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01:08 AM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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Not in terms of from the get go. But I have a lot of friends that I grew up with, that were fucking junkies, couldn't control themselves, and somewhere along the line, after I left town, somehow got to rehab, one, two, maybe three times, and eventually cleaned up, and all of a sudden found Jesus, or some god and post bible verses or some shit all the damn time.

My gripe, where the fuck was god when you lied, cheated, and stole to support your habit? You think that shit will grant you access to "heaven" just because you believe now? I'm sick of it. Self control is NOT god. It's something you're supposed to have been born with, and just because you went through your own personal hell, and decided to credit god with bringing you out... Fuck, I'm just really riled up about it right now.

My argument is definitely not with god. I respect all beliefs, although Christianity, and any Jesus religion are the ones I least respect, I still acknowledge their existence. But they seem to always be the ones that junkies, murderers, convicts all turn to.

I'm just sick of seeing all these people do "all the devils" work, and just think because they are sober for the first time, they're not deep inside the same person they always were. Redemption is earned, it's not just granted because you can quote a fucking bible verse.

tl;dr : I know too many "reformed" junkies that are bullshit people.

EDIT: These people don't actually do anything that deserves redemption, they LITERALLY just post bible verses about their sobriety and forgiveness... If you get sober, and actually do something to redeem your past behavior, fine, awesome. And by the way, I'm not sober, I have my vices, I was just born with self control.

EDIT 2: Also, I believe, after a certain age, you don't deserve anymore chances. These people I'm talking about are always past 21 when they "find themselves" or whatever bullshit reason they give. These are people that have been given 100 chances by their parents, teachers, friends, neighbors, etc. And all of a sudden, they find "god" and they're cool with themselves? No, you should have a deep seeded root of shame of the life you've lived. I was once a fucking shithead, but I always had my self control, and I was always self aware, and I never treated anyone else like shit due to my habits. Fuck.

DISCLAIMER: In drunk hate mode.
12:17 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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Dumb thing to be angry about. Maybe you mad because Jesus only kind of loves you.

You hit the nail on the head.
12:18 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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My oldest sister (who is 25 now) used to do so many bad shit when she was 13. We lived in Brooklyn Park, Minnesota. She would have her guy friends over when my parents were at work and steal my Dad's beer. Nights where she would sneak out to meet up with her friends and do drugs and drink. It got out of hand for a 13 year old girl. She ended up in a juvenile facility for a while, but when she got out it got worse. She would beat up my Mom and steal her car and take her friends out, played chicken one time and actually wrecked the car, and she got into drugs more heavily. My parents could not take it anymore so the whole family packed up and we moved to Georgia but she ran away a few times back to Minnesota (don't know how). Then a year later we moved to Florida and from there she cleaned up her act.

Through all of that, she did not turn to religion or claimed that it helped her.

You know, I had a similar story. Not to that extent, but when I was a younger I was a little shitmonger. Sounds like your sister just grew up, like I did. I made no excuses for my actions, and didn't ask for forgiveness, because I knew there was no forgiving the things I had done. I was ashamed of it.
12:19 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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In summary: OP is a dumb douche

Yes.

Even though 75% of people can see where I'm coming from.
12:19 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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I can see where the OP is coming from. I have a bitter taste in my mouth about people that use religion as a way of claiming that it was the solution to all their problems... and it could be the solution to yours too.

No one/thing can make someone give up an addiction. It's a personal thing and it has to come from within. I think that what some people are calling "god" is just them finding self control. They may say/think that they've found "god" and they might have, but what they've really found is the will within.

Pretty much summed up what I meant to say in a lot fewer words.
02:26 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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Ok, you say you respect Christianity. You realize that the core belief of Christianity IS redemption through simple belief and faith in Jesus, right?

Just saying that what you said contradicts itself.

To be honest I just said I respect Jesus religions so it wouldn't distract from my original points. Truthfully, I think any form of a Jesus religion is stupid and I hate their teachings. Especially after having read the old testament. People always say to disregard that, but that doesn't change the fact that it's there and that's what your religion is based on. No other religion preaches hate and intolerance more than Christianity.
06:43 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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What about Islam

or Judaism. The old testament is Jewish scripture. (I've never heard anyone say "disregard it." That was Marcion's heresy. The old covenant was abolished by Christ, which is why shellfish are no longer prohibited or whatever, but the books of the Torah are still canon and when interpreted appropriately, not literally, teach valuable lessons of faith.)

I do not hold any religion over any others. I think they are all flawed in some way or another. Islam, whilst I do not personally like it (born into a Hindu family, hating Pakistan etc) is generally a peaceful religion if interpreted correctly. But like any religion there are extremists that ruin it for everyone else. I don't even like Jews or Judaism, it's pretty hateful in itself, but if interpreted correctly can be peaceful. All religions can be the same however different they may be. This is why I didn't wanna give my input on any specific religion in general as my original post was about addicts that need to shut up about themselves.
11:24 AM on 04/20/13 
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seymourbuttes
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"the wisdom of man is the beginning of foolishness". thought that was worth saying. What I find very curious is that you seem to chastise Christianity for being intolerant, all the while portraying the very same thing toward people who believe in it. And as far as the old testament is concerned, I could crack a book on brain surgery and pretend I knew how to perform surgery, but without context and study, Id just be a dummy with a book. Food for thought.

This is exactly why I didn't want to make public my thoughts on any specific religion in general, because it distracts from my original point.
11:51 AM on 04/22/13 
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seymourbuttes
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Wow. I'm a Christian and I don't think you could be more wrong with that statement. There's a lot of f***ed up views of Christians and Christians with f***ed up views of what the actual doctrine teaches. Sadly, that's given us who "preach" a simple message of belief and love EVERYONE a bad name.

I know what you're saying but please don't make that a blanket statement on all of us Christians.

If you read, I didn't say it about CHRISTIANS, I said it about CHRISTIANITY. Unfortunately, it's not all, but a good amount of christians interpret the book clearly wrong. I'm not saying it's only christians either, it's literally every religion. But again, my views are irrelevant to the topic I originally introduced.



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