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01:05 PM on 04/19/13 
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XenoAbe
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Atlanta, Ga
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Ok, you say you respect Christianity. You realize that the core belief of Christianity IS redemption through simple belief and faith in Jesus, right?

Just saying that what you said contradicts itself.
01:09 PM on 04/19/13 
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XenoAbe
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I can see where the OP is coming from. I have a bitter taste in my mouth about people that use religion as a way of claiming that it was the solution to all their problems... and it could be the solution to yours too.

No one/thing can make someone give up an addiction. It's a personal thing and it has to come from within. I think that what some people are calling "god" is just them finding self control. They may say/think that they've found "god" and they might have, but what they've really found is the will within.
That's perfectly cool that this is your belief. However, I want to point out that those who do believe in the Christian version of God also believe that he is omnipotent and can absolutely kill someone's addiction. You can't expect people to take both sides of the fence.
01:25 PM on 04/19/13 
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suicidesaints
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That's perfectly cool that this is your belief. However, I want to point out that those who do believe in the Christian version of God also believe that he is omnipotent and can absolutely kill someone's addiction. You can't expect people to take both sides of the fence.

That's fine. I can respect that belief, but I personally don't belief that.

Honestly, I think that it's kind of a cop out to rely on some "power" to handle addiction. Whatever works, I'm cool with. I'm sure "finding God" has saved many people's lives, but I just think that people should give themselves more credit for recovering from addiction.

If God can kill the addiction, then why do the vast majority of these "recovered addicts" relapse
02:04 PM on 04/19/13 
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stuffsux00
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they get something out of religion that's similar to a drug. that feeling that everything will be ok, all is forgiven, i can be in heaven when i die... they are just substituting one drug for another. religion makes people feel okay with the life they are living because they are following that standard of what is "right". it gives them a purpose. people can't be content with the fact that we are only here because we simply ARE. if it's not ingrained into you at a young age, you'll probably pick it up as a crutch when you need it as you get older.
02:26 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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Ok, you say you respect Christianity. You realize that the core belief of Christianity IS redemption through simple belief and faith in Jesus, right?

Just saying that what you said contradicts itself.

To be honest I just said I respect Jesus religions so it wouldn't distract from my original points. Truthfully, I think any form of a Jesus religion is stupid and I hate their teachings. Especially after having read the old testament. People always say to disregard that, but that doesn't change the fact that it's there and that's what your religion is based on. No other religion preaches hate and intolerance more than Christianity.
02:30 PM on 04/19/13 
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murlCymnnub
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Нужна кухни интернет-магазинво Владивостоке , где можно взять?
03:20 PM on 04/19/13 
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Ollie McKraut
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To be honest I just said I respect Jesus religions so it wouldn't distract from my original points. Truthfully, I think any form of a Jesus religion is stupid and I hate their teachings. Especially after having read the old testament. People always say to disregard that, but that doesn't change the fact that it's there and that's what your religion is based on. No other religion preaches hate and intolerance more than Christianity.

What about Islam

or Judaism. The old testament is Jewish scripture. (I've never heard anyone say "disregard it." That was Marcion's heresy. The old covenant was abolished by Christ, which is why shellfish are no longer prohibited or whatever, but the books of the Torah are still canon and when interpreted appropriately, not literally, teach valuable lessons of faith.)
06:43 PM on 04/19/13 
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seymourbuttes
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What about Islam

or Judaism. The old testament is Jewish scripture. (I've never heard anyone say "disregard it." That was Marcion's heresy. The old covenant was abolished by Christ, which is why shellfish are no longer prohibited or whatever, but the books of the Torah are still canon and when interpreted appropriately, not literally, teach valuable lessons of faith.)

I do not hold any religion over any others. I think they are all flawed in some way or another. Islam, whilst I do not personally like it (born into a Hindu family, hating Pakistan etc) is generally a peaceful religion if interpreted correctly. But like any religion there are extremists that ruin it for everyone else. I don't even like Jews or Judaism, it's pretty hateful in itself, but if interpreted correctly can be peaceful. All religions can be the same however different they may be. This is why I didn't wanna give my input on any specific religion in general as my original post was about addicts that need to shut up about themselves.
07:47 PM on 04/19/13 
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PuxRawkPrincess
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they get something out of religion that's similar to a drug. that feeling that everything will be ok, all is forgiven, i can be in heaven when i die... they are just substituting one drug for another. religion makes people feel okay with the life they are living because they are following that standard of what is "right". it gives them a purpose. people can't be content with the fact that we are only here because we simply ARE. if it's not ingrained into you at a young age, you'll probably pick it up as a crutch when you need it as you get older.

