what your thoughts on that.

"If you want to live the American dream, move to Denmark."- i forget, too.
12:48 PM on 05/30/13 
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kyle is hk
The Goddamn Loveliest Melody
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"The owners of this country know the truth: It's called the American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." - Georgy C
12:51 PM on 05/30/13 
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IceAge/HeatWave
Jesus rides beside me
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"The owners of this country know the truth: It's called the American dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." - Georgy C

as i read that i was listening to Mistaken for Strangers. weird.
12:55 PM on 05/30/13 
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kyle is hk
The Goddamn Loveliest Melody
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Second favorite song ever mmmmmm
01:15 PM on 05/30/13 
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lp670sv
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It's still there.

"The American Dream is still alive, it's the dreamers that have died." - I forgot who said that.
Not really, you just stated the intrinsic problem with the American Dream. In a financial system like capitalism there must always be a poor lower class in order for the middle and upper classes to exist.
02:02 PM on 05/30/13 
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David87
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They are hiring cheap labor because there are jobs in Texas to be filled. It is better than California because what you are left with is more people earning an income (and paying taxes into the system), regardless of benefits. The fact of the matter is that health care provided for by the state is paid for by the tax payers. When you put the overwhelming majority of the tax burden at the top, those people leave to places like Texas. The less taxpayers there are in California, the less money there is for the state to provide healthcare to citizens.

Along with that, the more states that are competing for businesses the way Texas is, the more the market power shifts to the employee instead of the employer. This increases wages and benefits for the talented workers as companies try to attract them.

Meanwhile, California is a complete mess. Even if their education system was top notch (it's not), those educated graduates are going to move to another state because that's where the jobs are.

Except those people "earning an income" aren't earning enough to pay their own way. Many end up getting back more than what they put into the system, both through tax credits and federal programs like SNAP. And they aren't just not getting health care provided by the state, they're not getting health care provided from their employers either. It is not a good thing when 25% of your citizens don't have access to affordable health care, whether that's Medicaid or private insurance.

The whole "race to the bottom" between states is actually somewhat of a myth, according to recent data.

I hate to burst your bubble, but California's "mess" isn't all that different from Texas' mess. They carry an extremely high debt. While Califronia holds much more debt, their citizens are also provided with a lot more.
02:13 PM on 05/30/13 
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lp670sv
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California may be in more debt, but they just erased their deficit where as Texas still has a $5 Billion deficit. Both chambers of their senate are controlled by democrats, and their governer is also a democrat. It's amazing what we can get done when we're actually allowed to DO the shit we propose
02:24 PM on 05/30/13 
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loveisdead
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Stimulus. In the past two years, according to the Austin American-Statesman, almost half of the state's job growth came in the education, health care, and government sectors. Notice a pattern? These are all sectors that depend, at least in part, on government support. And Perry has taken full advantage of public spending. He managed to fill in Texas' previous budget shortfall by taking $6.4 billion in Obama stimulus money, more than all but two governors. But that's all coming to a close: After facing a projected $27 billion deficit for 2012-2013, and with no further stimulus in sight, Perry and Republicans in Austin resorted to sweeping cuts to Medicaid and education in their most recent budget. Not only could that hurt a state where one-quarter of residents are uninsured; it also doesn't bode well for jobs.


article is a couple years old
02:25 PM on 05/30/13 
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David87
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California may be in more debt, but they just erased their deficit where as Texas still has a $5 Billion deficit. Both chambers of their senate are controlled by democrats, and their governer is also a democrat. It's amazing what we can get done when we're actually allowed to DO the shit we propose

I've seen some projections having Texas running a a surplus as well, but that too has to do with tax revenue intake through sales taxes and such. Amazing how much revenue intake has to do with lowering a deficit..
03:01 PM on 05/30/13 
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open mind
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Along with that, the more states that are competing for businesses the way Texas is, the more the market power shifts to the employee instead of the employer. This increases wages and benefits for the talented workers as companies try to attract them.
03:12 PM on 05/30/13 
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JuneJuly
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3 Westerners, including an American woman, killed fighting along-side Syrian rebels
 



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