The bolded is one of my new ways of explaining religion. I really like that.
05:08 AM on 04/20/13 
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kianacarly
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If recovering addicts want to turn to religion, I don't mind. I used to know an addict and he could never stay sober because he couldn't forgive himself. Of course that's not the sole reason for his relapses, but he had so much guilt and shame that weighed on him, that he hated himself and couldn't move past it, and he didn't think he deserved better so he didn't have much motivation to change. I don't believe all of them think they're absolved of all their past behavior because they found God, but they are just trying to find a way to live with themselves and what they've done. I still think they feel regret and shame, but at a certain point they can't let it consume them, or they will find it difficult to live their lives and get sober. Then again, I'm of the belief that getting sober is insanely difficult and nearly impossible for some if they have some major major issues, and idk I don't really look down on them for it. It can take years and a ton of tries, but if they can ultimately do it and if they find religion in the process, I mean, whatever works. I had to cut the addict I mentioned out of my life after repeated relapses, and I will never forgive some of what they did and will not speak to them again, but if they ever get sober and end up leading a normal happy life, good on them because I know it took an insane amount of hard work.


My only beef with those who have "found religion" is when they want you to find it as well. I've had a few people be a bit condescending and say, "Oh, I'm sure you'll find God some day," or, "You never know, you could accept God into your life someday," which annoys me. Do you think you're going to lose your religion or denounce God someday? No? Then screw off imo
07:30 AM on 04/20/13 
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roughcargo
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they get something out of religion that's similar to a drug. that feeling that everything will be ok, all is forgiven, i can be in heaven when i die... they are just substituting one drug for another. religion makes people feel okay with the life they are living because they are following that standard of what is "right". it gives them a purpose. people can't be content with the fact that we are only here because we simply ARE. if it's not ingrained into you at a young age, you'll probably pick it up as a crutch when you need it as you get older.
100% agree. Religion is a crutch, plain and simple.
08:16 AM on 04/20/13 
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MedicineFrmRain
With Aching Looks & Breaking Hearts
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I'm not really a religious person, but I can see why people with substance abuse problems gravitate towards a belief system.

In most branches of Christian theology, you are redeemed of your past sins the moment you turn your life over to God. This is because Jesus's death on the cross is payment for your friends' poor decisions. A lot of people honestly have a hard time living with themselves once see how messed up their past lives were and because of that it makes an ideology such as Christianity more appealing to a recovering drug addict.

A lot of drug and alcohol wellness programs do put the idea of faith out there. Sometimes if it's an inpatient program you'll have bibles or the counselor will encourage people to balance the 7 areas of wellness (which includes spirtuality). And often you'll have a "saved" former addict in a substance abuse support group. However, it is something that does work sometimes and I have seen friends who have kicked the habit because of Jesus. But both of them ended up turning into super judgmental and hateful jerks

That drives me crazy, So it was okay for you to "live in sin" and then find god, but other people arent allowed to figure it out on their own without you passing judgements on them? So hypocritical!


I have become jaded to the whole christianity thing. I was raised Lutheran until I was 13. My uncle (who volunteered EVERY WEEK for the church) came out of teh closet, and my pastor wanted to send him to some camp to (this is a direct quote) "Pray the gay away". When my uncle and grandmother refused to do that the church asked for my uncle to no longer come, But still wanted the rest of the family to come. So we all stopped going tp church. Around 21 my husbands mother "found god" and asked us to come to the easter service as a birthday present. We ended up loving the liberal approach taken by this church and starting going regularly. The church didnt speak out agaisnt gay people, they accepted all types of people into the congregation, and it seemed like a place that was fueled by love. My hubbie and I decided to get re-baptised with this church. That summer we got pregant and the amount of support and love we were shown was tremendous. Then about 1 month before I had the baby the Gay Marriage Act passed in NYS. I was elated because that gave my uncle and my mother the opportunity to marry the people they loved. Two weeks later there was a guest speaker in the church (brought in by our pastor) who talked about how it was "our job as christians" to end the abomination that is gay marriage. That we need to speak against these evils as a united community and over turn the law. It took me a few minutes to get my big pregnant ass onto my feet, and as I did i heard the "Amen" "Praise The Lord" "In Jesus' Name" echoing through the room. My husband and I walked out and never looked back. That is not the enviroment we want our son raised in. He is going to be rasied to accecpt people for who they are and love them reguardless. Those people will not be envolved in the shaping of my sons character. I dont understand how a group of people can be so judgemental, hypocritical, and narrow minded. The whole gay arguement is just ridiculous, So you are going to follow the "rules" that you like, not all of them? Because in the same book in the bible it tells you not to cut the hair at your temples, not to eat shellfish, and if you divorce to stone your wife to death. Ive lost my train of thought on how I was going to tie this all together. But at this time Im not sure what I believe in. There is not a church out there (that ive been to at least) that teaches what I believe. Im back and forth on whether I believe in God anymore. I dont believe that the man that is described in the bible had any capacity for hate at all. That jesus was teaching us all how to love one another and that the whole purpose of this life is to love and learn from each other. Alot of people are missing out on amazing experiences in this life because of some out dated hateful book that they are afraid not to follow. ugh alright yeah i have definitely missed the mark on where this was going sooooo end rant.
08:28 AM on 04/20/13 
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WordsandMusic
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To be honest I just said I respect Jesus religions so it wouldn't distract from my original points. Truthfully, I think any form of a Jesus religion is stupid and I hate their teachings. Especially after having read the old testament. People always say to disregard that, but that doesn't change the fact that it's there and that's what your religion is based on. No other religion preaches hate and intolerance more than Christianity.

"the wisdom of man is the beginning of foolishness". thought that was worth saying. What I find very curious is that you seem to chastise Christianity for being intolerant, all the while portraying the very same thing toward people who believe in it. And as far as the old testament is concerned, I could crack a book on brain surgery and pretend I knew how to perform surgery, but without context and study, Id just be a dummy with a book. Food for thought.
08:47 AM on 04/20/13 
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MedicineFrmRain
With Aching Looks & Breaking Hearts
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Upstate New York
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"the wisdom of man is the beginning of foolishness". thought that was worth saying. What I find very curious is that you seem to chastise Christianity for being intolerant, all the while portraying the very same thing toward people who believe in it. And as far as the old testament is concerned, I could crack a book on brain surgery and pretend I knew how to perform surgery, but without context and study, Id just be a dummy with a book. Food for thought.

that quote is exactlly what drives me crazy. So havig your own thoughts and opinions could now "damn you" in the eyes of god?? I hate all this blind faith BS. Anytime someone has an original thought that deviates from the norm of christianity some bible verse is thrown at them to keep them in line. A large difference in reading a book on brain surgery and the bible is that when one reads the book on brain surgery it is cut and dry. You follow the directions, you have a specific order that the precedure needs to be done etc. However when reading the bible people take different things from it. In my old bible study a group of people would read the same passage and there would be 10 different ideas of what that could mean. And as far as "context and study" is concerned ive found in MY experience that it all depends on who you are studying with. If i read a passage with an "old school" member of my church they usually had some kind of hatred and judgement to pass, "because thats the way it is" kind of way of approaching it, and if anyone tried to think outside the box or take a differet view on it they were wrong, why?? Just because thats the way it is. And just to be clear i am not chasitising christianity, im chastising some christians, people who are hypocritical and only believe when its benificial for them, But hey as long as the church is getting them to tithe then its all good.
08:56 AM on 04/20/13 
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roughcargo
i'm actually not here
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"the wisdom of man is the beginning of foolishness". thought that was worth saying. What I find very curious is that you seem to chastise Christianity for being intolerant, all the while portraying the very same thing toward people who believe in it. And as far as the old testament is concerned, I could crack a book on brain surgery and pretend I knew how to perform surgery, but without context and study, Id just be a dummy with a book. Food for thought.
The "wisdom" of man is what created Christianity in the first place, so I half agree with you.

Intolerance towards intolerance is another issue altogether. Obviously there's no hard and fast rule, because that would be an unending loop of intolerance towards itself, but here's some common sense. No one would be intolerant of Christianity if it wasn't inherently intolerant of others in the first place. Someone had to start it.



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